64 replies to this topic

[Eleshod]

Topic says it all, which catapult makes the best long range artillery?

The A1 seems like the main LRM boat, but I see alot of people simply running it splat-cat style.
The C1 looks like it has a bit of close range support and the ability to run a tag. But it's lacking in missile points
Then lastly the C4 looks like a mix of the first 2 with a bit more missile, tag abilty

I own the K2 and i'm slowly becoming a big catapult fan.

Any info from some artillery vets would be greatly appreciated.

[Ewigan]

Well, the A1 is a gimmicky mech. If you play with a corps on comms it's awesome with its LRMs. Especially if you use alls LRMs as 5er and chainfire them. poor guys who get those barrages...

otherwise the C1 with 2 LRM15 (+artemis) added TAG and some backup mediums is great.

[mailin]

I have seen some successfully run an A1 with a combination of LRMs and SRMs, or maybe streaks. But due to the lack of energy points the C1 loaded out as Ewigan suggests is the better way to go. I really like TAG + Artemis on my LRM mechs.

[Alistair Winter]

If you're playing alone, I would say the C1 is the best compromise. It lets you have both LRMs, TAG and enough energy weapons to defend yourself.

If you're a good player, you can play alone with the C4, as it can have TAG and LRMs, combined with perhaps a couple of SRMs and a medium laser. It makes a good LRM20-platform, if you manage to stay out of trouble.

If you're playing with a team who can spot targets for you, then the A1 is a possibility. But you live and die depending on your teammates.

I'd go for the C1.

[Eleshod]

Hm, though I don't entirely like the lack of pods on the C1 it seems like the majority prefer it.

Can it still surpress effectively even with an LRM 30+A set up?

[627]

sure, why not? 30 missiles are 30 missiles.

you can go further, but not with 4 energy slots. 4xLRM15 is possible on C4 and A1.

And at the moment, i think about something like this:
CPLT-A1 6x LRM10

Just theory, but i'm tempted to drop artemis and try this. I saw many 6xlrm5 chainfire guys, i wonder if chaining 6 LRM10 will be viable or just to hot and to slow for constant stream...

[Autobot9000]

I am running a C1 with this loadout:

XL275 engine
Endosteel
14DHS
2x LRM15 /Artemis (lots of ammo)
TAG
3x Medium Pulse Laser

The medium pulses are the ideal counterpart to your LRMs, since their effective range ends exactly where the LRMs effective range begins. This mech is from my POV the ideal LRM Catapult for pugs. HOWEVER, if you should play this in a premade....

The you probably want a C4, since the double LRM20 really pack a harder punch. You can still mount that TAG and a single MPL, but you definitly lose that self-defense capability, that the C1 has. IMO the C4 is the better mech for a premade.

[Autobot9000]

I forgot to mention: The A1 variant has a significant disadvantage: Once your arms are (=those huge LRM launcher boxes on your shoulders) you are completely disarmed. You should always take that into consideration, it will kill a couple of games for you. Even if you just lose one of your arms (happens frequently) you will be at 50% efficiency. That's why I think the C4 and C1 are more reliable as well (although I do own an A1 myself too).

[Hex Pallett]

C1. LRM-midfielder can get better than this.

[DEMAX51]

As others have pointed out as well, I think the C1 with twin Artemis 15s, TAG, 2 jump jets and 3ML is a great all-around LRM build.

If you've got line of sight on your target the Artemis & TAG combo sends your missiles straight at their core, and if your arms get blown off or when you run out of ammo the 3 MLs can still pack a pretty decent punch - especially late in games when most 'Mechs are already beaten up.

Edit: Concerning this build with 3MPLs vs 3MLs...

1. I think the pulses are a little too hot to use the lasers in conjunction with the LRMs - which is a nice way to add damage directly to the CT of targets to whom you have LoS.

2. Once you're disarmed or out of LRM ammo, it's nice to have the added range standard MLs give you. With the Catapult's CT being pretty fragile, it's best to be able to fire from the sidelines instead of having to get up-close and personal.

3. MPLs would take up 3 extra tonnes you could use for more LRM ammo, a bigger engine, or maybe a jump jet or two.

Edited by DEMAX51, 10 September 2013 - 12:49 PM.

[Autobot9000]

@Demax51
My build is well tested, although you can also play with MLs instead of MPLs ammo and heat are no problem in my build, which is well practice tested and not just theory craft:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...0fbee52c38f5e16

I play my catapult quite aggressively, showing up at 600 meters, TAGing my targets and launching away. Some try to close in but most die on the way. The MPLs are just too nice to give up for me

[DEMAX51]

Autobot9000, on 10 September 2013 - 12:57 PM, said:

@Demax51
The MPLs are just too nice to give up for me

I hate sounding like a teacher, but can you "unpack" that statement? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just asking you to convice me (and, more importantly, the OP who is asking for advice) why you're right.

What do you like about the MPLs? What advantages do they give you? What do you dislike about the standard lasers?

[ValdnadHartagga]

DEMAX51, on 10 September 2013 - 01:34 PM, said:

What do you like about the MPLs? What advantages do they give you? What do you dislike about the standard lasers?

For me, I need my Catapult to boogie as quickly as possible - if I need to fire my MPLAS, it means my CT and head (and pretty much the rest of me) are exposed. Then I can either twist to spread out incoming damage or have a split second to get away faster.

I also play aggressively in a multirole support fashion. I start at long range, move to medium range and skirmish, then finish off at close range towards the end of the match.

My build: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...3bd34f3ac8fc2e5

I also run 360 Retention (so my Streaks can keep up with lights circling me), Advanced Sensor, and Advanced Decay. Along with BAP and TAG, the instant I pick up a target I can lock and fire. My favorite attack is to approach to 300m, hit the jump jets (or leap off of something), and alpha (and on principle, I always alpha when possible below 250m).

