105 replies to this topic

[Silverthorn75]

This patch was...mostly bad I feel.

The Good;
I don't sheer my legs off in a fast mech by just walking or running on flat ground.. Sad that I was happy that was in, should never have been an issue with a half decent programmer.

New mech, always nice. Would have preffered a weight that we did not already have, or two of.. example 45 or 55 tons.

New map, Flaws with assault and base cap but it is beta. Excellent for conquest, will be intersting with dropship mode.



The Bad;

Ecm, another bandaid instead of fixing the problem..again.... Really, do you all at pgi NOT know what is wrong with ecm? I have run several multi million dollar companies and started one from the ground up, If I had ever had a product that caused so many problems for my customers I would have been out of buisness. Case in point, remember a car that if you tapped its bumper the fuel tank exploded?.Pinto....Instead of fixing the problem and recalling the cars how about they just gave every customer a fire extingquisher and some fireproof paint...you get the point, I hope.

It just seems pgi is clueless about it, and from listening to every "no guts no galaxy" pod cast, reading there Q&A and twitter feeds, I am fairly sure they don't know, don't care, and who ever came up with it is too proud to admit a mistake and so it persists even though pgi constantly loses customers due to this. When the made a quote about how fewer 8 man premades use ecm now, 3-4 mechs per drop.. A. that is still too much and B. That is because MANY have QUIT.

Now I won't be a debbie downer so I will offer a simple solution or two.. A. remove ecm till you figure out why you feel it is so good but the player base despise it?. B. My personal suggestion; Allow anyone to target any enemy they can see directly. Other words it turns ecm into an anti indirect fire equipment. It would block a spotter from relaying direct info, even though the spotter could still get a lock. Simple elegant and effective.

Graphical tearing on a large scale for ALOT of people in my guild well over 100. I came up with a few quick fixes but..

You said you have the "new" change to streak ready, but didn't impliment it, why?. I am refering to when you fire streaks they break that person's lock and require a new lock on. That actually brings me to another point. You state you have all these things done and are waiting to impliment them, and yet patch's come and go and you ..don't. If they truely were done would they not be implemented in a major patch like the past 2 or 3 we have had? The comment that you wish to fix something once and NEVER return to have to fix it again is unrealistic

There are quite a few more but the above seem enough and my hands hurt from all the typing

On a side note you are STILL understaffed according to your own information, I have refearled several over qualified programmers to you with one caveat, they were unfamiliar with such a new programming language as cryengine 3. You rejected all of there app.s The fact you are not interested in on teh job training for such a new and not very common programming language is..obsurd. Espeshally when you are behind schedule on so many things. Perhaps you should hire some new blood, train them well and get things done properly and FIRE the people that can't seem to swallow their pride and fix things that need fixing.


Pardon my typos my hands are like claws, hence why I am retierd now.

Edit: Now that I gave my hands time to rest.

Another point I wanted to talk about. This new warning system when you are targetted when soemone has thier cross hairs on you... Seriously.. w t f... Taking skill out of the game. Ruining scouts ability to ambush or hell, anyone trying to shoot a target that doesn't know you are there. Was this even tested?.. I just, my mouth is agape.... Another over powered item that in this game has no place. TT maybe but really?. Incoming missle warning yeah thats' cool..person putting thier crosshairs on you"warning"...ummm no please no. If you guys had a stockholder meeting I would be screaming bloody murder.

I really don't wan't to walk away from this game but, it seems teh Devs are trying really hard to make this game fail.

Edited by xSilverthornx, 20 February 2013 - 10:52 PM.

[Katface]

I quit because its been 4 months since knockdowns were taken out and they still haven't put them back in. I keep looking at patch notes every Tuesday hoping something of value was added (not some stupid bobblehead or paint color).

[Seelenlos]

(sorry for the faulty english)

Hi,


you all write of ECM. Well the problem is not the ECM, I think it is implemented as it is.
The problem is the PRICE. Any ECM Mech should have cost: 10000000 Credits, and only be earned with XP or GXP.
Why? Because mostly all romans i read,they have been piloted by specilized pilots, as they were the backbones of an assulting squad.

