981 replies to this topic

[That Dawg]

STK-3F

I think my stalker is finally tweaked, but input appreciated

[Drollzy]

Can you optimize this for me?
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...6f71e53edb526f2

[Protection]

ThatDawg, on 26 March 2013 - 07:41 PM, said:

STK-3F

I think my stalker is finally tweaked, but input appreciated

That CASE isn't doing anything -- plus CASE doesn't help in any way with an XL engine. And you have a ton left over with 2 criticals unused.

So with 1.5 tons you could cram in an AMS, move the laser to the right torso from the left, and move the heatsinks around for room. Or you could strip 8 points from each leg and go for a 310XL for that speed.

But yes, you're pretty much good to go. The one point of concern is that SRMs on a Stalker usually mean you are brawling, and brawlers usually don't like to run XL engines, because it makes them rather fragile. It's a personal preference, but be sure to be careful about those side torsos.

[Kurkotain]

Tyzh, on 26 March 2013 - 09:22 AM, said:

Hmmm, a lot of that is already squeezed on there pretty tight, isn't it? How close are you to a target usually when you're large lasers start to feel hot, and how fond of that double AMS are you? Considering your problem, I might recommend giving up the AMS for Artemis on the SRMs. Artemis would let you open up with your close range bracket around 180-200m and still hit well enough, rather than having to be right up in the targets face at 60m. The close range bracket also has a bit more sustainable DPS and is more heat efficient, meaning the sooner you can let off the larges and lay into the target with the SRMs the better.

I think that's the smallest change I can manage that might help with what you described. It may also be solved by tactical compensation. Finding an avenue of approach that doesn't leave you exposed as long, maybe. The four large lasers have decent alpha damage, but once they get hot you are probably going to lose the sustained DPS game.

I'm tinkering with it in Smurfy's, but all of my other ideas are more drastic overhauls of the design, and change it too much, I fear. I can post those up if you'd like, though.

By all means, please do. That configuration is the one i feel the most confortable with, because i can lay down the hurt from all ranges and help my team by dealing as much damage to critical areas as posible during the time i'm alive (if i die: around 500 - 600 to CTs and STs. If im alive by the end or the round: about 800 but by then i'm lucky if i still have a weapon)

But with the recent nerf to srms, and the Stalker's own clumsiness its hard to really damage relatively mobile targets with the srms. Of course if i go toe to toe with a target as big and slow as me, i will bring it down before i go. I may not live long enough to tell the story, but when going against the 15-ton-heavier Atlas practically guarantees that kill, at least if i opened up properly when closing in with 2 alphas from my 4 LLas, and keep it up with the srms when close to him.
The Stalker just feels like a much more potent weapons platform than an Atlas (unless he packs an AC20 and knows how to use it, then i start to feel scared)

EmperorMyrf, on 26 March 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

No glaring issues really, and props on filling every slot.

I would change it up only slightly, because right now your long range group is more hot than your short range group. Simply drop both medium lasers and one large laser, and add a large pulse laser. Medium lasers are less damage efficient in the field; a pair will do 10 damage for 8 heat, while the LPL does it for 7.3 heat on top of the small boost in range. The LL that has been dropped will not effect your sustained DPS for your large lasers, only your maximum. So:

Previous:
Long Range HPS: 6.59
Long Range maxDPS: 8.47
Long Range susDPS: 3.65
Short Range HPS: 5.2
Short Range maxDPS: 10.18
Short Range susDPS: 5.56

New:
Long Range HPS: 4.94 (decreased)
Long Range maxDPS: 6.35 (decreased)
Long Range susDPS: 3.65 (same)
Short Range HPS: 5.03 (decreased)

Short Range maxDPS: 10.18 (same)
Short Range susDPS: 5.75 (increase)

So, a drop in maxDPS for your large lasers gives you a longer endurance overall. You have max armor, so you now have a payload that keeps up with it.

That Sustained DPS calculation was awesome, really showcased why the mech its too hot to use while at medium range (when the LLas AND the srms can hit) because the LLas ARE too hot.

Will try your suggestion about changing the mediums for a LPL. Let you know how that goes.

Thank you for your responses and suggestions, this thread is awesome.

