229 replies to this topic

[Serapth]

ilKhan Ryno, on 04 March 2013 - 01:55 PM, said:

I believe that being able to view others stats would be nice. It is basic track record of how they perform. I would like more stats. Add Favorite Weapon or Most Used Chassis or Heat Generated/Heat Dispersed. Pehaps Times Overheated or AC Rounds Fired. Make it more in-depth!

IMO: Anyone who wants it private and not share stats is:
A.) Hacker - "Hide my ridicoulous KDR plz!"
B.) Ashamed - "I'm soooo horribad, don't look!"
C.) Introverted - "I drop alone, dont want to join a group, Leave me alone!"

D. ) Doesn't want to see the game ruined by statwhores.

[Max Power]

About to? Dude, this thread is months late.

[Terror Teddy]

ilKhan Ryno, on 04 March 2013 - 01:55 PM, said:

I believe that being able to view others stats would be nice. It is basic track record of how they perform. I would like more stats. Add Favorite Weapon or Most Used Chassis or Heat Generated/Heat Dispersed. Pehaps Times Overheated or AC Rounds Fired. Make it more in-depth!

IMO: Anyone who wants it private and not share stats is:
A.) Hacker - "Hide my ridicoulous KDR plz!"
B.) Ashamed - "I'm soooo horribad, don't look!"
C.) Introverted - "I drop alone, dont want to join a group, Leave me alone!"

Or perhaps simply dont want ****** comments from people believing themselves so much better due to some statistics only showing half the facts.

Let's take an example
-BF3, 2 guys dies 20 times in a row to cap a point to bring the team forward, got 1-2 kills for that part of the match but the TEAM made it to the next part and some heavy weapon guy and sniper got the most kills.

By looking at that data you'd think what ****** players those 2 guys are but would be impressed by the sniper and heavy weapon dude.

Its simply numbers that in their essence are innacurate.

[Lycrin]

I agree, pay to win consumables and detailing stats have the power to ruin this game. I know in the case of detailed stats it doesn't even matter if you care about your k/d ratio. The problem with it is that other people will care too much about their k/d ratios. Because of this you'll have people who not only take a Call of Duty lone wolf bs attitude against cooperation and team play but will even care so much about their stats that they will find ways to use hacks and cheats like aim botting that is rampant in other free-to-play MMOs. I know I've been saying this alot, but anyone who has ever played APB: reloaded in it's early stages will know what I mean. And mainly I stress this because I love this game and I don't want anything to happen that will hurt this game and it's player community.

[Dataman]

ilKhan Ryno, on 04 March 2013 - 01:55 PM, said:

I believe that being able to view others stats would be nice. It is basic track record of how they perform. I would like more stats. Add Favorite Weapon or Most Used Chassis or Heat Generated/Heat Dispersed. Pehaps Times Overheated or AC Rounds Fired. Make it more in-depth!

IMO: Anyone who wants it private and not share stats is:
A.) Hacker - "Hide my ridicoulous KDR plz!"
B.) Ashamed - "I'm soooo horribad, don't look!"
C.) Introverted - "I drop alone, dont want to join a group, Leave me alone!"

well I try to avoid the e-peen. Got enough of that **** in BF3 and other MMOFPS.

why people care about looking other stats? to make the feeling he's not the worst player? a requirement to join most elite guild/clan?

I play well... I shoot well... I win (and lose) and that's all that matters.

Edited by Dataman, 04 March 2013 - 02:05 PM.

[Terror Teddy]

Technically speaking all we need is:

Battles won
Battles lost
Total XP

Ok, it's a little stats but not even THAT tells the whole story and reduce the "I must have a positive K/D ratio or I suck" mentality

[Jetfire]

I really hope that the stats that are made public are purely linked to some sort of ranked matches. If I am leveling through new mechs or mediocre variants it hardly makes sense to care what my stats are.

[Ghogiel]

Serapth, on 04 March 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

D. ) Doesn't want to see the game ruined by statwhores.

If you care about your stats so much, they must be good.