Quote of StalaggtIKE:
[color=#959595]"OK. Say my 3 friends and I want to play a game together. [/color]We all pilot RVN-3Ls. [color=#959595]Or, MM spread 1 ECM on two teams each, [/color]but AFK and/or disconnects happens[color=#959595]. ??? Now we are back to square one..., bad matchups. Correct? So how about they just balance ECM instead, so we don't have to worry about such things."[/color]Quote

@StalaggtIKE
- how often are people AFK? ...... because of some AFKs kill the ECM-Role? and then, after the game is implemented like Battalion, squad, etc principle and IS-House-Mechanics at large scale, ECM is not the way it should be ... you see, the logical consequence ... specially when House-Teams play against each other ...


@John MatriX82

- Well that is also a point. Mostly there is always an Assualt, heavy, Meds or Lights in a squad, as long as there are no special OPs running (hit and run missions, recon, etc)

As you said this is the ELO problem.

ELO would be interessting in Match-making IS-House vs IS-House teams, or now only squad against squad.

ELO should be implemented to take for example all Kurita in a team against all Steiner or Free Mercs, not making always winning or loosing teams ...

The good thing about no ELO-System is also the learning curve. This way no team learning is applied.

My Vote you (don't) ask:

KILL ELO

---
Edit:

after rethinking a bit (not one of my best abilities ) I would suggest the following:

- Making the ECM-lights more vulnerable, but make more vegetation on the maps, so that these mechs can really can hide in them (that's their role as they are very expensive in IS)

- and in "ECM-Recon-Mode" and still standing they should be able to stay on one leg to be camoflaged in trees ...

- AND
to make them less fighting Mechs, I would give them the MANDATORYy Command-Computing, TAG and Beagle System. After that, they can go for weapons ....

Edited by Seelenlos, 21 February 2013 - 01:27 AM.

[WolvesX]

http://mwomercs.com/...bx10-flamer-mg/

This thread in general is about the new "crit seekers", MG, Flamer and LBX.

Let me summarize it: "They are useless."

---

For example:

Flamer is not generating enough heat, if it is intented to be a stun or something.

1 ton.

Well, a ML weights a ton, why shouldn't I use that instead?

ML = more range, more damage.

[Aym]

StalaggtIKE, on 20 February 2013 - 05:40 AM, said:

This game is still ECMWO. Every game revolves around neutralizing the enemy's ECM and maximizing the potential of your own. PPC's new EMP effect only makes ECM mechs more favorable, because they stack. PPC do not counter ECM, they simply turn it off. Just like how ECM turns off radar, LRM and SSRM. It is far to binary; if A is present then B does not work. This is a poor mechanic. Games are having to do more with what your bring and less to do with the skill level of the pilot. This is more prevalent on the new Alpine map.
You drop without ECM, PPC or TAG vs a team that brought ECM. -- You are fighting an uphill battle.
If you drop with TAG vs a team that did not bring ECM. -- You now have wasted dead weight, that could have been better used else where.
Proper balance is when you want something despite its limitations, because it is useful in a good pilot's hands. Currently ECM requires no skill to use. TAG is useless if no ECM is around. In other words:

• give me a reason to not want to take ECM everytime
  
• give me a reason to take TAG despite the inclusion of ECM.

If you bring TAG against a non-ECM mech you STILL HAVE TAG!!! Your TAG still affects your LRMs and to a lesser extent your SSRMS. Where do you get the idea that your tag is wasted if the enemy doesn't have ECM? Were you unaware that TAG helps more LRMs to hit the target that is affected by TAG?

[Tarys]

overall i like how things are going and that ecm gets more counters and therefore there a less fotm-raven players around. but i sure hate the "you are targeted" call ... it makes me (the scout) nearly useless. can´t sneak up behind someone and tag them nor can i target them from afar to check their armament. the old "someone is tagging me" symbol was way better.

and i have the feeling that the netcode got a bit more troublesome. especially with my spider i often have the feeling that not all of my caused damage gets registered correctly.

[ArmageddonKnight]

Iv pointed the following out in other threads but ill post it here aswell.

Damage Vs Armor/Weight class

Small weapons: I.E: Small Laser, Small Pulse Laser, SSRM2, SRM2, LRM5. AC2, Flamer, MachineGun

Medium Weapons: I.E: Medium Laser, Medium Pulse Laser, SRM4,SRM6,LRM10, AC5, UAC5, AC10

Large Weapons: I.E: Large Laser, Large ER Laser, Large Pulse Laser, PPC, ERPPC, AC20, Guass Rifle, LRM15, LRM20

Small Weapons Do full dmg to light mechs, less dmg to subsequent high mech classes. Up to say 66% less dmg to assualt class. I.e Small Laser 3 dmg vs light mechs 1 dmg vs assault mechs.

