82 replies to this topic

[Belorion]

Screech, on 18 April 2013 - 09:46 AM, said:

The real stat is KDR/WLR. Well not really but it does help clarify somethings.

How about KW/DLR

mine is 1.25

Actually my kdr and wlr are pretty close anyway.

[Lukoi Banacek]

Belorion, on 18 April 2013 - 09:36 AM, said:

It doesn't bother me.

Actually I would like to see the inclusion of recordable logs so more in-depth analysis of our matches is possible. (Which I stated earlier in the thread.)

They do not include other derived stats however. It doesn't make much sense to include this one over others. If elo does its job everyones krd will eventually tick closer to 1.

so why advocate for it's removal?

The game needs MORE stats (like BF3). Not less. And KDR certainly won't kill this game. How could it? If we're generally a more mature crowd as so many say, and KDR never killed a multitude of games...why does it hurt here? It doesn't.

[Willie Sauerland]

Belorion, on 18 April 2013 - 09:51 AM, said:

How about KW/DLR

mine is 1.25

Actually my kdr and wlr are pretty close anyway.

And what exactly is this supposed to tell me?

I am super awesome if the number is higher

even though one stat is more "individual"

than the other?

I can make a statistic out of anything,

but it doesn't mean it is useful...

Edited by Willie Sauerland, 18 April 2013 - 10:00 AM.

[Belorion]

Willie Sauerland, on 18 April 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

And what exactly is this supposed to tell me?

I am super awesome if the number is higher

even though one stat is more "individual"

than the other?

I can make a statistic out of anything,

but it doesn't mean it is useful...

I was joking about the KW/DLR stat.

[MaddMaxx]

Why not just have 1 rating. We could call it the E-Peen rating for the boys and the V-Peen rating for the girls. That way the boys and girls can intertwine their rating to maximize the ALLIN-Peen rating...

[Belorion]

Lukoi, on 18 April 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

so why advocate for it's removal?

The game needs MORE stats (like BF3). Not less. And KDR certainly won't kill this game. How could it? If we're generally a more mature crowd as so many say, and KDR never killed a multitude of games...why does it hurt here? It doesn't.

In isolation people get hung up on it. They should either include other derived stats, or include none. Kills and Deaths would still be there so people could figure it out if they like, but it doesn't need to be prominently displayed if they are not going to include other derived stats.

If they are only going to have one. It makes more sense for that to be win/loss as this is a team game. Win/Loss is what will be more important in CW when it comes. It won't matter what your personal kdr is if your faction isn't winning its matches. In the end all the stats should be taken with a grain of salt. People can be awesome players but the stats not reflect it, or they can be terrible players with inflated stats.

MaddMaxx, on 18 April 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

Why not just have 1 rating. We could call it the E-Peen rating for the boys and the V-Peen rating for the girls. That way the boys and girls can intertwine their rating to maximize the ALLIN-Peen rating...

Wouldn't that be the ELO rating? Probably the very reason PGI has made the decision not to publish it.

[Barghest Whelp]

TexAss, on 18 April 2013 - 06:34 AM, said:

oh yeah really, and when I'm the only sane one who went out to cap all the bases in conquest and made it last alive WINNING because of just me, who never saw an enemy, I don't get nothing for that in return?

sounds fair...NOT

nobody respects me walking my freakkin metal a$$ off in my 84kmh Jäger to all the bases in ALPINE anyway....

Yes, now I wrote stat. If you have some sort of great idea on how to quantify that in numbers, by all means. That would be a very interesting and meaningful stat to have. Mind you, assists and damage done still play a significant role. In fact, time spent taking damage is also a useful stat, as drawing fire away from your team is very helpful.

Much like your team kept the other team busy so that you could freely run around and cap like a happy hippo.

TexAss, on 18 April 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

I commented on the other guys assumption assists and damage are all we need.

I made a proposal a few post above yours how a good battle score should be calculated.

Yes, now the interesting thing here is, I was still busy typing when you posted that.

[Barghest Whelp]

MaddMaxx, on 18 April 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

Why not just have 1 rating. We could call it the E-Peen rating for the boys and the V-Peen rating for the girls. That way the boys and girls can intertwine their rating to maximize the ALLIN-Peen rating...

I insist we call it B or T peen for the girls. I mean seriously, since when did we ever measure a girls worth by judging what lies in the cleft between the legs?

Edited by Barghest Whelp, 18 April 2013 - 10:46 AM.

[MaddMaxx]

Barghest Whelp, on 18 April 2013 - 10:45 AM, said:

I insist we call it B or T peen for the girls. I mean seriously, since when did we ever measure a girls worth by judging what lies in the cleft between the legs?

So you mean to say there is no measurable difference between a Virgin and ***** as they are both female?

P.S. Darn it. Rolled Snakes Eyes, again.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 18 April 2013 - 10:53 AM.

[Willie Sauerland]

Belorion, on 18 April 2013 - 10:08 AM, said:

I was joking about the KW/DLR stat.

You do realize, I hope, that we are back

to that effective communication issue

we were discussing earlier?

Edited by Willie Sauerland, 18 April 2013 - 10:53 AM.

[Screech]

Barghest Whelp, on 18 April 2013 - 10:45 AM, said:

I insist we call it B or T peen for the girls. I mean seriously, since when did we ever measure a girls worth by judging what lies in the cleft between the legs?

*********. Wow that filter gets everything.

Edited by Screech, 18 April 2013 - 10:54 AM.

