163 replies to this topic

[DragonsFire]

Unintended consequences such as the current LRM issue that arose due to a bug being fixed is just a part of the nature of software development. And stuff like that can and does get missed, regardless of the developer and their QA department, no matter how big or small.

We recently addressed a longstanding bug that increased convergence time on BGP. It went out with the most recent software. An unintended and unknown consequence of this was an immense increase in CPU utilization in a number of environments due to timer issues.

No one got fired or even chewed out because the reality of the situation was that it's something that wasn't glaring and was missed. We analyzed the issue and applied a fix to correct it, and CPU utilization is now where it should be.

This is the nature of the beast folks. If you can't understand that or are getting frustrated with the rate or progress, you should take a step back and relax or even take a break from the game. No one is forcing you to play or continue to invest money. A video game, especially one still in development, is not worth getting this worked up over.

[Thorn Hallis]

xDeityx, on 20 March 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

The problem with trivializing people's opinions with the "it's just a game" argument is that it fails to recognize that it is also people's time that is being wasted when PGI makes terrible decisions that set the game back months in the development cycle. People get upset at the senseless waste of time, not at "just a game."

It is peoples decision to waste time or not. If they chose to do so, they have to live with the consequences.

[CMGrendel]

I love the fact that the fanboi response is always, "Don't play then!"

You do realise that if your dreams come true, a handful of sycophants aren't going to keep the data centres open, right?

I mean seriously, you're actually asking people to stop playing the game, rather than have the cheek to feel invested in something that they've invested real money in? Well, that will certainly help the game flourish.

[Kraven Kor]

CMGrendel, on 20 March 2013 - 01:03 PM, said:

I love the fact that the fanboi response is always, "Don't play then!"

You do realise that if your dreams come true, a handful of sycophants aren't going to keep the data centres open, right?

I mean seriously, you're actually asking people to stop playing the game, rather than have the cheek to feel invested in something that they've invested real money in? Well, that will certainly help the game flourish.

We aren't saying "don't play."

We are saying "don't be angry."

If you are angry, about the state of the game, and cannot express this without making disparaging remarks about the devs - which, true or not, are not @#$%ing helping, then GO AWAY until you CALM DOWN and can discuss matters about THIS GAME without making death threats...

[XIRUSPHERE]

You know what's more difficult? Seeing the amount of people here who think that bad customer service should not only be swallowed, but that we should maintain a level of insanity that is reminiscent of Stockholm syndrome. You call a devs job hard, I would be willing to accept that if I actually saw the fruits of said labor. What I see here is a very small team that got enough money to make a AAA title and it seems to have vaporized.

No new blood, no real achievements! The state of this open beta is shameful and in many ways more of an alpha than anything and you want to sing praise? No way in hell should that ever be parroted or accepted, as far as i'm concerned I feel like i'm participating in a scam more than the development of a game and it's up to PGI to show they aren't a bunch of yahoos. Every time one of these mental masturbatory pieces pops up i'm going to tell it how it is. You don't cut slack for people screwing you over, these aren't volunteers or saints these are businessmen and their business stinks thus far.

[Vassago Rain]

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:

You know what's more difficult? Seeing the amount of people here who think that bad customer service should not only be swallowed, but that we should maintain a level of insanity that is reminiscent of Stockholm syndrome. You call a devs job hard, I would be willing to accept that if I actually saw the fruits of said labor. What I see here is a very small team that got enough money to make a AAA title and it seems to have vaporized.

No new blood, no real achievements! The state of this open beta is shameful and in many ways more of an alpha than anything and you want to sing praise? No way in hell should that ever be parroted or accepted, as far as i'm concerned I feel like i'm participating in a scam more than the development of a game and it's up to PGI to show they aren't a bunch of yahoos. Every time one of these mental masturbatory pieces pops up i'm going to tell it how it is. You don't cut slack for people screwing you over, these aren't volunteers or saints these are businessmen and their business stinks thus far.

Fanboys.

[Grraarrgghh]

This thread is filled with the coolest dudes on the forum.

[xDeityx]

Rakashan, on 20 March 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

You reference your personal experience coding (granted you're mirroring the OP in that).

