351 replies to this topic

[Roadbuster]

A Haiku:

A splatcat on Alpine.
Running around in despair.
LRMs falling from the sky.
I smile.

[Orgasmo]

You can still be effective in Alpine in a short range brawler, but you will have to work for it. Speed and cover is the name of the game, so bring heavies and assaults is out of the equation. You must be able to move at 85kph+ to reach your target. Move from cover the cover, and flank them. I actually managed to score two kills on my Atlas D brawler today, depsite its slow speed.

[Karyudo ds]

Harusee, on 20 February 2013 - 11:38 PM, said:

The only downside right now is the inability to choose your map. That hurts when you bring your point blank brawler out and you get alpine.

In theory by taking a brawler you should run the risk of sacrificing ranged survivability. If you could pick a mech for the map though then you would still have cheese builds dominate everything. There would just be different cheese for each map. I would be alright with some sort of voting system but I do like having to be prepared. Of course that also means having to put more thought into builds...

[UnseenFury]

If only all maps would be like Alpine. But now you have to deal with being dropped on the rest COD-like maps.

[Adrienne Vorton]

ah when i read all this, i am sooo happy that i play multirole setups most of the time

Paran01ac, on 21 February 2013 - 12:31 AM, said:

If only all maps would be like Alpine. But now you have to deal with being dropped on the rest COD-like maps.

somehow i agree... since i dropped on alpine for the first time, i start to dislike the others^^ but i guess that´s mostly because i played them so much already ^^

[DogmeatX]

Helmer, on 20 February 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

Battletech ,and by extension Mechwarrior, have always been about risk/reward, pros vs cons of different weapons and builds.
Adding in Larger maps simply, finally, points out that taking a brawler all the time could have severe consequences .


I'm all for random maps. Maybe it will cause some to diversify their load outs a bit.



Cheers.

In other words: "Hey let's make up some excuse why there isn't a lobby yet which shows you the map before dropping, allowing you change your loadout accordingly"

Asking for a lobby screen - a REAL prematch screen, where you can see what loadouts your teammates have and lets you change your loadout BEFORE the round begins - that is not whining. It's a pity the shills here can't see this is a significant feature LACKING in MWO.

1) Lobby increases fun for people, less frustration and lets them prepare better for upcoming maps
2) More importantly helps counter serious advantage premades have in that those groups pre-select all their mechs to cover each others weaknesses. I know this is true because I do it too.

No, better to just make up excuses and reasons why it's not in. Or better yet call it whining because who'd think such a feature might actually be really useful eh...

Edited by DogmeatX, 21 February 2013 - 12:54 AM.

[Elkarlo]

Radbane, on 20 February 2013 - 11:25 PM, said:

The A1 is the only CPLT I don't drive, but i was playing around with a build in Smurfys mechlab.
4xSRM6 + 2xLRM15 .. Both your fancy SRM boating AND "op" LRM's on the same mech? =O

Used a similar build to go through the A1 when i played it because... i find the standard splattapult not suited for me
4xsrm4 2x lrm15
Then you can carry the necessary 6 tons LRM ammo and 4 Tons srm ammo.

But of course then it is no more the uber Splattapult. But only a Mech for 40 short range alpha and 50 longrange Damage.
But of course it won't overheat in close combat so it would stay longer in fight there.

And the people crying for lobby think about this:
You would end up on River City with 16 other Brawler types and no longrange Prey to hunt for.
I think that would realy Backfire on you.
I would love it, going in with one of my Brawler Mechs which can tear appart a Splattapult in 7 Seconds without leaving it any chance of hitting me, because i run 100+ kph.

Edited by Elkarlo, 21 February 2013 - 01:08 AM.

[Larth]

Don't worry, when they add a heavy forested map, all the long range mech players will be crying instead.

[One Medic Army]

Larth, on 21 February 2013 - 01:12 AM, said:

Don't worry, when they add a heavy forested map, all the long range mech players will be crying instead.

Nah, they'll just jumpjet up high enough to see over the trees, and then snipe you from midair.

[Cubivorre]

The thing that bothers me about this thread is most people seem to think, 'your fault you weren't kitted out in balanced gear or longer ranged gear, nub' when realistically, battlemech pilots would KNOW what type of zone they'd be dropping into and choose his loadout accordingly. So until we can change loadouts/mechs according to the map, I don't see the previously mentioned arguements holding up. (Not to mention most of them don't have much genuinely debatable content - the majority just seem to say 'u suk uninstall lulz'. And not only is that not constructive whatsoever, it makes said person look like a child trying to wear big boy pants. Can't argue with people that refuse any other point of view but their own.)