[Barghest Whelp]

Screech, on 18 April 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

*********. Wow that filter gets everything.

Yeah, tell me about it. If anything needs a nerf it's that darned profanity filter

[Zerberus]

Barghest Whelp, on 18 April 2013 - 10:45 AM, said:

I insist we call it B or T peen for the girls. I mean seriously, since when did we ever measure a girls worth by judging what lies in the cleft between the legs?

If we`re using e-peen, I think e-rack is the most senseful analogy. No sexism complaints becasue each get 4 letters. If anything the guys will complain for not having a proper word, then we`ll hotfix it to e-wang. That way it`s equally disrespectful to both.

Steamlines rebuttals, too. For ex. "Fine, we all agree I suck, ok? Now tuck your e-(x) back in and stop waving it in everyone`s face"

Edited by Zerberus, 18 April 2013 - 11:10 AM.

[Lugh]

Belorion, on 18 April 2013 - 05:30 AM, said:

What about if the team wins, and you top the damage chart but have no kills?

Belorion, on 18 April 2013 - 05:30 AM, said:

What about if the team wins, and you top the damage chart but have no kills?

I give you an example that is more horrifying. You end the match at 650 damage 0-2 kills, the rest of the team totals less than 400 damage together.
You still lose, your KDR isn't getting 'better' And yet you are still doing your part.

Hell even DAMAGE isn't a meaningful statisitic all the time as there was a match last night where a lancemate and I were on voice and someone in chat said they had tunnel.

Not a peep from him about being rushed the two of us died with 0 damage cored from the rear by 4 ac20 Jagers...

We know why we lost. It was the mute that claimed he had something covered and didn't say a word as he engaged and died to superior numbers. Then immediately disco'd

[Belorion]

Lugh, on 18 April 2013 - 11:10 AM, said:

Hell even DAMAGE isn't a meaningful statisitic all the time as there was a match last night where a lancemate and I were on voice and someone in chat said they had tunnel.

Very true. In fact a lower damage per kill *could* mean a much better player.

[Barghest Whelp]

Belorion, on 18 April 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Very true. In fact a lower damage per kill *could* mean a much better player.

Agreed. It's just that IMO damage done "usually" means more than kills, and assists certainly means more. 8 assist usually means you were there supporting your team all the time, and not sticking out your neck needlessly for a stupid kill.

[Willie Sauerland]

Barghest Whelp, on 18 April 2013 - 12:51 PM, said:

Agreed. It's just that IMO damage done "usually" means more than kills, and assists certainly means more. 8 assist usually means you were there supporting your team all the time, and not sticking out your neck needlessly for a stupid kill.

True, but if you chip the paint on the mech

you get an assist for the kill.

Take a LB-10X and shoot the clump of mechs

coming at you at about 500 meters.

You will hit at least 3/4s of them

meaning you will wind up with a lot of assists.

So assists aren't necessarily the team support role

with out the damage to back them up.

Edited by Willie Sauerland, 18 April 2013 - 12:58 PM.

[Belorion]

Basically there are issues with any stat. While they can be helpful they are woefully inadequate epeen measuring devices.

[Ralgas]

What is the op talking about anyway? yes overall kdr is on the front of the stats page, but kdr/wlr for individual mechs (which would be far more accurate for your favs than an overall) is only a tab click away

Edit: if op means to change elo metrics there is no "real" metric to use, w/l is probably the best to track based on

if your having a good run but being carried that wont last and you'll drop again as you hit the more skilled opponents

If your a good player on a losing streak you'll kick some *** when you drop a bracket and rise back again quickly

And it doesn't matter if you spent the game tagging, capping, or even if you don't participate (make it harder for the team to win, increasing the chances of losses and lowering you elo)

Edited by Ralgas, 18 April 2013 - 01:29 PM.

[Bloodstained]

Quote

Really? The hundreds of thousands of people playing BF3 STILL would tend to disagree with you. And the millions that played the previous BF series of games where stats like KDR were reviewable by the players.

Hi, thanks for the reply and the good point.

However you mentioned a game where there is re-spawning. If you wanted to make a better comparison it would be CS. Where each player has only 1 time in a match to prove himself. But in CS in all its simplicity on the objectives (kill all or defuse/protect the activated bomb) it’s a highly skill based game where 1 shot from an impossible angle may kill you. And sometimes I have been in CS where I was that last player in the game, putting the bomb and either by luck or by “skill” shots to make my team win. In MWO this one shot kill or luck doesn’t exist, it needs a team to kill someone fast but only the last person get this highly appreciated kill. So if some people are attacking one person (which is rare in pugs) is because they are hoping to do an alpha after the 60% or 50% and that will give them the kill.

Now, I know that I made a comparison with TF2 which also has re-spawning.. However whenever I was playing that game, it was obvious from the start of the game that you need to work as a team to not get steamrolled. Most of my games in TF2 I was starting in a team with NO coordination and teamwork and after 2-3 lost games my pug team were putting their act together and changing the outcomes of the games. Now in my book this is a ”GG”. Perhaps contributing factor is the in game voice coms and the fact that it has voice command hotkeys which alert team members. But as I said in my first post this game needs to gets examples from TF2, Valve imo has set the standards for team based FPS (another great example are the Left4Dead games), and games that copy what they are doing will only benefit.

In all games that I have played so far one thing is sure, teamwork is huge fun, having your friends in team and winning is amazing but having random people working as team and winning is awesome.

Edited by Bloodstained, 18 April 2013 - 01:38 PM.