Medium weapons Do full dmg to medium mechs, more dmg to light mechs, and less dmg to subseqent lhigher mech classes.

Large weapons: Full dmg to Heavy mechs, more dmg to medium and light .. less to assualt.

Each weapon class is restricted to certain weight classes.
I.e Large weapons only on heavy and assualt mechs Light mechs only using Light weapons so that they take on other Lights and Medium class mechs, avoiding confuntation with much larger and more deadly Heavy and Assualt mechs. With the exception of those mechs in lesser classes that r designed to use certain weapons. Example being Hunchback using AC20.

Result.
Assualt mechs r feared once more, only being taken on realisticly by other assualt mechs or groups of lower class mechs.
Light mechs r back to being scouts, spotters, and for mainly light vs light and light vs medium.
Battles against oposing weight classes like 4 medium vs 1 assualt take much longer, tactics and skill become more important.

This would be alot better than the 'cluster *****' that goes on now.

Edited by ArmageddonKnight, 21 February 2013 - 02:44 PM.

[DerHuhnTeufel]

ArmageddonKnight, on 21 February 2013 - 02:42 PM, said:

Iv pointed the following...on now.

So everyone would just play assaults because anything else would be pointless. That's a terrible idea.

[ExAstris]

Aym, on 21 February 2013 - 04:21 AM, said:

If you bring TAG against a non-ECM mech you STILL HAVE TAG!!! Your TAG still affects your LRMs and to a lesser extent your SSRMS. Where do you get the idea that your tag is wasted if the enemy doesn't have ECM? Were you unaware that TAG helps more LRMs to hit the target that is affected by TAG?

The TAG isn't wasted on an LRM boat for sure, in fact its a neccessity (i.e. tax) for them now, but for everyone else its a waste. Since you need an energy slot for it, you're comprimising your loadout to take it.

Even scounts can't use it to spot for their LRM boats because ECM covers up the TAG when within 180m. The only way to use TAG on a non-LRM boat is to have a pre-made spotter who carries both an ECM and TAG of his own. But then again, since you now have one friendly near the enemy group, and one ally away from the enemy, the enemy is far more likely to have multiple ECMs overlap and cancel out the TAG spotter anyways. So again, we're back to TAG being a neccessity and tax for all LRM carriers and useless for everyone else. (or at least, useless enough that its never worth taking)

So not only has ECM's current implimentation killed the scouting role, its also killed spotters stone dead, which in turn kills LRMs as indirect support. You either use LRMs has direct-fire weapons with your own TAG (and pray no ECM mech gets within 180m of you), or you just use other direct fire weapons.


ECM doesn't fit into role warfare, it actually reduces the roles we have access to. ECM doesn't fit into information warfare, it merely hands it user every major advantage with no appropriate counter or drawback. There is just nothing to like about ECM at the systemic level, its simply bad for MWO's health, period.



Also a few misunderstandings to clear up. TAG does nothing for SSRMs, they get no clustering bonus from it, nor do they get better lock time. The only conceivable benefit is if you manage to use TAG to reveal an stealthed mech between 180 and 270, otherwise you'll be jammed or unable to lock.

Furthermore, TAG is still "cancelled" by ECM. The only aspect of ECM that TAG overcomes is the stealth field, allowing you to detect the enemy with your sensors (which in turn lets you target the enemy, scan the enemy, and lock the enemy). However, your LRM clustering bonuses are rendered useless against ECM protected mechs, and missile locks still take twice as long to achieve. And of course all the ECM mechs allies still recieve full benefits of the ECM, its operation is not disrupted, only its stealth field countered for each mech that has been hitscanned by a TAG laser within the last second.

[DocBach]

Quote

Balance Ideas for ECM (again):

Add a third mode to ECM based off of the Ghost Target feature ECM is suppose to have (from Tactical Operations). Take away any sort of missile defeating properties ECM has in disrupt and put them into Ghost Target mode.

Disrupt will now:

Prevent targeting information, but not targeting itself. If you can see it, you can lock on to it, you just don't receive information on chassis, damage, loadout, ect.