Edited by ValdnadHartagga, 10 September 2013 - 01:47 PM.

[Autobot9000]

DEMAX51, on 10 September 2013 - 01:34 PM, said:

I hate sounding like a teacher, but can you "unpack" that statement? I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just asking you to convice me (and, more importantly, the OP who is asking for advice) why you're right.

What do you like about the MPLs? What advantages do they give you? What do you dislike about the standard lasers?

Sure, absolutely no shame here. I think MLs are fine, but MPLs are better in close combat, hence for self-defense. As valdnad pointed out I can torso twist faster, if it comes to a brawl (which I am obviously trying not to force). Also I think I posted the build slightly inaccurate. After having a look at my mech bay it turns out I play without AMS:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...c7c2085b3284d20

I can elaborate on execution of the build:
Hit and run with LRM certainly possible with TAG: You get the lock on so fast, you can fire away rightaway. I hvae the mobility on this build to play as a laid back second liner. I hate shooting LRMs blindly. I let the assaults pick their targets and stay right behind them or go on the hunt on the flanks. As I am playing aggressively I absolutely need a solid self-defense weapon. Here MPLs just punch harder on my target and I can afford the heat with 15 DHS no problem. As a last thing on my build I have no crit spaces left, so choosing 3 MLs instead of MPLs would mean I would need to take a 300XL, but I don't need the speed, since I am fast enough and not brawling.

[Scav3ng3r]

My Founders CPLT-C1 build. Replace a MLas with a TAG, and 2 JJ's for an additional ton of ammo if so desired.

I like this build because when I have LOS I can LL and LRM, and fall back on my LL's and MLas' in short range. Runs a bit hot, so you don't wanna alpha alpha alpha, but it's quite manageable.

Like Autobot9000 mentioned in his build, the point of this build is to allow mobility. With Speed Tweak you'll cruise around at a cool 74 KPH, while Jump Jets allow you to quickly change elevation without too much effort, and also allows you to poptart LuRM. While you're prolly thinking to yourself 4 tons isn't a lot of ammo, it'll last you longer than you think it will especially if you don't waste shots, and the LL's and MLas' + engine size allow you to be a surprisingly decent brawler.

(I've actually been thinking for a long time now to replace a MLas with a TAG, but... thats damage lost when I am out of LuRM's, and Artemis + LL more than makes up for TAG IMO)

[Koniving]

The C1 and C4 are both ideal for this role. The A1 had potential, and it got lost with the heat scale system. Plus after an art and programming overpass on the Catapults, the "I can spam 90 LRMs out of 30 tubes at the same time" thing will disappear.

The C1 can defend itself better.

Edited by Koniving, 10 September 2013 - 03:33 PM.

[Modo44]

I think any of them can be good if you don't try to be gimmicky. Take 2x[whatever LRM fits], add Artemis and BAP, put in some Jump Jets, then fill in the ammo, engine, and support weapons (lasers or streaks respectively). Contrary to popular belief, you can do just fine without TAG in PUG games.

A1: 2xLRM15+4xSSRM2
C1: 2xLRM15+TAG+3xML
C4: 2xLRM20+2xSSRM2+2xML

In addition to LRM support, the C1 can be a decent brawler if you fill it up with LLs, SRMs, and jjs for jump-sniping/dodging (3 at least).

Edited by Modo44, 11 September 2013 - 06:52 AM.

[DEMAX51]

Modo44, on 10 September 2013 - 09:17 PM, said:

A1: 2xLRM15+4xSSRM2

It's not technically an LRM boat, but I love to play the -A1 with 1 LRM 15 and 5 streaks - it's an awesome mid-range 'Mech.

[Cybertek]

I personally like the A1 the best out of my Catapults. It is running 6 LRM5s and I usually run chainfire however do have my right mouse button set to fire all if needed. As people have said though you live by and die your teammates, I have had matches where I did great but at soon as enemy forces break trhough the brawlers of if your team gets to spread out then your basically done. Other items I run are Atremis, and BAP. The Modules are Target retention, adv sensor range, and target information. In good matches I can kill 2-3 mechs with it. It is a challange as when you start streaming those missiles you are easy to be located and expect their lights to come find you, or their missiles. The top speed on my mech is 80.1kph, and have 2 jump jets which are a necessity, I have escaped from being attacked only to turn around and kill the person I escaped from. Overall it is a really fun design, although I have been accused of being a hacker, using aimbot, plus a whole ton of other things, but I still love it.

[DEMAX51]

Cybertek, on 11 September 2013 - 08:44 AM, said:

I personally like the A1 the best out of my Catapults. It is running 6 LRM5s and I usually run chainfire however do have my right mouse button set to fire all if needed. As people have said though you live by and die your teammates, I have had matches where I did great but at soon as enemy forces break trhough the brawlers of if your team gets to spread out then your basically done. Other items I run are Atremis, and BAP. The Modules are Target retention, adv sensor range, and target information. In good matches I can kill 2-3 mechs with it. It is a challange as when you start streaming those missiles you are easy to be located and expect their lights to come find you, or their missiles. The top speed on my mech is 80.1kph, and have 2 jump jets which are a necessity, I have escaped from being attacked only to turn around and kill the person I escaped from. Overall it is a really fun design, although I have been accused of being a hacker, using aimbot, plus a whole ton of other things, but I still love it.

Target Info Gathering does literally nothing to help an LRM boat (because you can't target specific components with LRMs) unless you're just conveying that information to your teammates on comms or something. You'd be better off with Seismic, 360 Target Retention, or a UAV consumable or something.

Who accuses an LRM boat of being an aimbotter?