23 replies to this topic

[Tennex]

"FrostCollar: There are a number of weapons that fit into the timeline but are not in game, including binary lasers, mech mortars, Arrow IV missiles, etc. Without having to get into details, are there currently any plans to introduce more types of Inner Sphere weaponry?

A: Yes, generally when we add a BattleMech that carries the aforementioned equipment."

Curious which mechs mount the Blazer.
Maybe we can figure out some of the upcoming mechs.

For example, the Marauder MAD-4X mounts 2 blazers in each arm.

[Trauglodyte]

I don't remember the binary laser.

[TOGSolid]

Trauglodyte, on 24 March 2013 - 11:24 AM, said:

I don't remember the binary laser.

http://www.sarna.net...ry_Laser_Cannon

Quote

Nicknamed the Blazer, the Binary Laser Cannon is widely considered a dead-end technology. Taking two large laser cores and fusing them together, the Blazer was designed to fire both cores at the same time, increasing damage penetration. In practice, damage yield proved low compared to the lasers firing separately, and the high heat generated by the Blazer severely taxed available heat sink technology of the time.
While research on the Blazer started in the Lyran Commonwealth in 2801, actual prototype models first showed up in the Free Worlds League in 2812.
With the re-introduction of double heat sinks, the Blazer cannon is now a viable weapon.

Quote

MAD-4X - This variant was made at Ronin Incorporated's facility on Wallis in 3039. Techs removed the standard weaponry from a Marauder and replaced the arm mounted weapons with a Binary Laser Cannon in each arm, while the torso mounted autocannon was replaced by twin SRM-6 launchers backed by one ton of ammunition. The Marauder-4X was also noteworthy because it used a Prototype Endo Steel chassis. To keep the heat under control technicians installed twelve single heat sinks and six prototype Double Heat Sinks.^[18]

[Tickdoff Tank]

The major advantage for an MWO version of the Blazer would be the ability to basicly mount 2 LL in one energy hardpoint. In TT I always thought the Blazer was too much heat/weight/space, but with limited hardpoints it gains enough (to me) to be a possibility.

Base damage: 12
Heat: 16
Slots: 4
Tons: 9
Range: 450m

Compared to 2 LL:

Base Damage: 18
Heat: 14
Slots: 4
Tons: 10
Range: 450m

To make the Blazer effective in MWO I would suggest the following:

Base Damage: 15
Heat: 13
Slots: 4
Tons: 9
Range: 450m
ROF: 3.5 (LL has 3.25)
Beam Duration: 1.2 (LL has 1.0)

Has some advantages over 2 LL but is still a heavy, high heat weapon. You could still focus your damage quite well but the heat will be an issue if you are heavy on the trigger.

[El Bandito]

Personally I just want the Arrow IV. Death from a place far far away.

[General Taskeen]

http://www.sarna.net...Schwerer_Gustav

[verybad]

Blazer would be a relatively useless weapon. 75% damage of 2 LLasers. 90% tonnage, 100% heat.

There aren't any production mechs with Blazers in them because even the technicians working on them realized they sucked and they just put them in storage facilities.

Arrow IV on the other hand...There's a Catapult with one of them available at this time in the game.

They could probably give it full map capability on any map, but can ONLY fire aimed at a target that's tagged, otherwise it fires much less accurately, 300 m minimum range. 4 damage, 15 meter spread 2 damage 30 meter spread. Now that may not sound like a lot of damage, but with that kind of spread, a mech (or mechs) is taking 5 damage to every part...about 40 total damage to a mech(s) near it, about 20 total to a mech(s) still within 30m range. 8 second reload, can't fire till last Arrow is done with it's job.

Makes it a useful support weapon, but not a game changer. Makes TAG more useful (I like Tagging Fatlases with my Spider) So it's a fun team weapoon. Multiples of it might be devastating, but only to camping players. Might make for a very good base defender (ie send a fast mech bake to spot for you and nuke your own base that's being capped)

[Davers]

verybad, on 24 March 2013 - 12:17 PM, said:

Blazer would be a relatively useless weapon. 75% damage of 2 LLasers. 90% tonnage, 100% heat.

There aren't any production mechs with Blazers in them because even the technicians working on them realized they sucked and they just put them in storage facilities.

Arrow IV on the other hand...There's a Catapult with one of them available at this time in the game.

They could probably give it full map capability on any map, but can ONLY fire aimed at a target that's tagged, otherwise it fires much less accurately, 300 m minimum range. 4 damage, 15 meter spread 2 damage 30 meter spread. Now that may not sound like a lot of damage, but with that kind of spread, a mech (or mechs) is taking 5 damage to every part...about 40 total damage to a mech(s) near it, about 20 total to a mech(s) still within 30m range. 8 second reload, can't fire till last Arrow is done with it's job.