Block Beagle's ability to locate shut down targets, Narc beacon, Artemis, and target sharing through the bubble

Have a chance to block target locks if the spotting 'Mech is inside of an enemy ECM radius -- Beagle Active Probe will reduce the chance of blocking by ECM

Ghost Target will:

Add additional lock on time to targets

Add false radar signatures to targets to confuse to enemy and make them cycle through spam to find the target they actually want. Ghost targets will appear like targets shrouded by Disrupt, so they'll have a designator, but no information. Beagle Active Probe will detect false Ghost Targets as being invalid.

Counter will:

Counter Disrupt or Ghost Target mode.

ECM can only be used in one mode at a time.

[Seelenlos]

@exAstris and DocBach: (both founders)
1. I am surprized founders have unrest with ecm, as it is implemented the way BT wants it...

2.have you played agains a team with LRM Boats and TAGs since the patch?
I did, was spotted and died in 10 Sec. And THAT was good:
If I had an ECM-mate around me the enemy missiles would not have bundled

3. what do you want, a BT-Game without ECM?

4. I still think it is not the ECM, its more its spearding in the matchmaking algorithm.

ECM-Mechs must be devided to all teams, even if they are grouped (though not even that is needed, if the net-code would cache them and then spread them over the two teams, groups still stay together).

The only problem which acures is, when there is only one ECM in the whole match, but then, thats real-BT-life ....

[Xiang]

OK, so i didnt read all of the previosus posts (find your favorite mech, hope your elo is low enough to find me in a game and shoot me)....but here go my thoughts:

Is it just me, or does anyone else think that the mech speeds are way out of proportion? Seriously, I run a spider with max engine and speed tweek (151.5 Kph), and 50 ton Trebuchets are keeping up with me (138-140ish Kph??). It just seems that for the supposed fastest mech in the game you cant run away from anything when needed. I think either the smaller/faster mechs need to be able to go faster to get away, or the bigger mechs need to be slowed down some. Speed used to be an advantage (and no i dont mean it in the lag-shield way), but now there is no escape.

Also, im beginning to feel like the changes to the jump jets made them far worse for the spider than better. Others that i talk to feel the the changes for thier Catapults and Cataphracts are great, but I used to be able to jump and clear the wall in Frozen City (near the theta base in conquest) to escape Ravens and Commandos, and now i cant clear it. It seems no matter how far i start my jump, my legs catch the edge of the wall and i cant go any higher even though i have fuel left. So i end up running out of fuel and dropping right back into the hornets nest. Same thing happens in River City and Forest Colony at various jump points (if anyone has suggestions on what im doing wrong, just call me a noob and tell me what i am doing wrong, but i used to be able to clear the jumps easily, now i cant).

Light mech balance seems very heavily favored towards 1-2 mechs (i wont name names). Cant we just remove missle hardpoints from ECM lights/meds (not overly concerned with the DDC)? It may stop some of the ECM is overpowered threads.

Lastly, rubber-banding seems to be worse recently (since maybe the 2/5 patch - ok not game balance, but while i am here...). I will think i have cleared an obstacle and start making a turn only to end up stuck against a wall, building etc, with my enemy shooting me freely while i try to get out of a bad position. And usually end up dying a horrific death (like i said, im not the greatest player around, but I am having fun).

Hope these issues can be looked at.

Thanks!

Xiang

[Xamiakas]

good job at messing things up. at least every 3rd match i pugged today was pugs vs 8man.. wth?

[Povier]

Quote

- The Machine Gun has a 14% increased chance to crit once, an 8% increased chance to crit twice, and a 3% increased chance to crit 3 times.
- When the Machine Gun crits, it will deal 12.5x the amount of normal damage per bullet to an internal item.
- The Machine Gun crit damage is 12.5 x 0.04 = 0.5 per crit. Max crit of 3 times = 1.5.
- Due to the rate of fire, the Machine Gun is now a heavy crit seeker and will be VERY effective vs. items on non-armoured locations.

Can someone clear this up. What means internal item? Equiped items like ECM, JJs, heatsinks, guns, ammo, engine OR complete internal structure?

