20 replies to this topic

[CmdrPoopyPants]

Ok.. so, I have 943 games in so far. I'm pretty good with my Raven 3L with ecm, the first mech I built. I also have a 4x with an AC/20 that I use sometimes, mostly for gags and to **** off those big lumbering mechs when they try to ignore us little guys. I've run a 2x Raven a bit, but it's squish and without ecm, I don't like it as much as the other two. .. I've also run some commandos and am just about to unlock elite there so I can tweak out the 2D (w/ecm) cause that's kind of fun, too.

Other than the lights, I have some hunchbacks that I kind of like, but they're squishy too (and I run XL engines in them to make them faster as well as more damage dealers). I have a 4SP that runs 4 MPLs with 2xsrm6s+artemis. Hits ok, but heat management can be tricky. I have a 4J that's a 30 missile lrm boat, but that's not quite enough to be -really- annoying, so I'm considering some 50 or 60 missile boats in the heavy/assault range as well. Though, I find that having opportunity to use the LRMs causes me to be slightly gimped out too often, so I dunno. I've got my 4G with 3xAC/2 and now a SPL in the head that I've had my best game to date with (615 damage for the round), and that's fun.. but again, squishy and I get into trouble with it.

So.. I'm looking at something a bit bigger.. tougher.. probably running a standard engine because I'm tired of looking at 3/4s of a mech on the ground. I've got a few builds from 'smurfy', so I'd like some opinions on what I might or might not like about running these.. as well as maybe some alternative "tough brawler" builds that aren't seriously gimped at close range (4 PPCs means death once the lights get near you, or if you can't break away from the battle to get range, etc etc). ... I want a big punch if needed, but I want to be able to seriously chew people up over the course of the fight as well. So, here are some fits I'm considering..

Stalker with a massive alpha:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...e9e970a5a8d8b1a

Has heat problems, but in theory I'm just laying down decent damage steadily and only oppening up on someone that's pretty much dead already, if need be. You know.. large lasers while I approach.. maybe tag a few lights from a tad out.. SRMs if I get behind someone and can let it cool a tad before I have to fully engage again, etc. etc. But I worry that I might be always hot because sometimes I just can't lay off the buttons

Stalker for range and up close:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7fffbf4e7fe54d3

50 LRM boat with plenty of "get off my lawn" for when lights/mediums come calling. Again, slightly heat concerned, but not as much as the 3F because you can't run LRMs (and generate heat) when things are under 180m, so that's when the lasers fire up but heat from the LRMs goes away. Just not sure if it's too spread out (too much long and short, not enough of either).

Then I have two atli I might look at. One is 10+dps sustained, pure brawler. The other replaces SRMs with lasers, since SRMs can be tricky to get to hit sometimes (at least for me, on moving targets). Both D-DC's, so streaks could work since both have ECM fitted, but that's much less punch I think.. 3 SSRMs just don't punch like 3 SRM6s.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9895b5027133719 (7dps with lasers)

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...f5e6085e657dbab (10dps with SRMs, but purely close range brawler).

Thoughts? Opinions? Other ideas for mean assed brawlers that might be fun (without gimping like 4xPPCs, etc etc)?


TIA

[Koniving]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...80b7b4c159da70c My first design for the Stalker 3-H.

The picture below was done with this build. http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a45b3b3bece629b




http://mwo.smurfy-ne...2f10bee4b18685b The previous one's successor. (I'm on Mark III with this design, this one's Mark II after a one vs one showed me that sustained non-stop DPS will always fail against burst DPS. Causing me to abandon the Mark I design in full 8-man premade matches. I occasionally use Mark I for pugging because it's an awesome money maker.)

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4bc915d8f30f63c Stalker 4-N (All around build. Great anti-light, decent brawler with a focus on high damage.)
(That 4N in action, surviving a deliberate suicide rush).



Lol @ the hint. Hm. Well, I have a few build suggestions. They're here.

Edited by Koniving, 09 February 2013 - 08:48 PM.

