673 replies to this topic

[cyberFluke]

MN03, on 13 April 2013 - 06:21 AM, said:

Wow, so no LRM damage adjustment this April? Are monkeys making this game? They are so freaking slow adjusting damage numbers. Just change the damage from 0.7 to a more acceptable 1.0 (+splash) and then revamp it in May if you want to.

You know it's not just a "damage number adjustment" that needs doing to LRMs right? They've already stated that this is a temporary fix to stop the LRM hell. While tweaking the numbers for LRMs they realised that the pathing code for LRMs is broken. Until the code is fixed, they've reduced the damage per missile to stop LRMs owning everything.

Learn to read, comprehend and think before posting your insulting, mindless drivel here please.

[Sheraf]

cyberFluke, on 13 April 2013 - 09:19 AM, said:

Frankly, your wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong. LRMs are a *little* underpowered right now, but I use them to great effectiveness to chisel away armour while someone is closing the gap or playing poppaprick behind a ridge. Some of my highest damage rounds lately have been in an AWS-8V with ERPPCs, LLs and an artemis equipped LRM20 rack.

Maybe you see the armor went away because your target was being shot at by other weapons. Your LRMs were just happen to be there at the right time . Your AWS-8V has ERPPCs,LLs, and LRM20, what weapons you think deal the most damage there?

Edited by Sheraf, 13 April 2013 - 02:26 PM.

[Yokaiko]

Sheraf, on 12 April 2013 - 07:55 AM, said:

When will we have this temporary fix end?

One word.


knockdowns.

[cyberFluke]

Sheraf, on 13 April 2013 - 02:26 PM, said:

Maybe you see the armor went away because your target was being shot at by other weapons. Your LRMs were just happen to be there at the right time . Your AWS-8V has ERPPCs,LLs, and LRM20, what weapons you think deal the most damage there?

Depends strongly on the map if I'm honest. The LRMs allow me to soften peoples armour, fire from behind friendlies or terrain, and they shake the cockpit of the enemy while the LLs and PPC do damage.

[Karenai]

LRMs got looked at and were nerfed even more. Now most of them do not even hit the target, at all. Anything moving faster then a turtle avoids most of the LRM even without cover. And using partial cover you can block 100% of incoming LRM even with an Atlas, with very little movement.
I guess someone played around with the spread and it went live. It feels like they stop tracking the target way too soon before impact.

Had a cicada sidestepping 55 LRM by running 10m to one side and stopping. Less then 10 missiles hit it.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Karenai, on 16 April 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

LRMs got looked at and were nerfed even more.

While ECM got looked at and we're told its pretty much what they want.
Anyone think the devs play LRMs?

[Sheraf]

I guess LRM temporary fix has become permanent. ECM on the other hand is working as intent

[arghmace]

Yesterday in one battle after dying I spectated my team mate. It was Alpine and there was an enemy Cataphract out in the open moving towards/sideways my team mate in a 45 degree angle more or less. Phract had red CT but otherwise in good condition. The LRM's didn't take any advance so they flew behind this Cataphract and then turned back exploding in the ground on his heels. Slight damage to legs but none to the almost destroyed CT. And this was a slow Phract in the open. What use are LRM's?

[KingNobody]

I think that missiles have been nerfed entirely too much. This is particularly apparent with LRMs, which are now so weak that I don't even bother seeking cover from them. SRMs fared little better, I see fewer and fewer players running with them. The only missile system that has come out of these nerfs still useful is SSRM.

This is why I will repeat my earlier request to the devs to increase LRM damage to 1/missile, increase SRM damage to 2/missile, and leave streaks where they are at 1.5/missile.

[Miken]

LRMs represent the artillery in this game, but pathetic damage... makes me sad
In any another game artillery deal maximum damage!!!

[Padic]

Just throwing in my two MC,

SRMs feel a little anemic to me right now. I spend a lot of time waiting around, hiding behind hills and the like, and then when I do finally get into range, the missiles ... don't really seem to hurt the enemy?

Perhaps I still just have some muscle memory from before this fix.

[Sheraf]

SRM's fate is stil quite ok more than LRM's one, but still yes 1.5 damage doesn't feel good for a close range weapon. It supposes to blow the face of the careless one who walk into your range.

[VXJaeger]

What missile nerfing has done good?
It has reduced use of ECM dramatically overall, 'cause survival is not anymore depended of that.

