143 replies to this topic

[Goldhawk]

The Jagermech even when full armor feels pretty weak. It trades the armor for firepower. Just thinking about that, shouldn't the Trebuchet have weak armor because it is a support mech? Now I see more Trebuchets then I see Centurions or Hunchbacks. The initial loadout of mechs had pretty traditional easy rolls.
Now we are getting into many of the skirmish mechs that are meant to roll into combat and take some hits.
If you use the Jagermech in close combat and it works... Go on. You can DO IT! Love to smash them at long range though.

[5th Fedcom Rat]

I'm a rat baby and proud of it.

*Long time boom cat lover, now Jager meister

[MadPanda]

Royalewithcheese, on 25 March 2013 - 09:11 AM, said:

Incidentally, I was worried I was wasting my Space Cell Phone Minutes on my Jagerbomb until I saw this thread full of rage at the AC40 Jagermechs. Thanks, forums!

Wait for my thread and video. I'm trying to get one with atleast 6 killshots .

[Tenzek]

Voidcrafter, on 25 March 2013 - 06:22 AM, said:

Yep. I know what you mean bro.
Yesterday 4 of 6 matches there were like 3/4+ ppl dualing AC20s in a pack.
It's very unpleasant if you're in heavy, med, or assault.
VERY.
The same issue as boating - ppl don't use their imagination but what's the most effective build.

What if you were trying to imagine the most effective build? Then you successfully used your imagination!

I am not sure why people think the goal of using your imagination should not be to make something effective.

[Deathlike]

Teralitha, on 25 March 2013 - 08:59 AM, said:

Basically what I got from this topic was.....

The catapult K2 now has a twin?

Devs dont ya think ya need to be adding mechs for tonnages that we dont already have first?

45 - Blackjack
55
75 - Orion
90 - Highlander
95

Fill those gaps first, then add more of what we already have.

Fixed.

[Training Instructor]

Well, the UAC5 and AC2 builds require you to keep your CT facing towards the enemy, and after you play a few games in a MM bracket where the enemy team knows how to aim center mass and pull the trigger, you quickly realize what a fail strategy it is to focus on sustained long range fire with small bore weapons.

Now, dual AC20 or dual Gauss have something in common, in that you can fire, twist away for three seconds, and then swing back towards the center to fire again. This allows you to spread out damage and actually survive for a period of time, rather than dying with a big empty hole in the center of your mech while your arms, legs, and LT/RT are almost untouched.

Blame PGI for making it so ridiculously easy to core people out.

[shabowie]

Can't believe this filthy mechist rant wasn't locked and the perpetrator banned. Comparing dual AC20 Jagermechs to rats really?

Someone's mad.

Edited by shabowie, 25 March 2013 - 10:24 AM.

[ElLocoMarko]

My opinion: not overpowered. I got killed a couple times by this mech so I did the logical thing and bought one for myself. Much like other one-trick ponies it is very dangerous in the right circumstances. And it's victims can come to an abrupt end... but you are not just running around exploding everything you casually point at.

I'm generally a good contributor to the team placing somewhere in the top three. This mech did not turn me into a game winning superhero. That's my primary criteria. I have bought and played ALL the cheese builds. This build is effective and a good way to grind through the pilot tree but nothing I have experienced in 15 games is going to have me coming back for more when I finish.

It's tough to rate a mech when you are its victim because you see only that moment where it killed you. But as the pilot of "the cheese", you get the whole story. You know that you missed the swarm of Ravens 4 times before hitting the spider. From the point of view of the spider, they saw a cheese Jager and it killed them. It didn't see the complete whiffs that tuned in your aim and that it took the same number of shots to kill them as an Atlas. So buy one and see what you think.

(edit) How do you give the dual AC20 jager a bad day?
Maintain long range.
Chain-fire AC5 is very blinding.
Unpredictable movement from the lights.
If its a brawl, shield with your arms. Wait for the big boom and start a 4 second count while you face and shoot them. Use elevation change to throw off its aim.

Edited by ElLocoMarko, 25 March 2013 - 10:36 AM.

[Thaar]

All I say is: dual gauss is better

[Peter von Danzig]

liku, on 25 March 2013 - 06:05 AM, said:

the best i came up, was to fight, torso twisting like a mad man, full stalker armor plus XL engine helped a bit

I stopped reading here. XL and a brawler build don't make any sense. And btw torso twisting doesn't make sense as well since the stalker's torsos are quite hard to hit head to head, while it's easy to blow in your xl from left or right.

[Superslicks]

I'm piloting the DD, but using 6 x Machine gun, and 2x erLL, 300 xl engine. so much fun and get realy good results.... sometimes its not all about having bigger is better

[SnakeTheFox]

As soon as JagerMechs popped I knew I was going for dual AC/20s. It wasn't some "Oh someone posted the build on the forum, let me jump on that boat"; it's literally common sense for most people who bought the thing, it's a ballistic-oriented heavy mech.

I run this thing almost exclusively now, and I'm usually 1st or 2nd in damage at the end of the match (13 on the DD leaderboard). I'm not trying to gloat so much as demonstrate I've put this thing through its paces to say the least, so let me clue you into the 3 major weaknesses I fear my opponents becoming wise enough to exploit:

1) Range. The most obvious drawback of an AC/20 build as opposed to a build of any other nature is that to deal my 40 point (or in my case 50 point: 2x ML in the torsos) alpha, I need to be within 270m. This is knife-fighting distance, and if I can't catch someone within that range I'm doing Spider-levels of damage throughout the match. The fact that I even manage to do this, and on maps like Alpine no less, is a testament to player stupidity and an overall lack of coordination.

