1107 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Remember 3rd, double sinks only need to OP on my build to prove my point.

This

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 23 March 2013 - 07:32 AM.

[IG 88]

Pyrometheus, on 22 March 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

While I am not the person this reply was posted to, I'll post one of my builds still using SHS, because doing so is actually more efficient that DHS.

Atlas-D-DC 33% cooling efficiency.

Clearly built as an LRM and long range boat. The best I've been able to achieve with DHS is 30% cooling efficiency.

That build adds DHS and places an AC/2 and 1 ton of ammo in the RT Torso. I could achieve 39% cooling efficiency with that build by leaving off the AC/2 entirely, but then I would have 8 tons of wasted space, and leaving weight on the table is horribly inefficient in itself.

wrong
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...1eae26e74fd8bbc

remove ferro and endo, jump to 45%

Edited by IG 88, 23 March 2013 - 07:30 AM.

[qki]

Take a standard HBK-4G, drop the 3 extra HS, drop the AC-20 and take a gauss with 4 tons of ammo - DHS for 2 MLs is overkill.

[Tenzek]

GRIMM11, on 22 March 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

OP are you kidding? For example the Awesome with internal and external armors upgraded, then you have a bunch of laser weapons. You have NO crit space to give up for 1.4 heat dissipation per 3 crit slots of a double heat sink. some builds have issues with weight, some with critical space. That is why single heat sinks exist. What I want to see is the ability to mix the two in a single build, that would be true customization and there is no valid reason for it to not be possible in a simulator type game.

The problem is that you have all of the DHS in the engine that take no extra space. The number of extra SHS you'd have to add just to break even with the bonus you'd get from just the engine DHS isn't practical with a large engine.

[qki]

Tenzek, on 23 March 2013 - 07:33 AM, said:

The problem is that you have all of the DHS in the engine that take no extra space. The number of extra SHS you'd have to add just to break even with the bonus you'd get from just the engine DHS isn't practical with a large engine.

Yeah. All 9 of them (a 240 engine on the AWS is capable of holding 9 heatsinks) The most heatsinks you can fit in a 400 rated engine is 16.

MuKen, on 23 March 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

That build is still strictly better if you use DHS.

which build - gets a bit confusing without quotes. And in case you mean my hunchie - yeah, but what for? I never even get a heat warning with SHS, so DHS are, like I said, overkill.

[Komtur]

Protection, on 22 March 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

After watching another poor PUG die in the heat-death-traps (often called Trial mechs) while playing today, it occurred to me -- why are single heatsinks even in the game at all?

single heatsinks = 1 slot

double heatsinks = 3 slots

If you have not enough space, single heatsinks are important

[MuKen]

Komtur, on 23 March 2013 - 07:39 AM, said:

single heatsinks = 1 slot

double heatsinks = 3 slots

If you have not enough space, single heatsinks are important

Correction, double heatsinks = 3 slots plus 10 SHS for free.

If your build has so much other stuff you don't have much space for heatsinks, you should get rid of all your heatsinks and take double for the 10 free ones it gives you.

[Thirdstar]

qki, on 23 March 2013 - 07:37 AM, said:

which build - gets a bit confusing without quotes. And in case you mean my hunchie - yeah, but what for? I never even get a heat warning with SHS, so DHS are, like I said, overkill.

Doesn't matter if they're overkill, they're objectively better. Which is the point made by the OP.

Current SHS and DHS numbers make SHS nearly pointless.

The answer should be to buff SHS in some small way.

[Joseph Mallan]

But the question is the 1.5 Mill better spent on something else?

Dubs have always made singles obsolete. Ever since the 2750 TRO!

[Jay Kerensky]

Michael Costanza, on 22 March 2013 - 02:14 PM, said:

I can't believe I'm the only person so far who mentioned the canon reason.... that's what happens when people play a game instead of reading the books/technical readouts/manuals that make up the backstory to the game.

What the hell has Canon got to do with MWO????

Super lights running around taking out assaults
DHS that aren't double at all
Heat that does nothing except shut down a mech
Double Armour Values
Coolant Flush
Ammo feeds from any part of a mech to another

The list goes on and on, but that's probably a whole new thread. We'll just carry on while things change a bit at a time until you get to the point where you've had enough of the game and go and find something else. Maybe come back in a year or so and play again until it gets old.

If this was a real RPG style game then you could spend years on it, but it's just another FPS (call it a sim if you like - I don't care).

