23 replies to this topic

[SlXSlXSlX]

Not that we are even to 12 v 12 but....

Given that they have stated they are gong there, I'll assume it is ture, albeit eventually.

The question is, is that where it ends? Will that be all the bigger it can get. Are these limitations of the chosen engine, the chosen coders, or a voluntary choice by the developers? Is itconstricted by teh current map size, and can be easily fixed when larger maps are implemented? Is it even possible, in this game?

Inquiring minds would like to know.

[xRatas]

I'm not sure why we would want bigger games?

I'd more like to have 1vs1 and 4vs4 game modes than 12vs12 mode. But people have different tastes I guess.

[Johnny Morgan]

Really would depend on map sizes, if they got big enough then having larger games (16vs16) would be interesting but I would personally prefer a Solarius area mode first.

4vs4 I believe is coming soon with the new 'Dropship' mode but there isn't much details on it.

[Ralgas]

will depend on if cryengine can handle it, netcode still has huge issues for me when 4 or so mechs are traveling over the 120km/h mark nearby

[Johnny Morgan]

Quote

Ethidium - Will the total number of Mechs I own benefit me in the achievement system or in community warfare; should I keep every Mech I buy because it will benefit me later, even if I don’t intend to play it?
[color=#959595]A: Yes. Very much so. There will be collector achievements, along with the need to own multiple configurations of Mechs for DropShip modes.[/color]

ExAstris - Will mechs that are already released ever undergo balance passes to ensure their competitiveness for their weight (with respect to other variants of the same mech or other mechs of the same tonnage)?
[color=#959595]A: We are currently working on implementing the quirks of each variant. These quirks are little stat boosts and nerfs applied to a variant of a Mech. This is meant to both balance different variants of the same chassis, as well as balance them when compared to all of the other chassis. Newly created Mechs will receive these quirks as they’re released, and we hope to implement them on one or two older chassis per patch. [David][/color]

[Ghogiel]

SlXSlXSlX, on 17 February 2013 - 03:14 AM, said:

Are these limitations of the chosen engine

CE3 can support more than 12v12s.

hardware limitations and bandwidth issues will probably occur around 16v16 though.

[semalferuzA]

Maps would need to be massive in order to accomodate larger teams.

I'd be interested in some split drops. Could be interesting having lances separated instead of always grouped in a ball + lights running around.

[El Penguin]

I would love to see some 50v50 battles on massive maps for CW. Star Citizen runs off cryengine 3 and supports 100 players. Highly doubt we will see it here though sadly..

[bloodnor]

yes there was once talk of 64 vs 64 re-enacting instances within MW lore. but it seems doubtful now

Edited by bloodnor, 17 February 2013 - 04:23 AM.

[Chemie]

Developer said that 12v12 was pushing the bandwidth and technology as far as it can go. I do not know why others can do 100v100 but he claimed it was because of the server-side implementation.

[Karl Franz]

12v12 might be little too much for low-end spec already, so I don't expect more anytime soon.

[Adridos]

El Penguin, on 17 February 2013 - 03:48 AM, said:

Star Citizen runs off cryengine 3 and supports 100 players. Highly doubt we will see it here though sadly..

Star Citizen is a space game. It has virtually nothing to render except for background, a few ast/meteroids and the ships themselves. Just look at EVE and the sizes it can support just because of the fact.

[SlXSlXSlX]

I see a mix of responses, and it seems a little inconsistent. Some say, its the engine, but others say that other games using teh same engine support much more. Is there a limitation preventing larger team sizes, and if so, what is it? Anyone with a little technical know how, that can weigh in on this?

When they devs say it is pushing the bandwidth and the technology, what exactly does that mean, when other games today using the same internet protocals can support a much larger player versus player competition.

How can adding 4 or even 8 more per side exceed low spec machine capabilities. Look at Wot, it has lowerer spec requirements, and supports larger matches, and has for 2-3 years now. If that is not a fair parallel then what is?

Note: Please keep idle speculation and rude comments to yourself. I would love to hear from someone with some technical savvy, that understands the factors impacting how large MWO games could/can possibly be.