I ask because i play the SDR-5K for testing the new MG behavior and it didnt do the damage i expect.
As I understand the patch notes, the crits are only working on internal structure and do damage on internal structure.
Thus see my calcs:

statistical expectation and DPS (not on armored parts):
- 10 rounds per sec
- equipped 4 MGs
- E(X) = 0.75 * 0.04 dmg + 0.14 * 0.5 dmg + 0.08 * 1 dmg + 0.03 * 1.5 dmg = 0.225 dmg per round
- 10*4*0.225 = 9 DPS! (1 MG: 2.25 DPS)

It would melt all internals but it dont. I guess I misunderstand internal item, do I?

[DocBach]

Seelenlos, on 22 February 2013 - 01:16 AM, said:

@exAstris and DocBach: (both founders)
1. I am surprized founders have unrest with ecm, as it is implemented the way BT wants it...

2.have you played agains a team with LRM Boats and TAGs since the patch?
I did, was spotted and died in 10 Sec. And THAT was good:
If I had an ECM-mate around me the enemy missiles would not have bundled

3. what do you want, a BT-Game without ECM?

4. I still think it is not the ECM, its more its spearding in the matchmaking algorithm.

ECM-Mechs must be devided to all teams, even if they are grouped (though not even that is needed, if the net-code would cache them and then spread them over the two teams, groups still stay together).

The only problem which acures is, when there is only one ECM in the whole match, but then, thats real-BT-life ....

Did you read my post? I didn't say I didn't want ECM. I said I want ECM that follows more closely to Battletech.

Show me where in any Battletech rulebook does it say that ECM affects Streaks or LRM fire, either direct or indirect.

Show me where in any Battletech rulebook that it says ECM denies IFF and radar completely.

Because I can show you exactly where in the different rulebooks it says it doesn't do any of these things.


(Technical Readout: 3050 Revised, pg 196)
"The Guardian emits a broad-band signal that interferes with all sonar, radar, UV, IR, and magscan sensors, thus protecting all units in a radius of up to 180 meters by projecting a "cloak" to its enemies. Enemy long-range sensors can find vehicles and 'Mechs within the curtain, but the Guardian obscures the reading and prevents identification. By the time the enemy enters visual range, sensors can sometimes override the jamming, but by this time most pilots rely on their own eyes to track the opposition."

(Total Warfare, pg 134): "The ECM does not affect other scanning or targeting devices such as TAG and targeting computers"

"to be affected, the spotting unit must be in the normal operating radius of the ECM... LOS does not affect this radius." - Total Warfare, pg 224

Pretty much, to have any sensor disturbance from ECM, you have to be inside the enemy ECM bubble, trying to target an enemy also inside the bubble. As it stands in MWO, you can't target ECM enemies at all, unless you use TAG, which was intended as a spotting laser for artillery. The chart in Tactical Operations also shows Beagle has a higher chance of still detecting a 'Mech inside the ECM bubble while inside the ECM bubble as well, make that happen here.

I proposed any missile defeating ability ECM has is broken up into the third mode it had from Tactical Operations, in which ECM would make locks longer to achieve and put false targets on the enemies sensors to confuse them. Enemies have to interact with the game to find real targets, and don't just have a "turn off half the weapons in the game button" like they do now.

So no, I don't want a Battletech game without ECM. I want a Battletech game with ECM that isn't grossly overpowered and the mechanic that it completely revolves around.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

*logs in*
*goes to newest PoS pointless "Game Balance Feedback" thread they don't even read*

ECM is still OP. ECM variants still best in their line up. Non-ECM variants still worthless. Ya, it's all shocking, I know. BAP is still garbage and does nothing vs ECM too. Now cya next patch. New map not worth anything when game balance is still shat. I'll be on League of Legends and Killing Floor. Btw, prepurchase RE 6 on Steam. I want my T3 rewards. Thank you.

*logs out*

[drloser]

SSRM+ECM is still over powered.

[Xandralkus]

Machinegun and Flamer:

There is no critical buff that will ever fix these weapons.

Even if the machinegun and flamer instantly destroyed all components and weapons on a body part when damaging unarmored internals, this would make them niche-weapons at best. They still would not be worthwhile.

The Flamer should be balanced against the Medium Laser in terms of damage output. Since it is a 'continuous fire weapon' instead of one that fires in discrete shots or bursts, the Medium Laser should do higher alpha damage (obviously). The Flamer should do higher sustained DPS than a Medium laser. The Flamer should still have very short range and higher heat generation than the Medium Laser.