You're on your first sentence and already have shown reading comprehension failure. No, I don't reference coding anywhere, you are inventing that. I claim to be familiar with the development process because I've worked on a project similar to this one, that is all.

Rakashan, on 20 March 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

You then state that PGI has made many mistakes that were avoidable. I agree with that assessment as well. Your inability to look at a small coding shop that has never made a game of this type before and refuse to cut them any slack on those kinds of issues implies that either you have never been in their position (in spite of direct experience in the industry) or that in spite of your personal experience you are unwilling to cut them the slack.

No, I'm not "refusing to cut them any slack" or I wouldn't even be here, I'd be playing a different game and posting in different forums. I'm simply not shoving my nose up their behinds and am calling a spade a spade. They haven't met my expectations for what a professional company with their assets should be delivering. They also aren't totally inexperienced, this isn't even the first game with giant robots that they have made (see Transformers).

Rakashan, on 20 March 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

Did I misunderstand your post? You've done this before and it's so simple that the people at PGI should be able to do it in short order. Balancing PvP is easy. Coding up the engine, finding and fixing bugs and providing new features is trivial. After all, you've been involved in the process and know this for fact, right? Still trying to figure out how I misrepresented your post there. Clearly your experience has been something totally unlike PGI's (and my own) so I'd love to come work with you.

Judging by the other argumentative exchange you've had with Shumabot in this thread, your straw man approach to summarizing what I say, and your hyperbolic claims that I am somehow holding PGI's feet to the fire unjustly simply because I express dissatisfaction with the fact that I was sold one thing and delivered another and I feel like PGI should be doing more with their resources, I can only conclude that you are just looking to get a reaction rather than discuss the topic at hand.

Thorn Hallis, on 20 March 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

It is peoples decision to waste time or not. If they chose to do so, they have to live with the consequences.

And in the same spirit as what you just wrote: it's people's decision to get upset about whatever they choose.

[Davers]

The Double Down is the greatest sandwich ever invented. Replacing bread with chicken is pure genius. I cannot recommend it enough.

[Ordin Hall]

Roland, on 20 March 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Dude, you seriously have no idea what you are talking about.

They obviously didn't BUFF missiles... The fixed a bug, and fixing that had an unintended consequence of making missiles far stronger.

If anything, they made an error in not testing this change. But they obviously didn't intentionally create LRM-ageddon.

Welcome to Piranha Games, where we don't playtest till patch day.

[Kraven Kor]

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:

You know what's more difficult? Seeing the amount of people here who think that bad customer service should not only be swallowed, but that we should maintain a level of insanity that is reminiscent of Stockholm syndrome. You call a devs job hard, I would be willing to accept that if I actually saw the fruits of said labor. What I see here is a very small team that got enough money to make a AAA title and it seems to have vaporized.

No new blood, no real achievements! The state of this open beta is shameful and in many ways more of an alpha than anything and you want to sing praise? No way in hell should that ever be parroted or accepted, as far as i'm concerned I feel like i'm participating in a scam more than the development of a game and it's up to PGI to show they aren't a bunch of yahoos. Every time one of these mental masturbatory pieces pops up i'm going to tell it how it is. You don't cut slack for people screwing you over, these aren't volunteers or saints these are businessmen and their business stinks thus far.

And, even if true, how does constantly blasting them and being completely negative help?

All it is is bad press. So either you vent it, you feel better, and it does nothing, or you are in fact helping dig the gorram hole we find ourselves in (or, rather, that "you" believe we are in.)

You are not helping, basically.

And I'm not a fanboi. I just refuse to post insults and death threats to the devs because this GAME isn't perfectly to my liking.

[xDeityx]

Kraven Kor, on 20 March 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

And, even if true, how does constantly blasting them and being completely negative help?

All it is is bad press. So either you vent it, you feel better, and it does nothing, or you are in fact helping dig the gorram hole we find ourselves in (or, rather, that "you" believe we are in.)

You are not helping, basically.

And I'm not a fanboi. I just refuse to post insults and death threats to the devs because this GAME isn't perfectly to my liking.

I didn't see any insults or death threats in XIRUSPHERE's post. There was one guy ITT who used the phrase "makes me want to kill someone" or something to that effect, which clearly shouldn't be taken seriously. Hyperbole much?

