1089 replies to this topic

[StalaggtIKE]

ClaymoreReIIik, on 19 April 2013 - 05:32 AM, said:

Just try your own ******** game without ECM. You will notice that you have an even greater variance in fighting distances without it then with it....

Agreed. Matches without ECM result in more fulfilling games. No wonder all of the ECM counters are made to temporarily shut it off. It's during those brief moment the game becomes fun. You have less cap-wars and blobs of stealth Assaults sneaking around the corner. You duke it out; with the better players being able to flank if necessary. ECM was supposed to be a scouting tool, instead it became the easy- button for those that could not flank or counter LRM. If PGI felt LRM and SSRM needed to be adressed they should have done so the right way.

Edit: The worst part however, is the fact that ECM is not a part of IW, it is the IW pillar. Also, Null sig, stealth armor and angel ECM will not be seeing an appearance as ECM currently does their jobs. So no new future tech is planned. Yay!

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 19 April 2013 - 06:21 AM.

[Twisted Power]

Well maybe with the private matches the community can weed out crappy ECM matches by verbally agreeing not to use it. Then maybe the 2/3 of my unit that drops twice a month will play often again.

Edited by Twisted Power, 19 April 2013 - 06:42 AM.

[Critical Fumble]

StalaggtIKE, on 19 April 2013 - 06:07 AM, said:

Spoiler

Agreed. Matches without ECM result in more fulfilling games. No wonder all of the ECM counters are made to temporarily shut it off. It's during those brief moment the game becomes fun. You have less cap-wars and blobs of stealth Assaults sneaking around the corner. You duke it out; with the better players being able to flank if necessary. ECM was supposed to be a scouting tool, instead it became the easy- button for those that could not flank or counter LRM. If PGI felt LRM and SSRM needed to be adressed they should have done so the right way.

Edit: The worst part however, is the fact that ECM is not a part of IW, it is the IW pillar. Also, Null sig, stealth armor and angel ECM will not be seeing an appearance as ECM currently does their jobs. So no new future tech is planned. Yay!

Here's what I don't get - if they LIKE this effect, why didn't they make it the innate state of all mechs, and have other gear bring it to what we had in the early beta.

[StalaggtIKE]

Critical Fumble, on 19 April 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

Here's what I don't get - if they LIKE this effect, why didn't they make it the innate state of all mechs, and have other gear bring it to what we had in the early beta.

Exactly. Or just add passive/active radar, like they plan on doing btw. This would allow people to play a more skillful game, without a 1.5 ton device doing it for you.

Honestly, I think it just boils down to ECM being someone's pet project. They want to be able to say this was theirs and they made a mark on the game. It's silly..., go make a camo skin if you want to be able to point something out to your friends.

• Stop ruining the fragile balance of this game with a bogus all-in-one gadget.
  
• Stop stifling future technology in this game due to a gadget that already does its job.
  
• Stop creating stupid counters just to counter this nonsense.

At what cost will it take, before there is an internal intervention?

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 19 April 2013 - 07:24 AM.

[Critical Fumble]

StalaggtIKE, on 19 April 2013 - 07:17 AM, said:

At what cost will it take, before there is an internal intervention?

I'm hoping that they're just distracted because of the feature set they want for full "release"; and that when they're out from underneath the backlog they'll take a meaningful balance pass that is not apparent from the party line. Note the use of "hoping".

In any case, for their sake I do hope they actually do manage to get their ducks in a row in time for their desired release date, because release means reviews, and reviews mean a great reckoning for all the awesome and anti-awesome (pun intended) deeds a developer has done in a project.

The second option is if someone puts out a direct competitor. Then its all down to which game is more fun. My money is on the one with fewer hard counters.

[Twisted Power]

They didn't put in into the closed beta for 2 reasons: One, I'm sure while they had the idea for it, it prob wasn't ready. Two, the founders would have asked for refunds.



ECM limits all the gameplay that makes Mech Warrior different from other FPS (except for movement), and turns it into a direct fire game.

They wanted to wait till they diversified their testing pool to people who would like MW to more FPS and less finesse.

[StalaggtIKE]

Twisted Power, on 19 April 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

They didn't put in into the closed beta for 2 reasons: One, I'm sure while they had the idea for it, it prob wasn't ready. Two, the founders would have asked for refunds.



ECM limits all the gameplay that makes Mech Warrior different from other FPS (except for movement), and turns it into a direct fire game.