[Protection]

cdrolly, on 26 March 2013 - 07:56 PM, said:

Can you optimize this for me?
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...6f71e53edb526f2

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...dde37bf1bbf00cc

300 STD engine gave you the space needed for Endo Steel, so you move faster, have more armour, and are the same heat.

Edited by Protection, 26 March 2013 - 08:05 PM.

[Protection]

Nicholas Steiner, on 26 March 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

this is what I was using before the patch with sucess
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a93941fa051b3c5

and here's what I'm thinking of switching too
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...754399595e6b001

what are your thoughts? I know it's a little crazy to have two different types of srms, but my machine's not the best and its hard for me to get solid hits with pain srms constantly.

You're well optimized, but I agree - mixing the SRMs is a little wonky. It feels like you're making more work for yourself than you have to. You might want to consider just going for triple streaks if you don't feel confident with regular SRMs (especially since they got nerfed). The lone AC/2 also feels a little weird, because it is a very soft hitting weapon, and difficult to get much value out of (especially for 6 hefty tons). It might be worth considering trying to shoot for an AC/5 or even a UAC/5, as the damage per ton is a little bit better, and you can free up some tonnage with triple streaks, or dropping the AMS, or a smaller engine (250 is still quite respectable on a Centurion).

It's all up to you, but your optimization is good.

[Protection]

ZeProme, on 26 March 2013 - 05:45 PM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...740a33b7be687b6
CPLT-A1-ZeProme-Artemis-LRMnSRM

What do you think of this build? I have the Catapult CPT-A1 variant but given the price it is really expensive, maybe not fit for regular pugging. Oh yeah, I notice that the energy efficiency is terrible still new to this mech lab. XD

Can anyone give me a rough guide line for SRM and LRM boat? Both artemis and non-artemis? Cause I'm a bit annoyed by unable to defend myself in close combat.

I tended this to be a missile boat but so far it's not working well for me. Thanks!

Better and finalized version of my CN9-A: CN9-A-ZeProme-Modified-CN9-A

Centurion looks optimized, although managing four weapon groups wont be easy.

Catapult is very close. Two minor changes. First, the 260XL and 265XL weigh the same, so take the larger one for no tonnage cost. Second, move the ammo away from those side torsos - it's a ticking time bomb ready to kill your mech in there. In the arms/legs, worst case scenario you lose the limb, but survive.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...25fe62e59c20833

[Drollzy]

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 08:04 PM, said:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...dde37bf1bbf00cc

300 STD engine gave you the space needed for Endo Steel, so you move faster, have more armour, and are the same heat.

WOW many thanks bro great job.... really impressed

[Drollzy]

How about my CTF build can this be optimized at all? Lol you may see a pattern Im loving y ERLL's since the missile nerf... Should I put atlest one JJ on her?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...51be32a8aa49d19

yeh the link would help aye...

Edited by cdrolly, 26 March 2013 - 08:30 PM.

[Protection]

Umbravox, on 26 March 2013 - 06:01 PM, said:

Nothing is sacred to this build. I just want to run a tbt-7m that is mobile and has enough killing power that it isnt forced into a pure fire support role.

Thanks =)

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...045ba8f961a128f

It's really well optimized and pretty much good to go.

The only option, since leaving that .07 tons unspent is a bit of a downer, and max leg armour is not all that important, you could lower each leg to 40 - still quite strong for a medium, and up the engine to a 285XL for a wee bit more speed.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...7e3c81becc2c481
But it's not a big deal, and probably not worth the 3-4 million C-Bills for the engine if you already own the 280XL.

The other option doing that would be to dump the engine heatsink (and run a little hotter), but pick up a 300XL (with zero extra heatsinks). You run a little bit hotter, but you also go 106kph instead of 100kph.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...1cdb12472676a68



But, as I said, there is nothing wrong with it as is. It's got potential to be a very good Trebuchet.

[Biggieboy]

Lemme just say what an awesome community this is. I don't think I'd see people helping each other like this in other shooters for example. I don't need help atm, just want to say it's so nice of you guys to do this

[Gidonihah]

cdrolly, on 26 March 2013 - 08:30 PM, said:

How about my CTF build can this be optimized at all? Lol you may see a pattern Im loving y ERLL's since the missile nerf... Should I put atlest one JJ on her?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...51be32a8aa49d19

yeh the link would help aye...

