106 replies to this topic

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

Somewhere along the development process PGI decided to make autocannons fire a single slug to deliver damage rather than a short burst.
While this is okay for smaller autocannons it does make things bad with the AC/20.

[kiltymonroe]

CG Oglethorpe Kerensky, on 26 March 2013 - 04:58 AM, said:

Somewhere along the development process PGI decided to make autocannons fire a single slug to deliver damage rather than a short burst.
While this is okay for smaller autocannons it does make things bad with the AC/20.

It kinda has to to be a viable alternative to the Gauss Rifle.

[Rushin Roulette]

[Veebora]

I assure that my 6 SRM6 Catalpult can kill your Awesome faster than the Dual AC20.

But as the dual AC20 I have a lot of drawbacks on my Catapult, as it is a very specialized short range boat.

Hard to hit scouts and unable to fight long range.

[Flapdrol]

Mazzyplz, on 25 March 2013 - 09:20 PM, said:

i am not joking, i am not kidding, balance has broken big time.

There was balance?

[Edustaja]

The double AC20 with XL is the only thing the jager has going for it so let it be
You can headshot or side torso them easily so it's no problem really.
It's bit like the splatcats and gausscats of old but not as bad.

[Paula Fry]

60 Torso Armor plus internal ain't 120 .,3x40 Dmg...., whats your Point? I would rage if it didnt kill Awsome with 3 shots.Cause thats what it suposed to do!

[HighTest]

I still think that every mech in the game should be 50 tons, run at 64.8 kph, have 300 armor, and have a single medium laser. Then it might finally stop the QQing on the boards about everything being overpowered.

Hmm. Maybe we'll need to get rid of camo and colors too -- I bet the red ones will be overpowered in some people's eyes...

I don't own a Jagermech at all, much less an AC20 one. But I too got killed by one on the weekend. Guess what -- it was entirely my fault. I attacked it at close-range it without checking its loadout first. It was only once I was getting rocked that I realized what it had. Does that make it OP? Uh, no.

It's a perfectly valid build. Take the same 2 mechs and stick my 3xUAC5 Iya and him in the middle of Alpine peaks, I bet he doesn't even get close enough to fire a shot before I have it shredded it to pieces.

There are no overpowered mechs (OK, except for when the missile glitch was in effect a couple of weeks ago). There are only underpowered tactics.

[Divine Decoy]

Veebora, on 26 March 2013 - 05:20 AM, said:

I assure that my 6 SRM6 Catalpult can kill your Awesome faster than the Dual AC20.

But as the dual AC20 I have a lot of drawbacks on my Catapult, as it is a very specialized short range boat.

Hard to hit scouts and unable to fight long range.

TRUE, lots of drawbacks to K2 AC40 build, NONE on the Jager builds. Kill faster then srm5.... I don't know, the spread of srms and their nerf would negate that. However splatcats are faster then k2 ac20s....

Edustaja, on 26 March 2013 - 05:47 AM, said:

The double AC20 with XL is the only thing the jager has going for it so let it be
You can headshot or side torso them easily so it's no problem really.
It's bit like the splatcats and gausscats of old but not as bad.

THE ONLY THING?!? 6 AC2s ring a bell? How about it having as much firepower as a phract stock with better vertical aiming? It turns faster and moves faster then a phract and what, is 5 tons lighter?

Do not forget, ALL Jagers can cary the AC20 build, so that means you need to keep your distance from ALL of them, BUT all of them can carry a HUGE amount of long range damage (6 ac2s, ultra ac5s with LRMS [even though they nerfed and pose no real threat] Gauss with ERPPCs, etc). chew on that logic. Jagers having ac20s is too much.

FYI, ALL non-light builds are a lights wet hunting dream to above post.... only another vote for light vs light weight matching [no more commandos vs ravens cuz someone brought a stalker so i guess we'll give the other team 2 ravens....]

[Divine Decoy]

HighTest, on 26 March 2013 - 06:04 AM, said:

There are no overpowered mechs (OK, except for when the missile glitch was in effect a couple of weeks ago). There are only underpowered tactics.

ONCE AGAIN, another vote for "PUG teamplay broken" implement drop lobby (like Navy Field does) and in game Voice chat/voice commands (like World of Tank and Warthunder do). Testing team communication and play against the PUG that gets the lucky 2 ecms and 3 mixed spec jagers would be nice. (Man, testing that when you in a PUG against a 4 player group would be nice) MIGHT go a long way....... but no promises

[xZaOx]

How about you stay out of its short range? Remember a game called rock paper scissors? There is always a counter, and whining isnt one.

[AsakuraZero]

XL engine 48 armor in side torsos, nuff said ITS THAT TOO HARD TO THINK?, or geez get behind it and light the 12 points or so of rear armor >_> GEEZ.

learning to spread damage works wonders too!