[CmdrPoopyPants]

Koniving, on 09 February 2013 - 06:11 PM, said:

Lol @ the hint. Hm. Well, I have a few build suggestions. I'll edit them in within an hour.

HA.. I knew you'd be one of the first ones in here

But, I confess.. I'm confused as to what "hint" you're getting at.

[Koniving]

Last time I saw you on the field was while I was in my 4 PPC stalker. Since you said you wanted to avoid that one, I took the hint.



I can't help it.

Anyway I'm working on introducing a few of my older builds. Since I've only used two stalkers, these are for those stalkers.

Can't help you with a DDC. Never owned one. Never cared to. Probably will anyway when my tutorial / information series reaches the almighty Atlai elite.

I'm currently specializing in Awesomes and Cataphracts now that my thingy on Hunchbacks is just waiting for the voice actress to read the lines and final editing.

Now the builds I'll edit in above will be actual builds I have used in the past. Some had flaws and were redesigned. But part of designing a mech is coming up with your own solutions. Who knows, you might have better solutions. It's my hope you take these as inspiration, and not point for point.

Now far as the Raven 2x Love, I offer to you the build that got me to Elite way too quick. I still own this mech, and I don't plan on surrendering it.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7f465170ed0bee4



This is the deadliest Raven 2x you've never faced. It doesn't need speed. It takes out assaults, heavies, mediums and some lights at range and while they're not looking. Laugh if you might. I mean it's just a Raven 2x. Until the little thing tears you apart it lays 10 bolts down the line at an identical projectile speed to the Gauss rifle. Each chain-fired and spaced 1.5 seconds apart in 15 seconds or less. This Raven then relocates at 90 kph before speed tweak, then attacks you again when you least expect it.

10 PPC's at 10 damage each. That's 100 damage assuming they all hit within optimum range. Afraid yet? You will be. That was 10 shots BEFORE the heat adjustment, while firing on Caustic Valley. Imagine what it could do now with the new lower heat?

I think you just unlocked the poopy brown camo paint for your pants. It's now permanently available to you.

It's okay. The look suits you.

Edited by Koniving, 09 February 2013 - 10:35 PM.

[CmdrPoopyPants]

Ah.. no, wasn't hinting. I've just read that you leave yourself in a bad spot with that build, if you happen to be the last one standing. That, and the heat.. 1 alpha and you're just about done, or so I thought.. and from watching your vid, you spent a lot of time trying to cool down

[Koniving]

That is true. And yes, with the PPCs I do spend a lot of time cooling down with the ER build. If you can take a moment or two to power down, you increase your cool down speed by approximately 1.5x. With a stalker you can easily afford that time at long range. But yes, the PPC build stalker is not a brawler. It's a mobile cannon that needs time to set up, fire, destroy planets, and cool down.

The Raven has a similar issue, but with only two the cool down time is very easy. The trick is keeping the range. Unlike the AC-20 Raven, the Raven 2x build excels on Caustic Valley as well as Frozen. It can work on forest colony. It has issues on River City. (Meanwhile the AC-20 Raven excels on River City).

Edited by Koniving, 09 February 2013 - 08:21 PM.

[CmdrPoopyPants]

Hmm.. The 3F can be configured the same as the 3H for 9dps sustained, same engine and heatsinks and 2xLPLs with 4xSRM6s. Just gives me more options to play with 4xMLs with 2xLLs or 6xMLs where the 3H doesn't fit those. The 4N is just about the same as the 3F, but it's missing 1 missile hardpoint. .. so, looks like the 3F is a good frame for all the variations and I can switch and play as needed.

And I might have to dust off the 2X and plop some PPCs on there to see how it goes .. he's already got endo from the other fits I ran, which just lets me run the 180 instead of the 170, everything else the same. I'll have to try that.. my little sniping bird.. lol

So, it looks like I'll be saving up 11m for that stalker first. Just have to decide which varient I want to play with, then go blow some **** up

Edited by CmdrPoopyPants, 09 February 2013 - 09:13 PM.

[mailin]

Cmdr, I was playing with your 2X on Smurfy. If you put in Endo-Steel, you can fit a 180XL, which would give you a bit more speed, or you could fit another dhs and a bit of armor.

