96 replies to this topic

[Ryvucz]

Texas Merc, on 02 April 2013 - 10:10 PM, said:

Nick LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE lulz PLAY THE GAME AND ASK IN GAME. 75% were having problems. no acknowledgement. not even going into the other gripes people have that they don't acknowledge. I guess the only reason they still have jobs is because they cant get people to replace them?

also raspberry tea is delicious but I prefer pomegranate

I know about the issues, trust me. XD

But I also know that patch day brings instability from the servers as well.

Give them a few days to collect the data as usual, and they can make adjustments and a hotfix if it is an easy fix. =)

[Ryvucz]

Niko Snow, on 02 April 2013 - 10:18 PM, said:

As I'm always available to take one for the team: you are also permitted to paparazzi me at the beach and declare me pregnant with the child of Andy Chambers.

Wait... what?

NO!

XD

[Texas Merc]

just stop

[Moromillas]

Wow, 83.87% of players are awfully confused.

They listen, 100% of the time.

[Valdez Raptor]

Moromillas, on 02 April 2013 - 10:30 PM, said:

Wow, 83.87% of players are awfully confused.

They listen, 100% of the time.

I will state this is also an opinionated poll on what you feel how well they are listening. I honestly feel some things they are not being responsive enough to show they are listening to their player base. But I have the data of what I see and what I garner while their tools and perspective is beyond what I am able to see. So what is my opinion and actuality for myself and others will of course be different. Though wouldn't it be beneficial for them to see how their customers are feeling?

[Barghest Whelp]

Yeah, it's funny. First we ask for coolant flush and we're told no. We're fine with it. Then we're told we'll not only get coolant flush, but also a p2w implementation.

Forums become a hot cauldron of doom, they change things to becom less p2w, but ignore the fact that most of the community has stated that we don't actually want this, and that we're concerned with PGI going back on their word. Then comes the message that 3pv is going to be implemented, even though it's very clear that the community is against it, and to top it off they also have the audacity to ask us for our opinion, stating that there's no point in telling them that we don't want it, or why we don't want it.

Yeah, I'd say a lot of what we say falls on deaf ears.

[Fox News Channel]

Niko, any chance we can get FULL patch notes?

[MischiefSC]

Yes they listen. Of course they listen.

What they should NOT do is take us serious all the time.

Or even most the time.

Some of the time though, yeah.

Which they do. Whatever my personal issues with things in MWO (and have absolutely no doubt that the devs are more critical of MWO than any of us are they just don't come to the forums to complain) I am 100% satisfied with the professional response from PGI to issues and concerns.

The consumables concern? Very well handled and addressed. Missile balance issues? Solid response, erred on the side of caution. The solutions were not the one I'd have recommended or thought I wanted but they are a good compromise that I can deal with.

I've had some consistent HUD issues since the patch. I know and expect that it likely will take a couple of days for PGI to make an intelligent and well prepared response. I expect it to - it should. It's easy to give a knee-jerk response to consumer complaints. I'd rather have a well handled solution.

If you can't handle a software product that is getting new content and updates bi-weekly having some periodic technical issues then you are likely going to have a lot of issues with... well, anything and everything in the modern age.

Testing will only do so much and find so much prior to release into beta. You are a beta tester you know. That's, well, sorta what you're doing when you play this game. You're getting to play it before it's considered by the developers good to release. That they're helping fund it by letting people buy in game stuff that they'll get to keep after beta to help fund further development isn't a new concept either. That doesn't mean it's not a beta, it just means that it's helping fund development from consumers prior to release.

Relax, be cool. You've shaken the poor cripple from his bed to deal with you. In two weeks you won't even remember this. We'll probably still be talking about how to make arty and JDAM more useful without being OP but the rest? Settled.

[TehSBGX]

Niko Snow, on 02 April 2013 - 10:18 PM, said:

As I'm always available to take one for the team: you are also permitted to paparazzi me at the beach and declare me pregnant with the child of Andy Chambers.

Niko! You Said the baby was MINE! RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE!

[Xyroc]

Voted 100% they listen or well take in consideration and decided what they feel is best. Read OP started to give a big comment but then saw Niko Snow handling it well props man.

[The Silent Protagonist]

Niko Snow, on 02 April 2013 - 10:26 PM, said:

Fine, fine... Michael Fassbender then.

Story of your sex life?

In other news, I put in the pointless poll "75%" because I am translating what you said into what I think you meant, OP, which was "Do PGI do what we tell them to?". We have to remember there are things that cannot be done due to no fault of their own; some things are wriggly little f**kers like the old RVN-3L with 300 ping, and will take a looooong time to fix; some people will complain over new content being released (which is never, EVER a bad thing, except when SOE broke SWG... but PGI won't do that, they love this game too much) over a bug fix... I'm getting tired of this stuff, I hesitate to say people are acting "entitled", as I know that's not the right word for it (after all, as consumers we are entitled to the best quality of service these lads at PGI can give, and they do so admirably) but it's the closest I can think of.

Edited by Lt XKalibur, 02 April 2013 - 11:17 PM.

[Teralitha]

Helmer, on 02 April 2013 - 09:23 PM, said:

Listen? Yes, 100% of the time.

The individual Developers read the forums, Garth compiles info from the forums, Niko Snow compiles even more feedback from the forums, moderators poke developers with posts, forum users MP Devs.... there's ALOT of listening (reading) going on..

Thats alot of time spent reading. Heck I know I have spent entire days off work doing nothing but reading/posting on these forums and thats just in the general forum mostly.