[xhrit]

SlXSlXSlX, on 17 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

I see a mix of responses, and it seems a little inconsistent. Some say, its the engine, but others say that other games using teh same engine support much more. Is there a limitation preventing larger team sizes, and if so, what is it? Anyone with a little technical know how, that can weigh in on this?

The answer to any question starting, “Why don't they—” is almost always, “Money.”
-Robert A. Heinlein

As a professional computer programmer and hobby game developer, I can answer this question. The answer is money. A larger development staff with a longer timeline would totally be able to build a system that supported larger match sizes.

Aion, for example, uses CryEngine just like Mechwarrior Online, and it supports open world pvp with 2000+ players in a single zone. Aion was developed by one of the largest software companies in the world, which is owned by one of the richest men in the world. It also uses CryEngine exclusively for rendering, and uses the same custom built backend network transport that was used in Lineage I and II, so the game had 10+ years of development to build off of starting out.

MWO with open world pvp would be insanely awesome.

It would be like 3030MUX, but better.

Edited by xhrit, 17 February 2013 - 08:24 AM.

[Jabilo]

Just imagine how amazing it would be to drop on a map of several hundred square kilometres with a full regimental combat team.

*drool...*

[Joseph Mallan]

xRatas, on 17 February 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

I'm not sure why we would want bigger games?

I'd more like to have 1vs1 and 4vs4 game modes than 12vs12 mode. But people have different tastes I guess.

Luthien Had fights with Hundreds of units.
Tukkayid, Huntress, Big brawls Lots of warriors. Total awesome!

[Kain]

12 v 12 will be the max, or that is what PGI is going to implement.

As you can see on the current map overview in the start match screen, PGI also have determined how big the size of a map eventually can be, 12 v 12 maps will probably fill the whole square box.

So those are the choices the devs already have made, and those will not probably change in the near future.

Of course bigger battles etc would be awesome..., but it ain't going to happen, and i'm fine with that.

[Ghogiel]

SlXSlXSlX, on 17 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

I see a mix of responses, and it seems a little inconsistent. Some say, its the engine, but others say that other games using teh same engine support much more. Is there a limitation preventing larger team sizes, and if so, what is it? Anyone with a little technical know how, that can weigh in on this?

When they devs say it is pushing the bandwidth and the technology, what exactly does that mean, when other games today using the same internet protocals can support a much larger player versus player competition.

I was a technical artist on MWLL, I have fairly extensive knowledge of CE and optimization, so basically about as close to someone who made a similar mech game in basically the same engine as you'll likely get.

There isn't an actual limit on the size of the levels, well there is, iirc in CE3 its 64km x 64km or something silly huge (and you can probably stream in more anyway). Point is you can make flipping huge levels in CE3. So as long as the levels don't start to exceed their draw call counts etc, large levels will not be the issue imo.

Player numbers though is a different matter... basically mechs are expensive. I am guessing that the server authenticating everything causes hit detection issues once the player count is more than 32. That's about where MWLL can get kinda crappy. I've played 32 man MWLL games though, and it's doable for most people. And epic. And I bet you guys would cream your pants with 8km x 8km maps with 32 players.

So I wouldn't discount 16v16 games some time in the next years. But first things first> 12v12

[Death Weasel]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 February 2013 - 08:59 AM, said:

Luthien Had fights with Hundreds of units.
Tukkayid, Huntress, Big brawls Lots of warriors. Total awesome!

If a scattered drop was added in to add a 'HOLY CRUD!' factor.
*Falls to knees in awe*

[Xigunder Blue]

Just a note. I find that most of my problems with MWO, other than minor gameplay issues, is impatience for the potential of the game. Solaris, major multi-faction/merc combats, contracts-not bids but offers, dev events where multiple groups including loners can join the fight, AI tutorial +, etc..there is so much in the way of possibilities. As a former game designer I definitely understand the money portion of the design and implementation. I understand that the last statement from a dev interview was that the company had about 45 employees. Not a lot for the potential of the game except over a longer period of time. Sigh! We simply have to wait. I have already bought about $200 in MC and contributed what I can for PGIs financial help (and for myself too).

It is just that BattleTech in an online format has intense interest for me and it is so hard to wait.