[Mr Blonde]

I don't know who these mighty Jagermech pilots are who can destroy all they survey with their two AC/20's. I see this build a lot and as long as you don't stand motionless in front of it, I almost pity the pilot before destroying his side rear torso and eliminating him. Especially in my Spider 5D, circle-strafing such a mech is so easy it's difficult not to fall asleep while doing it. I have 3 ML, tha's enough to go internal on the side torso rear on the first hit. I don't think one has hit me yet. If I don't have the time for that, I just sit in his rear and core out the side torso, since he invariably has an XL. I tried the AC/20 cat myself back in the day and was unimpressed. I'm even less impressed with an anti-aircraft mech that's fitted with short-range bunker busters and nothing else. What's OP is stuff like that Spider. In TT Battletech a single AC/20 hit to a pristine leg would nearly core a Spider, and if it was like that I wouldn't dare approach such a mech as bravely. As it stands I could survive a leg hit and keep runnin' at 150 KPH, and he will never get a second chance at it. I put this build up there with my Jagermech with 4 Ultra 5's...it's fun to show that it can actually be done, and dream of its theoretical awesomeness, but in the field it gets eaten for lunch by anyone with any time under their belt and decent speed. Good lord, it turns so slow! Give me my Cataphract 1X against any Jagermech, any time.

[Divine Decoy]

AsakuraZero, on 26 March 2013 - 06:56 AM, said:

XL engine 48 armor in side torsos, nuff said ITS THAT TOO HARD TO THINK?, or geez get behind it and light the 12 points or so of rear armor >_> GEEZ.

learning to spread damage works wonders too!

LOL of course, get behind it.... how it moves and turns faster then most other mechs? Lights have field days, everyone else dies been that way since closed beta. that isn't addressing the issue of their speed making them unbalanced. the tactics are the same for K2 ac20 BUT you can actually do them, not on a Jager who can close teh distance OR keep facing you (faster speed = faster turning in place too you know)

[Royalewithcheese]

I think the real question here is what weapons is this awesome running to be apparently incapable of dealing 70-80 pinpoint in 3 alphas?

[Tenzek]

Divine Decoy, on 25 March 2013 - 09:51 PM, said:

hmmm, a quick match i did realize something wrong here, Jager ac20s can go fast (between 64 to 90 kph) while ac20 cats are always below 64 (due to not fitting XL engines). SO, that in mind, YES the Jager AC20 is unbalanced. When one can CHARGE most ANY stock mech of any size and deal that much damage with nearly full armor.... SICK!! Not the cool kind either, but the annoying, tilt the balance as much as an enemy team with nearly ALL ECM mechs sick...

To this realization (and how EVERYONE runs them more then the old streak/splat cat) does need to be looked into. Make the arms not fit AC20s would solve it all. CASE CLOSED.

There is no way a JM can go 90 kph even with the top engine and speed tweak. Taking the top engine is possible with AC 20, but you'd have to give up a lot of armor or take very little ammo. Then you'd be doing around 84 kph, I believe (with ST). The AWS that can fit the larger engines are actually faster than the JM can be.

If you see an AC/20 JM that isn't crawling at 45-50 kph, that means you know it will die if you destroy either side torso.

Yes, they're dangerous if you let them sneak up on you and get in close quarters uncontested. That's the focus of their weapons, but they might as well not shoot at medium range.

[Divine Decoy]

Royalewithcheese, on 26 March 2013 - 07:27 AM, said:

I think the real question here is what weapons is this awesome running to be apparently incapable of dealing 70-80 pinpoint in 3 alphas?

LOL what awesome (or non-cheese build for that matter) mech deals 70-80 pinpoint damage in 3 alphas? 6 LLs come close to 100 dmg in 2 or 3 alphas, but that isn't pinpoint. 2 AC20s deal 80 single location dmg in 2 alphas..... Cheese is cheese, don't make it replace the whole burger as it is doing...

K2 cheese, easy spot, slow easy to deal with.
Jager CHeese = kill you even in a good fight cholesterol cheese.

JM fine for moment, but will start to kill gameplay like the old jenners did in Closed Beta.

Edited by Divine Decoy, 26 March 2013 - 08:54 AM.

[Royalewithcheese]

Divine Decoy, on 26 March 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

LOL what awesome (or non-cheese build for that matter) mech deals 70-80 pinpoint damage in 3 alphas? 6 LLs come close to 100 dmg in 2 or 3 alphas, but that isn't pinpoint. 2 AC20s deal 80 single location dmg in 2 alphas..... Cheese is cheese, don't make it replace the whole burger as it is doing...

K2 cheese, easy spot, slow easy to deal with.
Jager CHeese = kill you even in a good fight cholesterol cheese.

JM fine for moment, but will start to kill gameplay like the old jenners did in Closed Beta.

6LL can do 60-70 damage to what you're trying to kill in 2 alphas, assuming you can track reasonably well. It can do 60 in one alpha with perfect tracking, but even with ~70% accuracy on the elephant ear you're trying to shoot that's a 2-alpha kill. The Awesome is kind of a terrible robot in general, but it's not that terrible. Even though it has bad hitboxes and is out-competed by the Stalker, at the end of the day it's still an 80-ton weapon platform.

[Capp]

Divine Decoy, on 26 March 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

LOL what awesome (or non-cheese build for that matter) mech deals 70-80 pinpoint damage in 3 alphas?
[snip]

3 PPCs

[TexAce]

3 shots? Man, thats what? 7 seconds?

If you can't move your CT out of the LOS in 7 seconds you shouldn't play this game.

Ever heard of torso twisting?

No?

Well then I'll counter with this: I can kill XL Jägers in ONE SECOND, I only need to shoot their rear side torso once.

Edited by TexAss, 26 March 2013 - 09:42 AM.