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Lrms Need A Nerf Now


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#201 Forestal

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 12:01 AM

View PostKoniving, on 19 March 2013 - 11:26 PM, said:


Been playing. Played as an LRM Awesome, as a Cataphract, and as a LRM Raven. In fact playing as an LRM Commando as we speak. My damage output hasn't really changed at all. Just less ECM out in the field. More boats. Then again I haven't been using Artemis. So perhaps that has something to do with it? So far anyone I've seen with standard LRMs hasn't done all that great without a group of LRM boats to support 'em.

I second that-- got my old lrm (NO Artemis) config out for a spin, and my stats are still entirely team-dependent as a support build....

I could land some decent volleys if my team had my target CONSISTENTLY tagged and/or tied-up in a brawl-- otherwise, I haven't seen those magical full-armor stripping kill-shots with my 2 x lrm 15, even on the lights (they probably just ran away/ got under cover)...


Though I can report to splash AREA seems to have widened, as my volleying a oranged/yellowed mech will often result in multiple "hits":

E.g.
"component destroyed"
"component destroyed"
"kill assist"

I've never found it that easy to destroyed multiple components with lrm volleys before.

Edited by Forestal, 21 March 2013 - 12:05 AM.


#202 TechKiller

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 12:02 AM

LRM now it's hell -(
I think now I can nothing to do here because of LRM...
I'll wait for some new patch where it will be fixed.

#203 Lyrik

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 12:07 AM

They will bring a hotfix in the next days... oh and stay in cover :-P

#204 Forestal

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 12:27 AM

View PostTechKiller, on 21 March 2013 - 12:02 AM, said:

LRM now it's hell -(
I think now I can nothing to do here because of LRM...
I'll wait for some new patch where it will be fixed.

I hate to ask the obvious, but hell FOR whom?

If you guys want the Devs to actually BALANCE the game, you gotta specify what/how you are playing-- cos they cannot work out how to nerf lrms, until they know whom/what lrms should be getting nerfed FOR.


I mean, I haven't needed to change my sniper play-style at all-- though as a support build, my ratios are of course completely team-dependent... e.g. I do best there's a good mix of ecm and/or assaults/brawlers, whether or not the other side (or my side) is lrm-boating.

So I'd just like to ask, cos lrm-boating doesn't affect my play-style one way or another: is there some kind of majority or consensus in MWO forum community that lrms-- when NOT countered by ecm/ cover/ etc.-- should never be able to one/two-shot a mech or be the "decider" of the battle?


I mean, I know some players who believe the "end-game" of any match should be a brawl and consider victory by capping "lame"-- meaning that victory/death by anything else (lrm, sniping, ecm-cover, etc.) are all somehow "illegitimate"...

Edited by Forestal, 21 March 2013 - 12:37 AM.


#205 Ryvucz

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 12:30 AM

http://mwomercs.com/...age-lrmsrmssrm/

#206 Rushin Roulette

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 12:38 AM

View PostProsperity Park, on 20 March 2013 - 11:20 AM, said:

I'd just like to drop in again and provide a link to the new Developer Update on the excessive LRM Damage:
http://mwomercs.com/...srmssrm-update/


Its just a shame, that so many people on these forums really have troubble reading and understanding English... although they seem to have no problems writing in English. I guess this is something for a future dissertation;

"Subjective and situational Internet illiteracy"

Even after the Devs have written, that a hotpatch is going to happen today, people are still whining and complaining that they will stop playing until someone releases information on a hotfix....

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." Albert Einstein


EDIT: Spelling

Edited by Rushin Roulette, 21 March 2013 - 02:09 AM.


#207 Aesthetech

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 01:36 AM

View PostRyvucz, on 21 March 2013 - 12:30 AM, said:



In the meantime they deserve all the heat and discussion conceivable for letting things this gamebreaking slip through their (lack of) internal testing.

#208 Dawnthieve

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 04:49 AM

Didn't read anything. But the title seems appropriate. My Founder's CAT right now is a guarantor of victory. Last match I did 3 kills + 5 assists, 1800 damage. The game before, 6 kills 2 assists 1300 damage. Guys? WTF have you done to the explosive damage?

Edit: bothered to read for 2 mins. well, this hotfix will be necessary.

Edited by Dawnthieve, 21 March 2013 - 04:53 AM.


#209 deputydog

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 07:21 AM

LRMs feel like they did in the old days. I dont know if its the tag making them do so much but its not the artemis. Averaging 500-700 dmg per lrm15 launcher in multiple mechs rightnow per match win or lose. That is self tagging at 180-700 meters usually.
LRms seem to head kill alot as well. It all feels very pre ecm days to me. Even with ecm if you can lock (tag) you utterly destroy anything. Put it back to last patch dmg numbers. or at least split the difference..

#210 Ender Targaryen

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 07:35 AM

View PostAposiopesis, on 21 March 2013 - 01:36 AM, said:

In the meantime they deserve all the heat and discussion conceivable for letting things this gamebreaking slip through their (lack of) internal testing.


Thanks for posting this: I've been looking for an hour about the official statement.
Second, it's not like PGI is EA; they didn't release MWO as a fully-functional game for $60-$80, then lie about all the cover-ups and crash the servers for the first 2 weeks.

A bug slipped in, the game is still in beta, give them a break.

On the plus-side, those of us playing are getting a lot better at dodging LRMs :rolleyes:

#211 Dragunz Pryde

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 08:13 AM

LRM's are a bit silly right now, the splash damage bug is making sure of that. However, it does not change the fact that countering LRM's is the same as it has always been.