[p00k]

Terror Teddy, on 04 March 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

Let's take an example
-BF3, 2 guys dies 20 times in a row to cap a point to bring the team forward, got 1-2 kills for that part of the match but the TEAM made it to the next part and some heavy weapon guy and sniper got the most kills.

By looking at that data you'd think what ****** players those 2 guys are but would be impressed by the sniper and heavy weapon dude.

Its simply numbers that in their essence are innacurate.

not really, since they get points for capping, and their stats show how many caps each person has. more stats, not less. when the only stats you have are k/d and w/l, people play to kill more and die less, win more and lose less. let us see how many base caps someone has, how many assists, how many resource point caps, spotting assists, etc., and you'll see players valuing those behaviors more as well

[POWR]

I have over 120 hours of Battlefield 3 played. I enjoy looking at the ridiculous collection of stats for everything. How often have I looked at anyone else's stats? I think that can be counted on two hands. How often have I seen anyone berate anyone else for sucking in a context other than the immediate match trashtalk? Never.

I don't think you have any reason to fear public stats.

[Kyone Akashi]

Terror Teddy, on 04 March 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

Or perhaps simply dont want ****** comments from people believing themselves so much better due to some statistics only showing half the facts.

But we already have people who regularly post screenshots of their K/D ratio in the forum.

Aside from sating curiosity regarding other community members' favored loadouts and victories, full publication of stats would chiefly result in allowing any of us to see where another players' opinion on controversial issues may result from (meaning: a better identification of bias).

[Serapth]

Ghogiel, on 04 March 2013 - 02:13 PM, said:

If you care about your stats so much, they must be good.

Are you trying to be intentionally thick, or just failing at reading comprehension.

This has NOTHING to do with my stats, or the stats of others, and everything to do with the underlying motivations and the effects it will have on this game.

We already saw people DCing to preserve their precious KDR, even before KDR was made public. Pushing stats even more is just going to make things worse. More min/maxing, more exploiting of whatever loopholes currently exist, etc. Even worse, they will make aspects of the game that are poorly captured with stats ( such as base capping in conquest, or tag'ing, etc ) even less appealing.

[Acid Phase]

Yea....I'm not feeling public stats at all. Welcomes too many job-less / life-less individuals claiming thier piece are bigger than everybody else. No thanks.

[SpiralRazor]

Serapth, on 04 March 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

I just finished reading through the March roadmap and things look pretty good with two possible exceptions. One everybody has already been talking about... consumables and the potential for P2W. This is one of those things that we have to take a wait and see approach.

The other major thing I saw in the update, something I think will massively hurt MWO as a game and as a community was this line:

For now, these stats are only viewable by individual players. In future updates players will be able to see other player's stats and leaderboards.


Please god no. People already game the system bad enough for their KDR, and people can't even see it yet!


I frankly find the e-peen waving in this game bad enough, but my god, this potential change could make it downright unbearable.

Anyone else really not looking forward to public stats and leaderboards?

Too bad..you have to be able to see your stats and other players to make informed competitive team decisions.

[Serapth]

SpiralRazor, on 04 March 2013 - 02:21 PM, said:

Too bad..you have to be able to see your stats and other players to make informed competitive team decisions.

SpiralRazor, on 04 March 2013 - 02:21 PM, said:

Too bad..you have to be able to see your stats and other players to make informed competitive team decisions.

Then make a ranked leaderboard, and keep stats for it. If you want to keep all the statwhores in the same playground, that's fine by me. Just keep it out of the main game. The vast majority of us PUG or premade casually and couldn't really give a damn about the things the competitive teams do.

Keep it separate or don't do it at all.


EDIT: WTF is up with the forum software double quoting everything all of a sudden?

Edited by Serapth, 04 March 2013 - 02:23 PM.

[Kyone Akashi]

Serapth, on 04 March 2013 - 02:19 PM, said:

We already saw people DCing to preserve their precious KDR, even before KDR was made public.

I admit, that is a rather good point.

