12 replies to this topic

[FrupertApricot]

Let ANY direct fire hit temporarily **** ECM. Think of it this way, weapon hits HEAT MECHS UP CONSIDERABLY at least on the surface making their signatures readily readable. This would make direct fire the true counter to ECM and give non ECM/streak lights a better chance in a light v light fight and would make the ECM behave more like it should for its tiny tonnage. needing a 7 ton device + skill to temporarily counter ecm is still favoring ECM to hard.

[Orgasmo]

No.

[Angus McBeef]

No. They should re-examine ECM instead.

[Mal]

FrupertApricot, on 19 February 2013 - 10:59 PM, said:

This would make direct fire the true counter to ECM.

Direct fire already counters ECM...point gauss rifle, AC, Laser, etc.. At 'Mech, pull trigger, note how ECM doesn't effect fired shots.

[Commander Kobold]

I vote re-design ECM but it'll never happen

[Alvor]

Mal, on 19 February 2013 - 11:14 PM, said:

Direct fire already counters ECM...point gauss rifle, AC, Laser, etc.. At 'Mech, pull trigger, note how ECM doesn't effect fired shots.

ECM is not countered by direct fire. Direct fire only is not effected by ECM.

However.......


To summarize TAG should always work & Streaks/Regular LRMs should always work if using Canon BT/MW.

Number of (regular) missiles hit per salvo in current MWO is OP. On average only about 50%-60% should be hitting i.e. LRM20 average 12 missiles hit per salvo.

All this information was taken from http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page which is one of the best resources for Battletech information.

http://www.sarna.net...rdian_ECM_Suite

Guardian ECM Suite is typically used to shield allied units from such equipment by emitting a broad-band signal meant to confuse radar, infrared, ultraviolet, magscan and sonar sensors.[2] Affected systems include Artemis IV, C3 and C3i Computer networks, and Narc Missile Beacons. A Guardian can jam a Beagle Active Probe (or its Clan equivalent), but the probe-equipped unit will be aware of the jamming. The greatest drawback to the Guardian is its limited range 180 meters. Sensors can sometimes override this jamming, though by that point the enemy unit is already within visual range and can track the opposition with their own eyes.[2]

http://www.sarna.net...Angel_ECM_Suite

Angel ECM Suite is an experimental version of the Guardian ECM Suite operating on a broader spectrum and greatly advances ECM technology on the battlefield.
Game Rules
The Angel ECM Suite represents a great advance in ECM technology from the standard Guardian model. Angel suite completely blocks the following systems on enemy units: Artemis IV,Artemis V, Beagle Active Probes, Bloodhound Active Probes and their Clan equivalents, C3 Master Computers and C3 Slaves, Streak Missile Launchers and Narc missile beacons. Streak missiles may be fired at units affected by the device, but they function as standard missiles.
When using ECCM rules, the Angel ECM Suite counts as two ECM/ECCM units (depending on how it is set) for the purposes of determining the ratio of ECM to ECCM in a given area.

http://www.sarna.net...cquisition_Gear

Target Acquisition Gear (TAG) is an advanced targeting device for use by artillery spotters. The TAG unit works by firing an infrared laser beam to designate the target and transmits that data via a tight-beam laser communication system to the guidance systems of friendly "smart" bombs and missiles. TAG is compatible with systems such as Arrow IV Homing Missiles or LRM munitions.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Streak_SRM

Streak Missile Launcher Unlike a standard SRM whose shotgun effect may result in some misses and some hits, Streak guidance gives the lighter launchers the effective average firepower of the heavier and more wasteful SRM systems, but with considerably less variation in damage effects. The only disadvantages are that Streak launchers are incompatible with other missile target acquisition technologies such as the Artemis IV FCS and Narc Missile Beacon, their specialized ammunition is much more expensive, and some users are willing to accept partial hits rather than not be able to fire on demand.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/LRM