Makes it a useful support weapon, but not a game changer. Makes TAG more useful (I like Tagging Fatlases with my Spider) So it's a fun team weapoon. Multiples of it might be devastating, but only to camping players. Might make for a very good base defender (ie send a fast mech bake to spot for you and nuke your own base that's being capped)

No, not a game changer. But for mechs like some Awesomes with only one energy in it's arm it would add more options.

[Tickdoff Tank]

verybad, on 24 March 2013 - 12:17 PM, said:

Blazer would be a relatively useless weapon. 75% damage of 2 LLasers. 90% tonnage, 100% heat.

Then you increase the base damage of the Blazer. The benefit is that you can effectively mount 2 LL in 1 hardpoint. For many mechs this would not be a big deal, but for some it could be a very useful increase to their available firepower.

I will not loose any sleep if we never get them in the game, but they might be worth adding once everything else is working correctly. Of course that could take a while, lol.

[Strum Wealh]

'Mechs that have a canon variant that mounts a Binary Laser Cannon:

• Marauder (MAD-4X)
  
• Zeus (ZEU-6Y)
  
• Enforcer III (ENF-7X)
  
• Deva (Alt. Config. S)
  
• Archangel ("Caelestis" non-standard variant)
  
• Eisenfaust (EFT-8X)
  
• Rook (NH-3X)
  
• Schwerer Gustav (sole variant)
  
• Sarissa (MN1-D)

Of these variants, only the ZEU-6Y and the MAD-4X were developed/introduced before 3070.

Edited by Strum Wealh, 24 March 2013 - 12:28 PM.

[Tennex]

Strum Wealh, on 24 March 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:

'Mechs that have a canon variant that mounts a Binary Laser Cannon:

• Marauder (MAD-4X)
  
• Zeus (ZEU-6Y)
  
• Enforcer III (ENF-7X)
  
• Deva (Alt. Config. S)
  
• Archangel ("Caelestis" non-standard variant)
  
• Eisenfaust (EFT-8X)
  
• Rook (NH-3X)
  
• Schwerer Gustav (sole variant)
  
• Sarissa (MN1-D)

Of these variants, only the ZEU-6Y and the MAD-4X were developed/introduced before 3070.

<3

Edit: Hello ZEU-6Y

Edited by Tennex, 24 March 2013 - 12:38 PM.

[Harrison von doober]

And we're unlikely to get the marauder, so its one zeus varient?

[Tennex]

Tickdoff Tank, on 24 March 2013 - 11:44 AM, said:

The major advantage for an MWO version of the Blazer would be the ability to basicly mount 2 LL in one energy hardpoint. In TT I always thought the Blazer was too much heat/weight/space, but with limited hardpoints it gains enough (to me) to be a possibility.

Base damage: 12
Heat: 16
Slots: 4
Tons: 9
Range: 450m

Compared to 2 LL:

Base Damage: 18
Heat: 14
Slots: 4
Tons: 10
Range: 450m

To make the Blazer effective in MWO I would suggest the following:

Base Damage: 15
Heat: 13
Slots: 4
Tons: 9
Range: 450m
ROF: 3.5 (LL has 3.25)
Beam Duration: 1.2 (LL has 1.0)

Has some advantages over 2 LL but is still a heavy, high heat weapon. You could still focus your damage quite well but the heat will be an issue if you are heavy on the trigger.

they can't make tonnage changes to weapons because that would screw up stock mech weight. but i think a good heat reduction buff would make it pretty viable. besides the logistic benefits of having 2 LL in 1 hardpoint.

[Bishop Steiner]

mEh.

Lets get what we DO have sorted out first, before worrying about niche weapons that are of dubious use (at least in current MWO format..... I could see the Arrow IV making itself useful on Tourmaline, Alpine or even Caustic, but would have to be useluss up close and personal to balance it's massive range advantage).

Maybe after they get done with the lrm/srm yo-yo. But until they get the basics sorted (like they should have BEFORE introducing level 2 Tech in the first place), let's not confuse the poor dears, eh?

[Tickdoff Tank]

Tennex, on 24 March 2013 - 12:36 PM, said:

they can't make tonnage changes to weapons because that would screw up stock mech weight. but i think a good heat reduction buff would make it pretty viable. besides the logistic benefits of having 2 LL in 1 hardpoint.