Also, you don't need to point out that it's a game. We know, we play it. You coming here and telling people that they are not allowed to get upset about a game will do as much to change their behavior as all these "death threats" will to change the dev's behavior.

Community outbursts actually do change things, incidentally. Look at the difference between the first coolant flush announcement and the current implementation. You can't give the credit to the devs for responding to the community (which they do deserve credit for) and then ignore the fact that it was the community collectively flipping out that forced them to make the change.

Edited by xDeityx, 20 March 2013 - 01:45 PM.

[Kraven Kor]

And again, feedback is fine.

My comments are only directed at the folks who say things like "PGI sucks," "PGI don't know what they are doing," "PGI doesn't listen to us," "PGI doesn't care," etc.

Complain all you want. I complain too (coolant flush /grrrr).

I just try to do so constructively, and again, without completely blasting the devs or assuming nefarious or malicious intent to every bug or delay or whatever.

Edited by Kraven Kor, 20 March 2013 - 01:47 PM.

[XIRUSPHERE]

Kraven Kor, on 20 March 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

And, even if true, how does constantly blasting them and being completely negative help?

All it is is bad press. So either you vent it, you feel better, and it does nothing, or you are in fact helping dig the gorram hole we find ourselves in (or, rather, that "you" believe we are in.)

You are not helping, basically.

And I'm not a fanboi. I just refuse to post insults and death threats to the devs because this GAME isn't perfectly to my liking.

I don't make threats and the statements I make are not insults. I'm also not being negative, I am saying what needs to be said because so many seek to make excuses for businessmen. I have no sympathy for people who run a bad business and people who have bad customer service. The only way to change that is to constantly show them their screw ups and tell them that it is unacceptable.

Coddling businessmen and telling them their failures are acceptable has lead to the type of environment in the gaming world we see today. The more people relax and accept consistent failure the more likely this project will end up a total failure. I want to protect my investment and actually have a decent game to play.

[Grraarrgghh]

I don't know what worse, intentional shitposting or just being a badposter in general.

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:47 PM, said:

I want to protect my investment and actually have a decent game to play.

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:47 PM, said:

I want to protect my investment

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:47 PM, said:

protect my investment

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:47 PM, said:

investment

:psyduck:

[XIRUSPHERE]

Grraarrgghh, on 20 March 2013 - 01:50 PM, said:

I don't know what worse, intentional shitposting or just being a badposter in general.












:psyduck:

What's worse? Towing my line without me even having to ask.

[Grraarrgghh]

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 01:59 PM, said:

What's worse? Towing my line without me even having to ask.

You sir, are as delusional as I am handsome.

[Rebas Kradd]

Vassago Rain, on 20 March 2013 - 11:35 AM, said:

We were promised no coolant, no P2W, no third person, no casual gaming experience, first person tactical gameplay,, community warfare, modern graphics, they had a HUGE manifesto of what they were gonna do...

And you believed them?

Look, go on all you want about games outsourcing their testing to average folks, but didn't you know what you were getting into? This demands a measure of common sense.

When my club leader, and old friend, first reached out to me and described the F2P model, I was extremely skeptical. "Are they going to be solvent enough to deliver?" I asked. "How will they keep their revenue stream flowing? What's to hold these people accountable in such a situation?" It didn't sound like a smart investment for me. I admit I wasn't around for the delivery of all those glowing promises, but had I been, I'd have been even more skeptical. The F2P setup sounded more appropriate to being lucky just to get the basics working right, to say nothing of metagames and constant content stream.

Ergo, I've stuck strictly to grinding in this game. Not a cent of MC. and I'm still having fun, because my expectations fit the situation. I have my worries about the game, but neither did I go into this with rose-colored glasses. The indignance here is out of proportion, and a lot of it is generated by people who spent money on it. That was just silly. Regardless of what anyone says, F2P on a scale like this is uncharted territory.

[XIRUSPHERE]

Grraarrgghh, on 20 March 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

You sir, are as delusional as I am handsome.

Positive affirmation is a good way to overcome self-esteem issues.

[Grraarrgghh]

XIRUSPHERE, on 20 March 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

Positive affirmation is a good way to overcome self-esteem issues.

What's a good way to overcome the arbitrary need to attach significance to video games?