Suggestion #2:
LRM-damage 1.0 and 25% increase of flight speed.
SRM & SSRM-damage 2.0
Splash damage as it is now.
If more than 3 of missile systems are boated, 4th will double its heat generation, 5th quadruble etc.

Edited by VXJaeger, 21 April 2013 - 10:23 AM.

[Lostsoul]

I would like to give my viewpoints on LRMs and the problems i have with this great damage reduction to them.
But first lets compare the LRM to other top end weapons of ballistics and energy.



Now just looking at the STATS it is hard to see where LRMs have an advantage over other weapons. As they have slowest recycle times . The second lowest DPS, and one of the heaviest weapons in the game. Not only that, they are very ammo dependent, Only 9 shots per ton of ammo, the second lowest ton/shot ratio weapon. (remember this a LRM20 as we are comparing arguable kings of each area) Not only that, the Long Range Missile is getting shorter range than other weapons. sure those weapons lose some of their damage after "Optimum Range". But LRMs blow up at 1000m so they cant even tough something beyond that range. Then they have a minimum range of 180m where if the target is inside that range they bounce harmlessly off the target. Giving the weapon only a 820m effective killing field. The third lowest killing field.

Ok lets look at In Game Uses ...

-ARCHING Weapon. LRMs can be used over SMALL hills and ridges. This is a positive thing as long as someone else has Line of Sight.

-They are slow.They have a weapon speed of 100m,. This is a VERY negative thing. Not only does it give the target plenty of time to find cover. But it also lets everyone in viewing range know where the missiles where shot from and gives them plenty of time to see them traveling.

-Missiles launched per volley. Have you ever hit the fire button and seen your missiles come out in waves. That is because LRM missiles are limited to the launch tubes on the mech. There are a few Trebuchet's versions(that i know for a fact) that will launch 1 or 2 missiles at a time making it very easy for a AMS to shoot down them all.

-AMS, As the missiles travel from the launcher to the target that are 200m from the missiles, That mechs AMS will shoot out some of those missiles. If enough mechs in a 200m area are running AMS they can shoot down all missiles from a volley (yes i have seen it happen).

-ECM vs nothing,Narc,Tag ECM make LRM locking and tracking very hard, without tag or narc impossible.You can still dry fire without lock though.. Narc means you would have to be nearly on top of the mech to use and will be destroyed after target takes a limited amount of damage(35damage) or 20sec. Tag giving you a much longer range at 750m which is 250m under max LRM range limiting your range even more. Also Tag must be fired nonstop.

In Closing.

No other weapon has so much against it in counters and weakness. And now the weapon ,stat wise, isn't even viewed as a real threat compared to other weapon types. They are slow, limited ranged, easy to counter weapon that doesn't do a ton of damage or even a great DPS or Damage per weight/heat. So please, Lets not just get the options of brawlers on this matter or DD snipers. Lets talk to some of the people who like to run Missleboats.

Edited by Lostsoul, 21 April 2013 - 11:17 AM.

[30ft SMURF]