[CmdrPoopyPants]

mailin, on 10 February 2013 - 02:17 AM, said:

Cmdr, I was playing with your 2X on Smurfy. If you put in Endo-Steel, you can fit a 180XL, which would give you a bit more speed, or you could fit another dhs and a bit of armor.

Yep, I came to the same conclusion.. I already have endo on my 2x, so I'm actually gonna run my xl195 I have sitting around, with near full armor instead of being so light..

edit: that is, no TAG and the extra going to engine..

Edited by CmdrPoopyPants, 10 February 2013 - 02:41 AM.

[Koniving]

Tag isn't really necessary. I use that because of bad collision meshes on MWO. For example firing from the cave entrance to their base, your shots will stick and hit an invisible wall three meters outside of the building's visible wall. I use the tag to make sure I can make the shot before I commit to it and announce my location.

The logic is: If I can tag it, I can hit it. If I can't, I'm not announcing my hiding spot.

[Cybermech]

favourite mech has to be a cat, c1,c4,a1... k2 is good but I like my jump jets.
You can use both xl and std engines with it, 260 engine that comes with it actually works quite well with fits.

but if its assaults you want to try out I'd go for the Atlas over stalker.

[CmdrPoopyPants]

Cybermech, on 10 February 2013 - 12:22 PM, said:

but if its assaults you want to try out I'd go for the Atlas over stalker.

Oh, sure.. NOW you tell me.. after I've spent my money

Saving up for the Atlas next. The 3F is OK, but I'm not liking it all that much at present, though, it's still 3m from being properly fitted. Just gonna have to keep grinding for those cbills I guess. Only question is, do I try to finish the 3F or just hit the Atlas. I guess, as long as I have the 3F already, might as well use it for a while. ... biggest problem I'm having is that pugs are a PITA with people running every which way (sometimes that's me ).

Been looking at the catapults too, but I can't seem to quite get a build that looks mean enough for my tastes. I'll have to keep looking around, as I'll be building a CAT- at some point, but it might take a few weeks.

[Koniving]

Between them I actually prefer the stalker -- I have two Stalkers, 1 Atlas, and three Awesomes now. Atlas can take more abuse, yes, add to that the arms can take almost as much abuse as the torso. But enemies will focus your ballistic then your missiles. It can be a problem.

Although when you learn how to 'catch' bullets with the Atlas's hands, heh, it will be one of the best things you've ever driven. I'm practicing how to do it with the Awesome at the moment.

[CmdrPoopyPants]

well, I have a new found appriciation for my 3F after this last fight.. 450 damage, 2 kills, 3 assists, and I went toe to toe with another stalker and burned him down (only lost 1 arm/torso in the fight, still let me do damage on my trek).

bigger engine (faster turning, etc) and more heatsinks and pulse lasers instead of regular.. and I think the 2xLPLs with 4xSRM6s is going to be a pretty good brawler (so long as I stop roaming into packs while our team is split into 4 groups )

[The Blazer of Lasers]

If you want a good mech that will cream anything and have decent agility take the Cataphract 3D. To prevent it from getting XL engined and blowing up put double heatsinks on and max out the armor on all of the torsos and arms. Then Downgrade the Ultra AC 5 to an AC 5 and add an extra ton of ammo. Then add antimissiles with one ton of ammo. Put case on all side torsos with ammo on them. Use the remaining tons to put on more double heatsinks (i have 13 on mine). This will annihilate anything at close rang as long as you keep moving and jump-jetting. It also has very good heat efficiency so feel free to blast the medium lasers as much as you need.

Weapons:

4 medium lasers with 13 double heatsinks
1 LBX AC 10 with two tons of ammo (30 shots)
1 AC 5 with two tons of ammo (60 shots)

If i remember correctly it has exactly 400 points of armor.