Personally I'd be happy paying $100.00 for a single player campaign and then buy expansion packs every 3 months.

Damn - what was this thread about again???

[Shiro Matsumoto]

The original game has them.

Have 2 single HS in each leg... stand in water...

[Thirdstar]

Joseph Mallan, on 23 March 2013 - 07:46 AM, said:

But the question is the 1.5 Mill better spent on something else?

Dubs have always made singles obsolete. Ever since the 2750 TRO!

The 1.5 will buy you a significant efficiency increase. It's up to the player to make a value judgement on whether he wants to get DHS over something else costing 1.5 but there are few reasons to continue to use SHS if you do have the money.

Ibrahim al Arkab Hatomoto, on 23 March 2013 - 07:47 AM, said:

Two of my Altas builds are giving you a 1.5ton finger right now.

Well post your build tough guy.

Here's the tool.

http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

As more mechs get introduced we simply need to stop having the old 3025 mechs as Trial mechs, they are obsolete at this point.

[Squirtbox]

While I do agree that DHS are so vastly superior to SHS that I don't see why anyone would use SHS, I don't think they should be removed entirely from the game. Not because of LOLcanonLOL, but because they should be useful since they are part of the game just like I think MGs, flamers, and SRM2s should be useful.

The canon reasons for why SHS are and should remain in game are great if you are talking about TT, which this clearly isn't. PGI has already made changes to quite a wide range of stats for their conversion from TT to MWO I don't see why it would be difficult to add some viability to SHS such as the afore mentioned increased heat threshold.

Who ever the ***** trying to argue SHS are still viable is needs to pull their head out of their ***. There are ZERO builds worth playing that you could ever come up with that using SHS over DHS would be better. EVEN all energy mechs like the 8Q or 4P.

[Thirdstar]

Squirtbox, on 23 March 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

While I do agree that DHS are so vastly superior to SHS that I don't see why anyone would use SHS, I don't think they should be removed entirely from the game. Not because of LOLcanonLOL, but because they should be useful since they are part of the game just like I think MGs, flamers, and SRM2s should be useful.

And that's what they should try to do. Make SHS useful.

[Sears]

Could double heat sinks become a bit more highly strung? At the moment there's not much against them other than crit space. What if their item health was halved compared to singles?

This could also effect the engine when upgrading to doubles that it can be destroyed easier than an engine filled with singles.

Currently when I play I never take any notice when my Heatsinks are destroyed as by that point my mech is wrecked anyway.

[Adrius ADI Manthays]

are pgi reduced/nerfed DHS to push ******* CoolFlush! my mechs with DHS and same WeaponConfig after patch overheating faster!

rgr&out

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

Easy fix = Make single engine heat sinks do 1.5 heat per ten instead of just 1.

Done, Single Heat Sinks now viable on cooler running builds.

[qki]

MuKen, on 23 March 2013 - 07:41 AM, said:

Correction, double heatsinks = 3 slots plus 10 SHS for free.

If your build has so much other stuff you don't have much space for heatsinks, you should get rid of all your heatsinks and take double for the 10 free ones it gives you.

correction of your correction:

engines can hold engine rating/25 heatsinks. For engines smaller that 250 this means some of the 10 weight-free heatsinks have to be placed in critical slots as well, and wevery DHS placed this way takes 3 slots.

Jay Kerensky, on 23 March 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

What the hell has Canon got to do with MWO????

Super lights running around taking out assaults
DHS that aren't double at all
Heat that does nothing except shut down a mech
Double Armour Values
Coolant Flush
Ammo feeds from any part of a mech to another

The list goes on and on, but that's probably a whole new thread. We'll just carry on while things change a bit at a time until you get to the point where you've had enough of the game and go and find something else. Maybe come back in a year or so and play again until it gets old.

If this was a real RPG style game then you could spend years on it, but it's just another FPS (call it a sim if you like - I don't care).

Personally I'd be happy paying $100.00 for a single player campaign and then buy expansion packs every 3 months.

Damn - what was this thread about again???

double armour is to conteract the simple act of actually aiming your guns, which would otherwise allow you to leg an atlas with a single salvo - not good for the game. Super lights taking out assaults is nothing new. In CBT thay could hide behind 13+ hit modifiers and kill any assault with impunity.

[Fox News Channel]

I'd rather have them remove DHS.