Still waiting to hear any determinations about lrms being fixed. Its been a month now and we were told this was temporary, but lrms are still useless. I've been using lrms since weapon tracking started and we can now see the accuracy we have with each weapon type. Can you guess what my lrm accuracy is? I hit roughly 90% of my laser fire... I hit between 50-60% with all ballistic weapons... My ssrms are kinda good at just under 80%... Even my srms are close to the ballistics... but this uber noob weapon that only exists to give people who can't aim a roll in the game is at an all time high of 30-35% depending on lrm20's, 15's, 10's and 5's... So on average only 35% of the roughly 1000 missiles I carry in my founders catapult actually hit an enemy. Sure... terrain, ecm, buildings, speed and losing target lock all play into if lrms actually do any damage, but considering all of the options to avoid taking damage from lrms (ams systems! FTLOP) are there any benefits to using this weapon system anymore? Not at the moment. At best you might influence a pilot to use any number of the multitude of options they have to render your weapons useless, but you still aren't going to do any damage. I ran a founders catapult with 2 lrm 20's w/artemis, 2 large lasers, tag and roughly 8 tons of ammo. I'm lucky to do 2-300dmg in a round. In order to make sure missiles hit targets I generally have to hide untill I can hit them directly with the tag and all weapons systems. This means i have to keep a weapons lock on an enemy who will likely look at me shortly after they notice I'm not just shooting lrms and take tons of direct fire in order to put my 2 large lasers and 2 lrm 20s on target. The only way a support mech like this does any damage or 'helps' their team is if somehow they are lucky enough to stay in LOS of the enemy nearly the entire match and never get shot at because their team is so good that they either draw fire or put the enemy down before they have time to waste on a mech that is wasting nearly 40 tons of space on a weapon system that doesn't do jack. Turns out two large lasers can do a good bit of damage over the course of 10min or so, but you can't take a shot to the ct in a founders cat... You'll get shot in the face instead. Turns out you need a freaking miracle to stay alive that long in a founders catapult. Prior to the 'fix' you put 2 lrm 20s and 2 large lasers into someone and they started looking for cover... now they stand still and aim for your face. Not only have you rendered a weapon system useless, you've also rendered an entire line of mechs useless and worse a founders mech at that. I guarantee that as much as I enjoy using lasers and ballistics it won't be enough to keep me playing this game if I don't also have the option of using missiles as a viable weapon system. This is the one area of the game that has most frequently made me consider not playing/testing this game any further and is the one area that if left unresolved/f'd up like it is now will stop me from spending further money. As is it feels like I've gotten a bad return on what I've already invested. Guess I should avoid spending any further coin around here till you demonstratably address this concern. I'll be disregarding any further sales/advertisements from this game company untill weapon balance is not just mentioned as a priority, but is something that is actually implemented in the game I'd say more, but real life calls... better than dealin' with this atm.

[Mormaz]

Paul Inouye, on 21 March 2013 - 02:46 PM, said:

THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THIS MESSAGE:
This is a TEMPORARY fix to quell the damage done by missiles at this time. We are fully investigating the damage model AND focusing on the grouping of missiles and will update as soon as we can on how any changes will be managed/implemented.

So, guys, more than a Month has passed.... and that "Temporary" fix is still here.

It's like having a Motor Racing game, you can play with any wheels vehicle you want, but for coding reason, you REMOVED ONE WHEEL OF MOTOR BIKES (And of course not the front one...) !


Clock is ticking...
Tic Tac...

[Dr B00t]

there is another post recently where he said they are going to increase missile speed...so yeah...temporary..just a bit slow

[Sniper09121986]

No thing is more permanent than a temporary one. The original missile "fix" happened what, a month and a half ago? And not only the train is still on station, it is now, in fact, moving backwards. I used to run my CPLT-C1 a lot when I originally bought it, but since then it is collecting dust and scavenged for parts for other mechs. Might as well remove half of Catapult models from the game, who is going to notice?

And no, I am not buying a Gausscat.

[Lightfoot]

So, I wanted to put LRMs on the Highlander when I got it. So I added Artemis and BAP and 2x LRM20. However, currently LRMs are not very good and very unreliable so they became a Gauss Rifle. The config works very well, probably better than LRMs ever would have, but players always cry nerf when LRMs work okay, so now you get ERPPCs and Gauss instead of LRMs, and the players cry, "Nerf all PPCs now!"

There is no perfect balance. MWO was better with slightly dangerous LRMs, apparently, because now everything is broken because PPCs replaced them as the Demonic Weapon. ooooo, scary!! But PPCs have not changed since early February when State Rewind was added to eliminate Lag. So from February to early April those same PPCs and ERPPCs were fine, but then LRMs were Hot-Fixed so everyone switched to PPCs, and now I am supposed to believe PPCs are the tool of the Devil or something.

So, I guess what I am getting at is fix LRMs (and this 6xPPC Stalker everyone says is game breaking) before taking any action to nerf PPCs which were working fine till LRMs were hot-fixed. I am playing MWO and I see no significant difference in gameplay except that players switched from LRMs to PPCs.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Sniper09121986, on 26 April 2013 - 09:54 AM, said:

No thing is more permanent than a temporary one. The original missile "fix" happened what, a month and a half ago? And not only the train is still on station, it is now, in fact, moving backwards. I used to run my CPLT-C1 a lot when I originally bought it, but since then it is collecting dust and scavenged for parts for other mechs. Might as well remove half of Catapult models from the game, who is going to notice?

And no, I am not buying a Gausscat.

well thats ok; the exp system was a temporary placeholder then it was a hell of a surprise when they told us it was suddenly the way it was going to be lol