[RLBell]

CmdrPoopyPants, on 10 February 2013 - 01:57 PM, said:

well, I have a new found appriciation for my 3F after this last fight.. 450 damage, 2 kills, 3 assists, and I went toe to toe with another stalker and burned him down (only lost 1 arm/torso in the fight, still let me do damage on my trek).

bigger engine (faster turning, etc) and more heatsinks and pulse lasers instead of regular.. and I think the 2xLPLs with 4xSRM6s is going to be a pretty good brawler (so long as I stop roaming into packs while our team is split into 4 groups )

I have a fondness for the -3F, as it was my first mech purchase, the default weapons mix gives you something for all ranges, but it now runs with 4PPC's and 2MPL's. It is an absolute fail as a brawler, but my team sometimes wins when the enemy diverts enough non-light mechs to kill me, while my allies defeat the rest in detail. I bought a -5M just to have a center torso weapon. I kept the ERLL in the center torso and replaced the other hardpoints with SRM's and MPL's. It is a terrible sniper, but if it gets in your face you will be in a fight. As you need to unlock three variants to open up the elites, I round out the group with a -5S. The 255XL was the worst of both worlds as it is easy to take out and occupies six slots that could be double heat sinks, so I pulled it for a 300XL. The 300XL is no heavier than the standard 255 and makes up for the six side torso slots with the ability to mount an additional two DHS. With 4ERPPC's, it shuts down a lot, earning its name of "Sleepy". As back ups, it has 2MPL and 2SRM2's. Light mechs will always be the Stalker's bane.

[Splinters]

Raven-2x w/ 2 PPC's:

I agree that endo steel would make that 2x much more viable with a larger engine. I would target the 200XL engine as the best fit. That way you get 8 full DHS' at 0.2 hps dissipation instead of the 0.14 that you have right now with all the external heat sinks.

old setup:
6 DHS in engine, 6 DHS external = (6*-0.2 hps + 6*-0.14 hps) *1.15 (if you have cooldown skill) = (-1.2 - .84)*1.15 = -2.346 hps

New setup w/ 200xl
8 DHS in engine, 4 DHS external = (8*-0.2 hps + 4* -0.14hps)*1.15 = (-1.6 -.56)*1.15 = -2.484 hps

Overall that will net a .138 heat dissapation on a standard map, but it is a 5.9% increase in cooling efficiency with the endo upgrade and the engine upgrade. This is not counting the fact that you are now 92.6kph/101.8kph (w/ speed tweak) instead of 78.7kph/86.6kph in the 170 engine. that's a 17% increase in speed to go with the extra cooling.

On a side note, the max heat capacity will be the same at 30 + (12 *2.0) *1.2 (Heat Containment skill) = 64.8 max heat for both builds.

-S

Edited by Splinters, 11 February 2013 - 12:09 PM.

[Splinters]

Back to the OP's request, I would say Catapults and Cataphracts are both great chassis to work with as well. Going CTF-4X with 4 AC5's or 2x UAC5's & 2 AC2's is a lot of fun in terms of crazy dakka-dakka.

Catapults can boat LRMs like crazy and they can mount lasers if you want more direct fire. The A1 is a popular splatcat/streakcat model and the K2 is a popular dakka-dakka dual ballistics model or a quad Large Laser model for either Catapult or Cataphract.

Why do I recommend Heavies? Because the cbills cost is lower and the fun is still up there. If your in a light mech it can be a real shock going to an assault that goes <60kph. At least the heavies can get up into the 70's/80's kph and have some good punch as well.

Hope that helps!

-S

[StalaggtIKE]

Koniving, on 10 February 2013 - 09:02 AM, said:

Tag isn't really necessary. I use that because of bad collision meshes on MWO. For example firing from the cave entrance to their base, your shots will stick and hit an invisible wall three meters outside of the building's visible wall. I use the tag to make sure I can make the shot before I commit to it and announce my location.

The logic is: If I can tag it, I can hit it. If I can't, I'm not announcing my hiding spot.

Did they finally change TAG to invisible light spectrum?

[Koniving]

No, StalaggtIKE, they haven't. Even if they do it shows up on Thermal. However I'm not likely to "test-tag" a target while he's looking at me. That'd just be pretty stupid.