[Larth]

Unless they have hunker down implemented by then. That and most of the big time "snipers": K2 Cats, Atlases, Awesomes cannot jumpjet.

Mostly, I just wanted to point out that yes, Alpine Peaks puts short range mechs at a disadvantage. However, there are other terrains that will put other mechs at a disadvantage. Just like downtown in a city where the movie "A River Runs Through It" was NOT filmed, will make LRM's a pain cuz of all the buildings providing cover. Just as I suspect the desert is going to make laser boats be...painful: *pulls trigger* Mmm, Davion souffle. Few more shots and I should be rightly cooked.

Personally, even though I play C4 Splatcat half the time, I love Alpine Peaks cuz it's huge and it makes me think what strategy should I use. That and how suicidal do I want to be.

[Larth]

As for changing load outs, that unfortunately is a thing mostly reserved for Omni Mechs really. Most IS pilots were dropped with whatever their mech was. Sure if you own multiple mechs (which is easy in this game) it'd be nice to pick. However, like in the novels or when doing random play tabletop game, you don't always get to pick where you fight...and sometimes you have the wrong mech for the situation. Random is kinda like that. Maybe If/When they implement some form of Vs/Challenge map where teams can go against each other, they can select the map and then pick their map. But for random, it does kinda make sense.

[Cubivorre]

Larth, on 21 February 2013 - 01:29 AM, said:

As for changing load outs, that unfortunately is a thing mostly reserved for Omni Mechs really. Most IS pilots were dropped with whatever their mech was. Sure if you own multiple mechs (which is easy in this game) it'd be nice to pick. However, like in the novels or when doing random play tabletop game, you don't always get to pick where you fight...and sometimes you have the wrong mech for the situation. Random is kinda like that. Maybe If/When they implement some form of Vs/Challenge map where teams can go against each other, they can select the map and then pick their map. But for random, it does kinda make sense.

Okay I can appreciate all of that. I'd still at least like a choice of battlemech though. It just doesn't make sense to use arandom mech for a random drop. You'd totally have some kind of heads up on where you'd be going.

[Larth]

Agreed. There are times I get a map and I'm in the wrong mech and I just groan. *laughs* Never said I liked it, just that it made sense.

[Onmyoudo]

I can't believe this thread is still rotating the same arguments from yesterday without any kind of additional discussion value.

Larth, on 21 February 2013 - 01:12 AM, said:

Don't worry, when they add a heavy forested map, all the long range mech players will be crying instead.

That's still an issue.

Larth, on 21 February 2013 - 01:29 AM, said:

As for changing load outs, that unfortunately is a thing mostly reserved for Omni Mechs really. Most IS pilots were dropped with whatever their mech was. <snip>

Does not make for good gameplay, which is the most important thing.

Larth, on 21 February 2013 - 01:24 AM, said:

Mostly, I just wanted to point out that yes, Alpine Peaks puts short range mechs at a disadvantage. <snip>

I agree and as I said earlier that's still an issue if you have to gamble that you're getting a map your build is useful on. Again, it detracts from the gameplay.

Orgasmo, on 20 February 2013 - 11:55 PM, said:

You can still be effective in Alpine in a short range brawler, but you will have to work for it. Speed and cover is the name of the game, so bring heavies and assaults is out of the equation.

Except that you don't get the choice to not bring heavies and assaults for Alpine.

I'm going to stop there because I'm repeating myself already. Choosing what map we play on next after every game may not be the answer, but the current system is very flawed and requires changing.

Edited by Onmyoudo, 21 February 2013 - 01:53 AM.

[RapierE01]

and i love Raven run circles in open wide terrain with no chance to hide. Say hello to my Large Lasers.

Edited by RapierE01, 21 February 2013 - 01:54 AM.

[van Uber]

Onmyoudo, on 21 February 2013 - 01:53 AM, said:

I'm going to stop there because I'm repeating myself already. Choosing what map we play on next after every game may not be the answer, but the current system is very flawed and requires changing.