2) Fragility. As someone else mentioned, you're brawling in what is inherently a non-brawling mech. The side torsos are huge: proportion-wise each side torso is as big as the center, so both side torsos combined are literally 2x the size of the center torso. Combine that with the necessity of an XL engine to even get within dueling range, and you have the true definition of a "glass cannon".

3) Second-rate DPS. Yes, the on-point split second "firepower" of the alpha is generous to say the least, but let's not forget that the DPS of a AC/20 is only 5. Five. One DPS higher than a single AC/2. A quad AC/2 Jager has higher DPS, much greater range, more free slots, and more free tonnage, and by its merits of being a sniper/support mech can mount a slower STD engine if it so wishes and negate the "fragility" as well. Many builds in the game eclipse the AC/20 in sustainable damage, the AC/20 only excels in being able to drop a lot of damage and then scoot into cover. Get the Jager into a situation where he's forced to persistently engage you without a break, and you stand a good chance of taking him down solo as per point #2 above. Let's also not forget that AC/20s actually generate considerable heat, and so even on Frozen City, when firing without pause, dual AC/20s will overheat you after a few steady volleys.

Let's not forget the Jagermech is the new guy around here and that dual AC/20 builds have existed since closed beta on the Catapult and haven't ruined the game so far. I equate the current success of my Jagermech to my opponents general lack of understanding and comprehension of the Jager's strengths and weaknesses as listed above.

[Pygar]

Yes, JagerMech is a really good mech...kind of amazed more people didn't see this coming- I was waiting not-so-patiently for months for the Jag to be released. "Spamming" is natural because they are brand new (and good)... some people will get back to normal next week, some will wait for the next new bandwagon to jump on... either way, spamming JagerMechs isn't exactly "uber"- it's just FOTM right now.

I fly mine dual Gauss instead of dual AC20 though, slight drop in "alpha" damage for more range makes it slightly more versatile even if it doesn't "spike" people quite as hard.

Edited by Pygar, 25 March 2013 - 10:36 AM.

[PropagandaWar]

Its a legit mech so I wont *****. Wait what the Thundercat was ok. Oh hold on the Thundercat still better than Jager I thought. HAHAHAHAHAHA!. Personally I like the AC/10, AC/20 2 med lasers better.

Just send a pack of oh your ballistics/Serms dont register so well ravens after them.

[liku]

Zero Neutral, on 25 March 2013 - 08:31 AM, said:

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOkkk....????

Making text larger does not a better point make.

im not making a point, i wanted to share not to rant... and people starting to rant... it was the opposite spirit so, for those having eys issue i put larger on

[Siliconwolf]

Dual AC/20 Jager isn't that bad....seen a bunch of them running around and they hurt, but pretty much the same deal as the Catapults running around with them. I'm more annoyed at the amount of PPC/Gauss I'm seeing since the LRM nerf. Not that I think they should be nerfed or anything, I think they're fine. They're just more annoying to me than dual AC/20.

[Grand Ayatollah Kerensky]

Shumabot, on 25 March 2013 - 07:25 AM, said:

It has drawbacks, but the ac40 jager is a top tier mech in the current meta. Post SRM nerf its the games premiere non assault brawler and it's by far the best jager build. It's not really OP though, it's not nearly at splat cat levels. It's hardly game breaking.

Maybe it's the best Jager build but it's not the best AC/20 brawler. With equal pilots, the Jager is going to lose simply because the Boomcat has to chew through far less armor to get at the XL engine in the side torso. From personal experience, I have not found ac/20 Jagers particularly threatening simply because they seem to go down real fast.

[Sifright]

MustrumRidcully, on 25 March 2013 - 06:26 AM, said:

How would imagination work. "Oh, let's say if I can put in an AC/5, an AC/2, 1 SRM4, 1 STreak 2, 1 Medium Pulse Laser and 1 Small Laser" on this mech? Is that "imaginative" and something that we need to encourage?

People use their "imagination" to find out something that works well. The better the game is designed, the more options there are for making "good" builds.

if the best use of the Jagermech is a Dual AC/20 build, rebalance the game so there's more than this build that's competitive.
(And I am not even sure this is the best use of the Jagermech. But damnit, I sure want to try it some time.)

it's very good for head hunting with an xl300 has ammo concerns though. Latency effects your ability to head hunt greatly though so your milage may vary.

I had a few games where i was chopping heads like a demoman using an eyelander. and other games where i was getting torn to shreds.

[Grimlox]

It's not even as good at it as the K2. It's very fragile with an XL engine and incredibly slow without. Also the hitboxes on the Jag do not work well with an XL and I've never taken so many headshot deaths as I have in the Jag. Oh and the K2 can out twist the Jag easily which is an important factor in brawling and damage distribution.

The only thing the Jag does better is shoot over obstacles with the high mounted arms. This isn't going to help you in a brawl at all though.

The real problem is that there is very little else worth doing on the Jag right now. Builds are pretty limited and having terrible side torso hitboxes means that anything involving time on target to deal damage is going to end badly (3xUAC/5, 4xLLas, 4-6 AC/2 etc.)

I've never had such a hard time finding a decent build for my 3 jags as I have in any other mech.

Edited by Grimlox, 25 March 2013 - 11:30 AM.

[Volts]

liku, on 25 March 2013 - 06:05 AM, said:

Yes, sometime this is a pack of 8 of them sync dropping in the tunnel!

• Like rats, they like closed and cramped place like tunnel.
  
• Like rats, tey pack and swarm.
  
• Their bit is venomous and you'll die quick it you dont treat the wound properly.

The only solution, like against all nuisible, is to destroy them

This post is ridiculous.

Rat's aren't venomous.