That definitely looks like it would benefit from Poptarting, The question is do we wish to sacrifice speed or Heatsinks? Either works.

Sacrifice Heat
Well I removed 2 DHS to make room for Endosteel, upped the engine to 340 and added two Jumpjets, then maxed all armor. Annoyingly theirs still more than a ton left. CTF-3D
Oh well, at least it forms a pyramid.

Sacrifice Speed
CTF-3D
You only lose 1 DHS.. but have lower speed.

Beats me why I'm trying to add 2 Jumpjets instead of any other amount.

Edited by Gidonihah, 26 March 2013 - 08:50 PM.

[Drollzy]

Gidonihah, on 26 March 2013 - 08:38 PM, said:

That definitely looks like it would benefit from Poptarting, The question is do we wish to sacrifice speed or Heatsinks? Either works.

Thanks Gidonihah might drop one Heatsink and roll with some coolants thanks for the advice

[Drollzy]

Gidonihah, on 26 March 2013 - 08:38 PM, said:

That definitely looks like it would benefit from Poptarting, The question is do we wish to sacrifice speed or Heatsinks? Either works.

Sacrifice Heat
Well I removed 2 DHS to make room for Endosteel, upped the engine to 340 and added two Jumpjets, then maxed all armor. Annoyingly theirs still more than a ton left. CTF-3D
Oh well, at least it forms a pyramid.

Actually I like the sound of your second suggestion

[Drollzy]

Gidonihah, on 26 March 2013 - 08:38 PM, said:

That definitely looks like it would benefit from Poptarting, The question is do we wish to sacrifice speed or Heatsinks? Either works.

Sacrifice Heat
Well I removed 2 DHS to make room for Endosteel, upped the engine to 340 and added two Jumpjets, then maxed all armor. Annoyingly theirs still more than a ton left. CTF-3D
Oh well, at least it forms a pyramid.

Sacrifice Speed
CTF-3D
You only lose 1 DHS.. but have lower speed.

Beats me why I'm trying to add 2 Jumpjets instead of any other amount.

lol thanks man I think i like the idea of the bigger engine and full armor I find i get shot in the legs a lot when poptarting, not sure if I have an XL340 lying around i have the CTF speedtweaked so that extra speed plus the jump ability sounds like a lot of fun.

Thanks heaps Bro

[Protection]

cdrolly, on 26 March 2013 - 08:30 PM, said:

How about my CTF build can this be optimized at all? Lol you may see a pattern Im loving y ERLL's since the missile nerf... Should I put atlest one JJ on her?

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...51be32a8aa49d19

yeh the link would help aye...

Hmm, this is a hard one.


I will warn you - jump jets on a 3D is pretty much "the big thing" right now - the flavour of the month, if you will.

It will dramatically change how you play, as "poptarting" (that is, using jumpjets to 'pop' up and down from behind cover - ideally moving laterally as well) is one of the big gameplay styles right now. So basically, you jump up while moving, find a target, give him a good long scrape with your lasers (or PPCs, or Gauss), and then land where he cannot directly shoot back at you. Ideally beyond 500 meters to be really safe.

It isn't all that easy at first, but when done right it is very powerful, very hard to stop, and is pretty much the big reason 3D Cataphracts are as popular as they are right now. Also, many PUGs will hate you for doing it. It's up to you if that is an avenue that you might want to pursue, but jump jets may forever change you - fair warning.


(that said, my main mech is a PPC+ERPPC+Gauss Poptart, so. . . )

Anyhow, as for the build. As it is, it's quite well optimized, about as good as it can get.


Now if you want this to become a Poptart, you will have to give up speed an heat efficiency (almost every Poptart runs a little hot, because they can take their time and cool off behind cover).

The lazy way to make it into a Poptart is like this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...186b59977b0cafb

But this design bugs me, because it can fit endo steel, but cannot make use of the tonnage.
As seen here: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b4623200ddf1118
1.44 Tons unspent - drives me crazy.


The Lasers make it really hard to fit heatsinks in appropriately.

This is about the best I can come up with: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a31a11c9a298e48

Different option: this design is a bit hotter and slower, but if you notice, I replaced the XL engine with a Standard, making the design more durable: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...694e983393cd422


And finally, one different idea, if you do not want to Poptart:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ae34aaace6abf3f
Standard engine - you become much more durable, but lose a little heat efficiency and about 8kph.