Its no wonder the devs work so slow.... most of their time is spent reading forums.

[Exoth3rmic]

Its a question of effort vs reward when there's a finite amount of time available. Also they maintain that the users don't always know what they want, or at least the users don't always know what is best for them/the game.

Mr Eckman, for example, is fond of saying that features they believe they get right can be adjudged to be a success if "only half our users hate them". (See his drops with the NGNG crew to hear him say this).

They also mentioned, in relation to ECM as an example, that player reactions with perceived or actual imbalances need to be given time to work through the game before they step in.

Hence the "counters" to ECM and the lack of movement on that front. Their personal opinion was that ECM is working as intended with the current tools to counter it. Community disagrees, time passes, community still disagrees and is owed a command chair post.

As another example, missiles bugs with splash one week then spash and damage another. The splash problem was found by users from a patch late Feb/Start of March - still not "fixed". The damage bug found by users from the patch end of March - was game breaking was "fixed" by gimping the damage but unable to move on due to the previous bug - still unresolved. All of which generated lots of threads.

Then look at the implementation of coolant, they showed how they wanted to implement it - much QQ ensued as it was indeed a bad way to do it, they then released another revised way of it to work which appeased the masses and then implemented it in a slightly different form regardless but steering away from the main issues the community first had.

So, do they listen? Yes. Do they always act? No. Should they always act immediately? Probably not.

One thing is for sure, for an "online" game they need a much faster response time to community concerns even if it is just a "we hear what you're saying today, and we will be reviewing it tomorrow". That would pee on a lot of brush fires and make everyone's stay here much easier.

Edited by Exoth3rmic, 02 April 2013 - 11:33 PM.

[Teralitha]

Helmer, on 02 April 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:

Listening does not equate to agree with.
Cheers.

To agree or disagree with something means you have an opinion about it. Doesnt mean its the correct one, or deals with facts.

If 100% of the player base agreed on something, but if 1 dev disagrees... thats the end of it. All of our feedback meant nothing.

That is the impression we have. After all that "listening" there ought to be more responding. Without reponses, we assume it was ignored.

Edited by Teralitha, 02 April 2013 - 11:34 PM.

[pjnt]

Bluten, on 02 April 2013 - 09:33 PM, said:

Read/see does not equal listen. If they listened, ECM/BAP would have been fixed months ago, assuming ECM was even dropped on us in the state it was. It's almost 5 months now since that horrible patch happened. Still not fixed, despite months of complaints from their community. It wasn't until recently that they even acknowledged that something "might be" wrong with it. At this point we're going for a "better late than never..." rationalization.

Pretty much this ^^. I'd add they don't acknowledge much either and since there is a sweeping lack of clarity on what they are doing we dangle like loose ends. I mean when patch notes are released, outside of a couple lines in the command chair, we don't know what to expect and how our voices have been heard.


BTW, Bluten, dude. Liking you own posts is very tacky. You got like 3800 posts with 3200 likes. What happened, you not like 600 of your own posts?

added fix on clarity.

Edited by pjnt, 02 April 2013 - 11:39 PM.

[DaZur]

Teralitha, on 02 April 2013 - 11:32 PM, said:

That is the impression we have. After all that "listening" there ought to be more responding. Without responses, we assume it was ignored.

Ya see this is the crux of the problem... The expectation of "each and every suggestion, comment and observation" to receive an exclusive acknowledgement and affirmation.

Not every suggestion is viable and worthy of consideration, not every comment requires discussion and not every observation requires due diligence. The expectation of PGI to have running dialogue for every utterance made by the community is ridiculous and pedantic.

... Not even mentioning the fact that anything mentioned by a PGI representative is scrutinized under a microscope, run through the panel of community experts and chiseled in stone as the word of God because... heaven forbid they be human and fallible.

Edited by DaZur, 03 April 2013 - 05:27 AM.

[Darwins Dog]

They have proven time and again that they do listen to the community. Keep in mind that there's a difference between listening and acting. They don't always do what people want them to, but they do listen.

[Noobzorz]

PGI seems to have their finger on the pulse. What they don't have is:

A) a dependable revenue stream

resources

I think the people there are doing a good job. I think the team needs to be much larger. I don't think there is a solution for this unnerving tendency towards increasingly draconian revenue methods, but as long as they stop at the LoL end of the spectrum rather than the WoT end, I will keep playing.

I would, however, love to know if WoT will be the exception to the rule, or if that kind of model is really sustainable. Certainly the system requirements and complexity in MWO cut off a large proportion of the not-really-a-gamer-but-I-love-tanks demographic, but with how FASA has managed to monetize its TT game, I could see this working out. Anyway, I hope I never get to see that data, but if I did I'd be interested to know.

[AMC Eagle]

Texas Merc, on 02 April 2013 - 10:04 PM, said:

I have been told to take a break(don't play don't spend money) so I guess that's what I will do. Hell with the constant FPS drops and NEW/OLD bugs why the hell not.

niko you are a shill and you need not comment just gather data that's your job right?

this is general discussion and in general the game is almost unplayable for the majority I.E. lots o people mad about not being able to play robots

I seem to be able to play it just fine.

[Joseph Mallan]

You do know that just because they do not do what whine about does not mean they don't listen. Plus what do you do when part of your community wants X but the other part wants Y. You can't have both and one is mutually exclusive of the other, so While they are trying to solve the riddle a new party shows up and throws in Z and mucks up everything.

Be a parent of 2 or more kids someday. You'll understand the problem better!