Personally, I'm mostly interested in people's BattleMechs and loadouts rather than their precious K/D. I've fallen prey to actually feeling pride or frustration due to how some matches would affect my stats myself (although I'd never stoop so low as to stage a connection loss) ... the temptation is there; the human spirit is very competitive.

[Rakashan]

Serapth, on 04 March 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

The other major thing I saw in the update, something I think will massively hurt MWO as a game and as a community was this line:

For now, these stats are only viewable by individual players. In future updates players will be able to see other player's stats and leaderboards.


Please god no. People already game the system bad enough for their KDR, and people can't even see it yet!

Anyone else really not looking forward to public stats and leaderboards?

That depends entirely on what the stats are and whether or not they are meaningful.

LRM accuracy, Gauss Accuracy, etc. Those are meaningful. If your LRM accuracy is 30% or lower then you really, really need to figure out what is going on or quit bringing them. If your Gauss accuracy is 15% then go practice. And unless they make it possible to change your numbers in a Practice Ground or by hitting a friendly target there's no gaming the numbers without actually hurting enemy mechs.

KDR? Please just delete this column from your database. It says very little about whether or not you are contributing to your team or not. It correlates badly to anything useful. Assists might be more useful but not terribly as evidenced by the "Mount a ML on your mech and tag opponents Challenge". Components destroyed is probably the most meaningful of these but is still not perfect.

So yeah, stats don't bother me. They just need to be meaningful stats. When I was raidleading in MMOs I would happily bench the highest DPS in the raid if they could not interrupt because I need what contributes to a team win, not just a specific number. I can't tell you the best metric for MWO yet but I can sure smell some stinkers out there already.

Edited by Rakashan, 04 March 2013 - 02:32 PM.

[StonedDead]

I don't care one way or the other about stats. I do care about the consumables. I would not like this game if it turned into Call of Mech Duty. I would then regret having spent any money on it at all. We don't need coolant flush for sure, it's a bad idea to flush all your coolant out when that is what is cooling the heatsinks don't ya think? If it instead refreshes the coolant, that would take weight right? Because it would have to store all that extra coolant. You want airstrikes or arty support? Give us the vehicles, screw the modules. (Disclaimer: this is my opinion, I hate COD.)

[Serapth]

Kyone Akashi, on 04 March 2013 - 02:26 PM, said:

I admit, that is a rather good point.

Personally, I'm mostly interested in people's BattleMechs and loadouts rather than their precious K/D. I've fallen prey to actually feeling pride or frustration due to how some matches would affect my stats myself (although I'd never stoop so low as to stage a connection loss) ... the temptation is there; the human spirit is very competitive.

Oh I get that completely, notice how im not complaining about the upcoming leaderboards. People want to rate themselves against other people, that's only natural. A leaderboard is a good way to do it, especially when it's opt in, for those (probably majority?) of people that simply don't want to participate.

But opening up a variety of stats, especially without context, thats just a road to hell.

[Mister Blastman]

Serapth, on 04 March 2013 - 01:08 PM, said:

And this is the attitude that makes me despise stats... Stats mean NOTHING without context. I notice a clan image in your sig ( once my eyes stopped bleeding that is ). Generally this means you play in a group I assume? With 4-men over comms against PUGs or 8-men against other 8-men groups?

'cause each one of those is a vastly different game with a vastly different impact on a player's stats. If you play 100% 8-man group and you have KDR ration of 4 to 1, that's damned impressive. If you play 8 man drops against PUGs, that KDR is... sad really.

That's the thing though, people will take the path of least resistance towards building that KDR (or whatever other stat ) value up, to the ultimate loss of the game in general. Remember the masses of people disconnecting to preserve their KDR... a KDR we couldn't even see yet? That's about to get 100x worse.

I drop solo a lot, too. I put my KDR on the line for the prospect of competitive, skillful combat. I'll gladly duel /anyone/ in any drop, anytime. Solo. Even if it is an 8-man. My group loves to obey the rules of zellbrigen. Honorable combat is the best.