The MG should be balanced against the Small Laser in terms of damage output. Again, we have a weapon that is capable of continuous fire instead of a normal weapon that fires in discrete bursts, so after balancing, we can expect lower instantaneous alpha-damage and higher sustained DPS than the Small Laser. It might actually be wiser to balance it against the Medium Laser, if we make it such that 1 ton of ammunition per gun is 'not quite enough' for an extended engagement - this would shift its effective tonnage closer to that of the Medium Laser. Remember, we can also expect higher damage output since it is usable at a shorter range. The MG needs to generate heat too.

Until clusters of MG's and Flamers make sense as knife-fighting weapons on assault mechs, they're not balanced. Change the weapon values - that is the only way they will ever be useful.

Technically, I am in favor of armor and weapon changes that invert the current situation in-game. I think target engagement time is FAR too long. No weapon in this game feels like it DOES anything. Why don't machineguns shred armor? Why doesn't a mech with a single PPC pose an immediate and dire threat to everything except assaults? Why do Large Lasers not do this:

Give us, INDIVIDUAL players, (not just groups) the capability to alpha-strike and seriously damage a mech of equal tonnage.

They should not have doubled armor. They should have HALVED it.

Edited by Xandralkus, 22 February 2013 - 11:57 AM.

[ExAstris]

Seelenlos, on 22 February 2013 - 01:16 AM, said:

@exAstris and DocBach: (both founders)

1. I am surprized founders have unrest with ecm, as it is implemented the way BT wants it...

2.have you played agains a team with LRM Boats and TAGs since the patch? I did, was spotted and died in 10 Sec. And THAT was good: If I had an ECM-mate around me the enemy missiles would not have bundled

3. what do you want, a BT-Game without ECM?

4. I still think it is not the ECM, its more its spearding in the matchmaking algorithm. ECM-Mechs must be devided to all teams, even if they are grouped (though not even that is needed, if the net-code would cache them and then spread them over the two teams, groups still stay together). The only problem which acures is, when there is only one ECM in the whole match, but then, thats real-BT-life ....

1. As you can see, the majority of players (with a sample pool of over a thousand) have a problem with how ECM is currently implimented. I do not know what you mean by "the way BT wants it". The majority of players do not like how it is now, regardless of whether they have some bad reason (wanting it to be more like TT) or good reasons (it is poorly implimented as a part of information warfare and breaks game balance along a number of fronts, especially for pug players).

2. Yes, LRMs are the most easily countered weapon in the game, and by far the most risky to take into any competative match. If, for whatever reason, you think LRMs are a problem, then fix the problem, do not bandaid it with another solution. This is precisely what is happening to ECM, it is the problem, yet we keep getting bandaid pseudo-solutions in the form of TAG, and PPC changes.

3. Again, I have no allegience to TT. I'm all for respecting the source material to a point, but game-balance and fun are where I draw the line. Ironically, the TT version of ECM is far closer to what I think ECM should be in MWO. But I don't think that, because its that way in TT, its merely coincidence that PGI's additions to it in this game are the ones that make it broken. There are numerous ways to fix ECM that make it nothing like it was in TT, and they are perfectly fine by me. In fact, my signature has a comprehensive information warfare proposal that makes the entire information warfare layer of MWO look nothing like TT, but I think it respects the spirit of TT far more than the current ECM does and makes MWO a much deeper and better balanced game in the process.

4. If you think ECM needs to be spread in the matchmaker to be even on each team, then that is admitting that it affects balance more than anything else. Sure we could ad-hoc add things to the matchmaker to get matches to be balanced. But thats not an optimal solution for things that have in-game mechanical fixes to them. Fix ECM, then there is no need to patch-up the matchmaker to compensate for it.

Xandralkus, on 22 February 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

Machinegun and Flamer:

There is no critical buff that will ever fix these weapons.

While I strongly disagree with your thoughts on alpha strike/double armor, this part of your post is spot on. Weapons should have roles, but given how valuable our weapon hardpoints are, weapons that only have noticable effects against internal components (not even the internal structure!), just will never be worth it. That is too niche of a role for any weapon in MWO.

Edited by ExAstris, 22 February 2013 - 07:11 PM.

[Inertiaman]

http://mwomercs.com/...edback-2192013/

Turns out ECM still sucks ****.

/feedback