They wanted to wait till they diversified their testing pool to people who would like MW to more FPS and less finesse.

So they pulled a DICE?

Edit: I'll clarify- When BF3 was announced it was promised to be the "true successor to BF2!" We got excited and preordered. Got access to closed Alpha and the game was really fun, minus some key features. We of course figured they would be added later. After open Beta, it was speculated that they weren't intending to add anything else. You had a lot of upset people and a lot of whiteknights saying "it's only Beta!" By release it was obvious that they're goal was not to make a successor but a direct competitor to CoD:MW3. So what we got was a CoD clone with traces of BF elements. It was a fun game, a damn fun game, but not what I was hopping for.

If this story is sounding eerily similar..., yeah.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 19 April 2013 - 08:53 AM.

[Ryebear]

Ok this is turning into Chicken Little **** right here.

This game isnt and will not be an FPS CoD clone. It doesnt matter how annoying ECM or poptarting or strictly using high damage high alpha weapons this game has become. A pistol in any modern military shooter has more instant kill potential than any ECM covered 6 PPC Stalker will ever have.

[StalaggtIKE]

Ryebear, on 19 April 2013 - 09:08 AM, said:

Ok this is turning into Chicken Little **** right here.

This game isnt and will not be an FPS CoD clone. It doesnt matter how annoying ECM or poptarting or strictly using high damage high alpha weapons this game has become. A pistol in any modern military shooter has more instant kill potential than any ECM covered 6 PPC Stalker will ever have.

You do realize that COD is a very popular game? Not saying it is heading in that direction, but if MWO were to become a COD (or more likely, Hawken) clone, it would probably be more beneficial to the dev's pockets. Thus no falling sky. Just saying, bad analogy is bad.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 19 April 2013 - 09:14 AM.

[El Bandito]

I will be happy if they reduced the ECM bubble to 120 meters from 180.

Or better, let ECM only cloak the using mech, not his friends.

Edited by El Bandito, 19 April 2013 - 09:28 AM.

[Twisted Power]

I don't think this game could ever be CoD.

However if you have a 3rd person style shooting direct fire game you get... Word of Tanks? (well yes and no)

With the game design as it is, MW:O could never be any sort of clone even for WoT. However what is MechWarrior can be dumbed down enough and/or have mechanics so that it feels more like those game and less like its own unique play type.

ECM (not the fact that we have it but its mechanics) and many announced updates (3rd person) are the homogenization of multiple game play styles all into one game to give MW:O feels from other popular markets so that it will increase the user base. They want multiple reasons for somebody outside of the "fans" to say, I can play that because it is sort of like "X" game. You have to remember you are already playing their game, you don't matter so much because their players base is not as large as the other popular games.

Thus breaking away from the masses will not happen. ECM is going to forever cloak teammates. Founders are only the foundation not the goal. That is why they are at the bottom and nobody reaches for that. They reach for the top (the other "players" who might not have picked this game up). They no longer need to hear to us. Only placate. They need to hear the people who have not yet played the game and entice them to join. Anyways the founders are "pot committed".


Wrong marketing strat to me, not that it wont work because it will but it is rather insulting to fans.

Edited by Twisted Power, 19 April 2013 - 11:55 AM.

[Marcus Tanner]

Twisted Power, on 19 April 2013 - 11:50 AM, said:

You have to remember you are already playing their game, you don't matter so much because their players base is not as large as the other popular games.

Well, I'm not so much playing their game these days. Not since the announcement, I think. I've been sticking around in the hope that they would come to their senses, but that hope is dimming.

They could do something to fix it incidentally without touching ECM I suppose. Perhaps some shiny object they come out with might bring me back. Really, I think something will have to change form here before I launch another game. However, more and more I feel as if the game they want to make isn't for me.

[Augmenautus Rex]

I like ECM the way it is. Without ECM or if ECM is heavily nerfed the game becomes a boring exercise in watching assault mechs slowly blow each other away with long range missiles. ECM forces people to stick together and actually have some mech variety on the teams. You need light and medium mechs to kill the ECM lights, and you need heavy and assault mechs to take hits and give your team some brawn.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Twisted Power, on 19 April 2013 - 11:50 AM, said:

With the game design as it is, MW:O could never be any sort of clone even for WoT

except this game is such a port of that game even the price model is the same O.o

[Ravenspyre]

Augmenautus Rex, on 19 April 2013 - 04:18 PM, said:

I like ECM the way it is. Without ECM or if ECM is heavily nerfed the game becomes a boring exercise in watching assault mechs slowly blow each other away with long range missiles. ECM forces people to stick together and actually have some mech variety on the teams. You need light and medium mechs to kill the ECM lights, and you need heavy and assault mechs to take hits and give your team some brawn.