I did not change any tonnage amounts on what I listed. I just adjusted the heat, damage, ROF and beam duration.

Bishop Steiner, on 24 March 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

mEh.

Lets get what we DO have sorted out first, before worrying about niche weapons that are of dubious use (at least in current MWO format..... I could see the Arrow IV making itself useful on Tourmaline, Alpine or even Caustic, but would have to be useluss up close and personal to balance it's massive range advantage).

Maybe after they get done with the lrm/srm yo-yo. But until they get the basics sorted (like they should have BEFORE introducing level 2 Tech in the first place), let's not confuse the poor dears, eh?

I agree with you, we need to get the rest of the game sorted out first. But it is still fun to think ahead and speculate on ways to implement new weapons that we would want to see.

Edited by Tickdoff Tank, 24 March 2013 - 12:43 PM.

[verybad]

Bishop Steiner, on 24 March 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

mEh.

Lets get what we DO have sorted out first, before worrying about niche weapons that are of dubious use (at least in current MWO format..... I could see the Arrow IV making itself useful on Tourmaline, Alpine or even Caustic, but would have to be useluss up close and personal to balance it's massive range advantage).

Maybe after they get done with the lrm/srm yo-yo. But until they get the basics sorted (like they should have BEFORE introducing level 2 Tech in the first place), let's not confuse the poor dears, eh?

Absolutely agree with this. I want all sorts of weapons in the game, but making sure the balance is really good before adding more distractions is necessary.

[Noobzorz]

re: The Blazer, this is an important point that people do not understand:

Just because it wasn't good in TT does not mean it has to suck in MWO.

[Strum Wealh]

Harrison von doober, on 24 March 2013 - 12:36 PM, said:

And we're unlikely to get the marauder, so its one zeus varient?

"ZEU-6Y - An experiment in logistical support, the -6Y kept the AC/5 in the right arm, but replaced the LRM-15 with a single LRM-10 launcher. A single Binary Laser Cannon was installed on an over-shoulder mount in the right torso. The heat from this weapon degraded the myomer performance however and production halted. Armor, engine, and heat dissipation remained identical to the -6S model."

Spoiler

"Where most suggestions favored increased armor or ammunition, some designers argued instead for anti-infantry weapons. At some point, a particularly charismatic engineer remembered the unloved binary laser cannon, and successfully petitioned for its use in place of the ’Mech’s Thunderbolt large laser mount in the left torso. Given that the Thunderbolt was slow to manufacture at the time and there were fears that it too might join the ranks of lostech in the near future, the bulkier and brutish blazer cannon seemed a good choice that would also provide the long-desired punch of a PPC without any of the troublesome technical issues that prompted the PPC to be removed from the original Zeus specs in the first place.

Unfortunately, initial optimism soon turned to frustration as it was learned that repeated firing of the blazer often resulted in catastrophic myomer bundle failures. Not even a redesign of the left torso area to improve its heat dissipation could resolve the matter, nor could the final solution of moving the blazer to a right-shoulder mount. As this engineering nightmare completely negated the other maintenance benefits the -6Y was specifically built to address, the project was abandoned after only a few prototypes were built."

[The above evaluation (courtesy of ComStar) was too harsh— or, perhaps, deliberately misleading - as the -6Y is an example of a fairly successful, albeit inefficient experiment. This ’Mech was, in fact, produced (albeit in limited numbers), thanks to Defiance’s ability to completely manufacture them on-site with no “lostech” components. The -6Y’s omission from Technical Readout: 3025 speaks volumes about ComStar’s dedication to free and accessible information. –CA] [Source: XTRO:SWV1 (08)

Source for the above is here.]

The -6Y was an experimental variant (that apparently did see some limited production) around 2922.

Barring the introduction of the Marauder or a time-skip into the WoB J***d, the -6y is the only 'Mech that MWO would be likely to consider that comes stock with a Blaser.

[Dr Killinger]

I was actually wondering about this yesterday after reading that. I think that being able to fit two sub-par, very hot large lasers in a single energy hardpoint is very valid in this game. Devs?

[Strum Wealh]

Tickdoff Tank, on 24 March 2013 - 11:44 AM, said:

To make the Blazer effective in MWO I would suggest the following:

Base Damage: 15
Heat: 13
Slots: 4
Tons: 9
Range: 450m
ROF: 3.5 (LL has 3.25)
Beam Duration: 1.2 (LL has 1.0)

Has some advantages over 2 LL but is still a heavy, high heat weapon. You could still focus your damage quite well but the heat will be an issue if you are heavy on the trigger.

Also: beam color would be closer to indigo or purple...?