If you want to Poptart, you don't need all 4 JJs, 2 is usually enough, but 3 or 4 can make it easier.

[Drollzy]

Protection, on 26 March 2013 - 09:06 PM, said:

Hmm, this is a hard one.


I will warn you - jump jets on a 3D is pretty much "the big thing" right now - the flavour of the month, if you will.

It will dramatically change how you play, as "poptarting" (that is, using jumpjets to 'pop' up and down from behind cover - ideally moving laterally as well) is one of the big gameplay styles right now. So basically, you jump up while moving, find a target, give him a good long scrape with your lasers (or PPCs, or Gauss), and then land where he cannot directly shoot back at you. Ideally beyond 500 meters to be really safe.

It isn't all that easy at first, but when done right it is very powerful, very hard to stop, and is pretty much the big reason 3D Cataphracts are as popular as they are right now. Also, many PUGs will hate you for doing it. It's up to you if that is an avenue that you might want to pursue, but jump jets may forever change you - fair warning.


(that said, my main mech is a PPC+ERPPC+Gauss Poptart, so. . . )

Anyhow, as for the build. As it is, it's quite well optimized, about as good as it can get.


Now if you want this to become a Poptart, you will have to give up speed an heat efficiency (almost every Poptart runs a little hot, because they can take their time and cool off behind cover).

The lazy way to make it into a Poptart is like this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...186b59977b0cafb

But this design bugs me, because it can fit endo steel, but cannot make use of the tonnage.
As seen here: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b4623200ddf1118
1.44 Tons unspent - drives me crazy.


The Lasers make it really hard to fit heatsinks in appropriately.

This is about the best I can come up with: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...a31a11c9a298e48

Different option: this design is a bit hotter and slower, but if you notice, I replaced the XL engine with a Standard, making the design more durable: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...694e983393cd422


And finally, one different idea, if you do not want to Poptart:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ae34aaace6abf3f
Standard engine - you become much more durable, but lose a little heat efficiency and about 8kph.


If you want to Poptart, you don't need all 4 JJs, 2 is usually enough, but 3 or 4 can make it easier.

I might roll with the full 4 JJ's as I still want some speed on the ground and I know what you mean about the free tons always drives me crazy too.

Thanks between the two of you I have a few options so I will play around with it... Thanks again guys much appreciated.

[Biggieboy]

actually, come to think of it, can you make a decent build for JR7-K? I hate that mech. you have carte blanche

[Gidonihah]

JR7-K

Its Poptart Junior! Now to hide before Protection kills me for posting an altered Hawkwings "Competitive" Raven.

Treat it like a Poptarter Cataphract instead of a typical Light.

Edited by Gidonihah, 26 March 2013 - 09:54 PM.

[Protection]

Biggieboy, on 26 March 2013 - 09:21 PM, said:

actually, come to think of it, can you make a decent build for JR7-K? I hate that mech. you have carte blanche

Jenner K is a bit of a hassle. The one missile hardpoint makes it a real pain. The extra module might be nice for stuffing in a cool shot if you have the money, allowing you to cut down on heatsinks.

Pretty Standard:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...874cfcb952bf565
(It's the simple, typical Jenner. It doesn't need all 5 JJs, but that's like half the fun of Jennering.)

Similar:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d27cfeee4c8f0c3

No Missile Build:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...777191254b6b21a


"I Wish I was in a Jenner-D"
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...cb6055549b99d96
(Very heat efficient)

"Me Too"
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...2499fbdf940f866
(Very hot)


The "Damon Howe":
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...2f9ca7cb018da54
(I warn you, this is a very unorthodox build. It is absolutely terrible at fighting other light mechs, but can strip rear armour from heavies and assaults really well if you are sneaky enough)


There's a lot of other designs as well. Usually Jenners like a big 300XL engine (fastest mech in the game), decent energy weapons and 'OK' heat management. Going slow is usually a death sentence in a light, but if you needed to you could drop to a 275XL without it being a travesty. Keep your head movement spastic and don't be afraid to run away, hide, and cool off when things get too intense. Whittle down bigger mechs piece by piece, and avoid anything loaded with Streaks.