I guess it's just a difference of opinion then. I feel quite the opposite, I enjoy the challenge of being dropped outside of my Mechs "comfort zone", or trying to figure out slightly more versatile builds that do not deviate too far from the efficiency they currently enjoy.

To me it adds variation despite if I drop with the same Mech and build over and over. Trying to be effective with an Assault Brawler between buildings is quite the different experience compared to the same Mech on "the open tundra". But equally fun. To me.

[DogmeatX]

Larth, on 21 February 2013 - 01:29 AM, said:

As for changing load outs, that unfortunately is a thing mostly reserved for Omni Mechs really. Most IS pilots were dropped with whatever their mech was. Sure if you own multiple mechs (which is easy in this game) it'd be nice to pick. However, like in the novels or when doing random play tabletop game, you don't always get to pick where you fight...and sometimes you have the wrong mech for the situation. Random is kinda like that. Maybe If/When they implement some form of Vs/Challenge map where teams can go against each other, they can select the map and then pick their map. But for random, it does kinda make sense.

Just another excuse sorry. You can freely change most aspects of your mech in the mechbay right down to structure level. You're trying to make up some canon/lore reason when you're not considering this is primarily a video game and not everything should be 100% tabletop/rpg lore with regard to that.

Mech pilots choose their mech and then get absolutely no clue whatsoever at all where they're going to go for their fight? Not even the pilots of the most expensive and/or valuable mechs around? No sorry, this story won't fly either.

Why is it so difficult for some people? I will spell it out exactly how to improve this game even more:

1) Sort your own little premade/group or just press Launch
2) Either way this makes you join the queue and adds other players into the team to make up 8 (12 in future) and there is an enemy team built same way so you have both teams ready to face each other
3) Your team is brought into a REAL prematch screen where you can all chat to each other.
4) This real prematch screen shows you the map you're going to fight in plus your teammates loadouts
5) You're given a set amount of time to make adjustments to your loadouts (and maybe a ready button)
6) The round begins.

It's simple, it can work with ELO rankings (step 2 both teams are built up taking rankings into account just like the new matchmaking) and there's no more complaining on the forum about premades because everyone has the same playing field i.e. can preselect loadouts/mechs - this is assuming proper voice comms are in the game at some point too.

Maybe the real reason this kind of stuff isn't in, it's not canon/lore reasons but simply that PGI don't know how to do it? Or haven't figured it out yet? I wish the devs would give some real input into this kind of area, what technical problems there are, is it a design issue? The way the game's been built up makes it too hard? What?

Edited by DogmeatX, 21 February 2013 - 02:06 AM.

[One Medic Army]

DogmeatX, on 21 February 2013 - 02:02 AM, said:

Just another excuse sorry. You can freely change most aspects of your mech in the mechbay right down to structure level. You're trying to make up some canon/lore reason when you're not considering this is primarily a video game and not everything should be 100% tabletop/rpg lore with regard to that.

Mech pilots choose their mech and then get absolutely no clue whatsoever at all where they're going to go for their fight? Not even the pilots of the most expensive and/or valuable mechs around? No sorry, this story won't fly either.

Just felt a need to point out that your first paragraph argues that this is a video game, and then your second paragraph argues based on reality.
As to military forces doing stupid things, dear god do they, I hear stories all the time from my friend who served.

[DogmeatX]

One Medic Army, on 21 February 2013 - 02:06 AM, said:

Just felt a need to point out that your first paragraph argues that this is a video game, and then your second paragraph argues based on reality.
As to military forces doing stupid things, dear god do they, I hear stories all the time from my friend who served.

Well nitpicking a bit there But no, the same applies purely from a gameplay perspective too. This can only change if they add roughly equal numbers of huge, medium and small maps then there might be some justification but given the rather glacial speed at which genuinely new maps have been released I don't think it'd be wise to use that right now.

Your serving friends, they never got any clue at all where they'd be deployed? It's somewhere hot? Somewhere cold? Bring extra heatsinks? Bring some warm clothes? Zip? Nada? The "only omnimechs" reason is a weak one in the video game context. (p.s. no need to reply about your friends, no insults intended just an illustration)

So honestly, what real reason is there why it would be detrimental to have a system like the one I've detailed above? Especially when you consider this is something every moderately competent premade group does (assuming they use voice coms to set up beforehand) and this is the only way to give randoms the same abiility?

Edited by DogmeatX, 21 February 2013 - 02:16 AM.