It isn't missiles that do that, it's tactics that do that. ECM doesn't force people to stick together and have variety. There is less variety in ECM teams than anything else, and trying to pretend there is is just silly.

Anyways, it's funny how that the ECM thread has been unpinned, guess PGI wants it to die now.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Accalia, on 19 April 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

It isn't missiles that do that, it's tactics that do that. ECM doesn't force people to stick together and have variety. There is less variety in ECM teams than anything else, and trying to pretend there is is just silly.

Anyways, it's funny how that the ECM thread has been unpinned, guess PGI wants it to die now.

THEY wanted this issue to die back when they said "its working as intended" and "its meant to be polarizing" in that pcgamer or whatever interview

[Peiper]

Exactly. Sometime partway through the last official thread they said they were stopping listening to us (processing all the information/they had the information and ideas they wanted) and anything written beyond that point; there was no guarantee it would be red. Makes me wonder if all 47 of these pages has been spitting in the wind.

Does that mean we have to start flooding the forums with ECM suggestions again now that there's no official repository for it?

Better pin this one back up, mods. Or IS this your subtle way of saying PGI has gone even further into the land of denial?

miSs, on 19 April 2013 - 08:08 PM, said:

Not at all. This is simple forum management: we just needed to pin more recent topics.


This thread is still open for discussion and we're still reading your feedback.

Cheers

Who's we? The mods or devs? We BELIEVE you when you say you send information up the pipe. But is there a furnace at the end of that pipe burning all the ideas?

[TaintedDoughnut]

Try to say it again yes all 47 pages have been spitting into the wind like the what thousand other pages of ECM feedback. The response is clear even if they 'listen to the community' (just the thought makes me LOL) they don't give one surats hindquarters what the community thinks because remember the forums are just a 'vocal minority' never mind I can site at least 5 people I know personally who quite playing over ECM who never bothered with the forums. But again since were on the forums we don't count the only voices that count are the ones not speaking....how does that work?
Ohh right they just don't care and sorry but the more they deny it one minute they more they prove it with their actions the next.(see 3rd person)
ECM is not a balanced item in game and numerous sound options like enabling LOS targeting with increase lock on times or having BAP hard counter it have been proposed till people are blue in the face. But the devs do not care they just want to throw up a smoke screen take peoples money and produce a horrible product because they can use a famed franchise to sell it. Which frankly I find personally insulting as someone who use to demo said franchise and run tournaments for it. Sadly this game has had a negative impact on Battletech as a TT game when I get asked if ECM is broken in the TT version to....thats BAD with a capitol BAD.
Let alone you speak ill of community relations(or blatant lack there of) you get your posts deleted. Which goes to show pointing out flaws is not welcome. They only want to hear praise and that everything is 'working as intended'
Seen EA have better PR and thats well...I can't think of a bigger insult.
But I guess the ultimate joke is on me they got my money already...but I at least like a cigarette after I get screwed..can I get one devs?

[Peiper]

TaintedDoughnut, on 19 April 2013 - 09:35 PM, said:

Try to say it again yes all 47 pages have been spitting into the wind like the what thousand other pages of ECM feedback. The response is clear even if they 'listen to the community' (just the thought makes me LOL) they don't give one surats hindquarters what the community thinks because remember the forums are just a 'vocal minority' never mind I can site at least 5 people I know personally who quite playing over ECM who never bothered with the forums. But again since were on the forums we don't count the only voices that count are the ones not speaking....how does that work?

You know, if the quiet majority keep quitting, maybe we'll become the vocal majority!

[Augmenautus Rex]

Accalia, on 19 April 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

It isn't missiles that do that, it's tactics that do that. ECM doesn't force people to stick together and have variety. There is less variety in ECM teams than anything else, and trying to pretend there is is just silly.

Anyways, it's funny how that the ECM thread has been unpinned, guess PGI wants it to die now.

If it wasn't for ecm why would you ever need to take anything beyond an assault mech with lrms?