1: Use cover, if your standing out in the wide open like a noob you deserve to get rained on!
2: Stay close to an ECM equipped mech. And please if you are an ECM mech especially a light...STAY WITH YOUR
GROUP!! You are much more effective that way than running off scouting....trust me!
3: Equip AMS!! Yes, by itself it is not greatly effective, but if you are with a group, and several mechs have it equipped it can
reduce damage by up to 70%!! 2.5 tons is not allot to sacrifice for damage mitigation.
4: Learn how to flank missile boats! Don't just take cover and sit there, you will be the one getting flanked! Use cover and
try to get around them and bam, the LRM's stop.

#212 The Verge

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 11:08 AM



4man with LRM's...and a raven 3l

WAY TOO MUCH DAMAGE!

;) *don't tell them I was here*

#213 Sunaiac

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 11:48 AM

My last game was a ridiculous missile shower ;)
Ppl have no limits, if something is bugged as hell, let's all use it !!

I'd cancel all points won from missiles to teach them ...

#214 Pedy007

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 01:09 PM

Bye MWO.
Welcome to the LRMonline :blink:.

#215 Peter von Danzig

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 01:12 PM

The thing that scares me is that LRM was and is obviously broken.
The DEVs have to test things they are bringing online.

#216 Atayu

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 02:02 PM

I have to agree with those saying LRMs are way out of balance right now. Before this last patch they were where they should have been. Now they are a must have. Before the last patch I mainly used ballistic and energy weapons and put up good scores. But after this last patch after dieing in about 10 games to LRMs mostly being 1 shotted by them BTW witch never use to happen. I switched to LRM builds witch I do not really enjoy playing. Then it was like lock fire kill, lock fire kill, once in a great while you got a atlas and it was lock, fire, lock fire, kill instead witch is boring and takes very little skill. But if you try to get off shots with direct fire weapons right now you die to LRMs. I have been playing since very early closed beta I have never seen a weapon this out of balance in the game besides maybe the one other time they made LRMs OP but they hot fixed it out of the game very quickly.

#217 xXBagheeraXx

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 04:41 PM

I had a 1.6k damage match in my lrm 50 stalker earlier today...from being on the receiving end and the giving end...THEY ARE OVERPOWERED AS FK. There is a bit too much damage to them, and they focus the damage into only 3 sections mostly...legs and the head...usually the head is gone...my legs are never weak, my stalker runs with about 50 points out of a max of 56, so im not running with thin leg armor. and they are gone in a matter of one salvo. Same story with my arms, nearly max armor and gone in a few hits. And no, i dont stupidly stand in the open and eat missile death (cept that one time I didnt realise it was a premade team on the other side with 3 lrm stalkers and a DD-C covering them....till too late *EVIL!!!*...) and Im usually cored in one good salvo...From the giving side its usually a riot if I catch someone in the open....50lrms into a hunchback with a tag on him will nearly strip all his frontal armor....2 salvoes is death....Sorry kids.. They are bugged, and need to be fixed.

#218 The Verge

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 07:47 PM

I'm so glad this has been fixed

#219 Star Lancer

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Posted 22 March 2013 - 11:20 AM

What they need to do is look back at older Mechwarrior games. The damage ranges for all of the current weapons (minus the missile systems) are exactly the same as titles like Mechwarrior 2: Mercs and MW3. The missile damage in those were 1/missile for LRMs and 2/missile for SRMs. With the correct splash effects, those damage settings would put them just about right with the other weapon systems in the game. That's my 2 cents at any rate.

#220 Lightfoot

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Posted 23 March 2013 - 04:37 PM

View PostStar Lancer, on 22 March 2013 - 11:20 AM, said:

What they need to do is look back at older Mechwarrior games. The damage ranges for all of the current weapons (minus the missile systems) are exactly the same as titles like Mechwarrior 2: Mercs and MW3. The missile damage in those were 1/missile for LRMs and 2/missile for SRMs. With the correct splash effects, those damage settings would put them just about right with the other weapon systems in the game. That's my 2 cents at any rate.


Yes, but the LRMs also worked in MW2 thru MW4 and they don't in MWO. MWO's are flawed in concept and will always be too powerful or too weak. If they are too powerful you get something like the recent bug, if they are too weak you get the laser and AC brawler game like MWO suffers from normally. As opposed to a tactically diverse game that working LRMs bring to MechWarrior.

I will explain.

The problem with MWO LRMs, when they are, "working as planned", is they have to be boated to be worth taking and this is wrong. The reason they need to be boated is because they do primarily area effect damage. Area effect damage would be okay for LRMs, but it will never be balancable in an interactive multiplayer game because you will always get the LRMs before the last hot-fix or after it and neither of those are balanced.

It's like this, guided area effect damage is going to hit, so the only thing left to be adjusted is how much damage they do. That amount is either mechs-go-boom damage or mechs-take-no-real-damage. Neither one is balanced for fair gameplay. Either you are hosing the LRM pilot or the pilot being LRMed.

So to have LRMs worth taking they have to work well and do point damage when using line-of-sight flight paths and do area effect damage with no line of sight. This puts the tactical burden evenly on both pilots and is not unfair to either. It gives LRMs a place to be tactically good, just like an AC20 is tactically good in close range combat. In this way the amount of damage can be balanced with the amount of difficulty, or skill, to use LRMs well.

Before the last LRM Bug, I had reached the point where I refused to use LRMs at all. MWO's LRMs are normally wasted loadout space and useless if you have even a medium skill level at aiming direct fire weapons. The LRM Bug made LRMs overpowered on AoE damage, but they were working about right if that were construed as the Line-of Sight tracking advantage and they were dealing point damage that was balanced, not AoE damage that destroyed everything.

Anyway, during the Bug, I finally saw MWO become a MechWarrior styled tactical combat game instead of Laser-Brawl, even if the bug was terrible. I just took 2 LRM15 and imagined how great MWO could be.





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