Long Range Missiles are designed to engage the enemy at great distances at the expense of damage dealt. Adapted towards the profusion of electronic jamming on the battlefield and the effectiveness of current armor designs, these missiles are capable of indirect fire and disperse over a smaller area than Short Range Missiles. Inner Sphere LRM launchers achieve this range by firing at a ballistic launch angle, making them less accurate at close range. Clan LRM launchers do not suffer from this effect, in addition to being smaller and more compact, thanks to their technological advantage. LRMs are highly upgradable, able to fire a variety of warheads and benefit from devices such as Artemis IV FCS.[1]

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/CBT_Tables

Number of Missiles Hit Table
Die Roll (2D6) Number of Missiles Fired
2 3 4 5 6 9 10 12 15 20
2 1 1 1 1 2 3 3 4 5 6
3 1 1 2 2 2 3 3 4 5 6
4 1 1 2 2 3 4 4 5 6 9
5 1 2 2 3 3 5 6 8 9 12
6 1 2 2 3 4 5 6 8 9 12
7 1 2 3 3 4 5 6 8 9 12
8 2 2 3 3 4 5 6 8 9 12
9 2 2 3 4 5 7 8 10 12 16
10 2 3 3 4 5 7 8 10 12 16
[u]11[/u] 2 3 4 5 6 9 10 12 15 20
[u]12[/u] 2 3 4 5 6 9 10 12 15 20

[RoninV3]

No if you follow the canon of Battletech PPC discharge feedback was a problem when the weapon was originally introduced, however during the "Golden Age" of the Star League Battlemechs were fitted with compensators for it. As the technology is still available for production it is still not an issue. It was mentioned that bacwater and "below" periphery tech level mech production did continue to have this issue.

[Truesight]

Do you want to say, that ecm should not affect Streak missiles?

[Mal]

Alvor, on 19 February 2013 - 11:39 PM, said:

ECM is not countered by direct fire. Direct fire only is not effected by ECM.

Repeat the steps I listed, till ECM carrying 'Mech is destroyed..ECM now countered by direct fire


I'm a long time TT fan, but, the changes PGI has had to make to go from 10 second turns, to a RTS style game, have moved it far enough away from TT rules, that I think expecting things to behave like they did in TT...isn't realistic now.

[Elizander]

My Gauss Rifle isn't affected by ECM. What's the point?

Lasers right? Easier to hit with? Probably no chance of that happening

[Alvor]

Truesight, on 19 February 2013 - 11:57 PM, said:

Do you want to say, that ecm should not affect Streak missiles?

ECM should just operate as Canon states. Which in this case means Streak & LRMs should be unaffected by ECM.

[liku]

Mal, on 19 February 2013 - 11:14 PM, said:

Direct fire already counters ECM...point gauss rifle, AC, Laser, etc.. At 'Mech, pull trigger, note how ECM doesn't effect fired shots.

Direct fire is like violence, if it didnt solve your problems (ecm) it is because you dont use enough of it!






by the way ecm..is only 3 pts

[Alvor]

Mal, on 20 February 2013 - 12:11 AM, said:

Repeat the steps I listed, till ECM carrying 'Mech is destroyed..ECM now countered by direct fire


I'm a long time TT fan, but, the changes PGI has had to make to go from 10 second turns, to a RTS style game, have moved it far enough away from TT rules, that I think expecting things to behave like they did in TT...isn't realistic now.

I appreciate your stand point and humor.

I understand some adjustments are needed for real time simulations. However canon should be observed as much as possible other wise just do not use the franchise at all if devs want to just produce anything they want.

Many people play and spend $$$ based on the promise this will be MW/BT not some generic Big Bots N Gunz Black Ops8.

Note I am not just talking about TT but Canon though those TT rules are a great base and usually can easily translated to real time.

Mind that this game been reproduced multiple times on PC/VG with varying levels of success. Even CW has already been done on BTO.