119 replies to this topic

[Mister Blastman]

I don't think missiles will fix things because we still have the ECM problem.

Remember, you have to stand out in the open and remain exposed to use that TAG. High alpha teams will wipe the tagger out in seconds, no matter how big or small the mech is.

[Lucian Nostra]

Mister Blastman, on 20 April 2013 - 07:02 AM, said:

Exactly.

Mechwarrior 4 suffered from an acute lack of variety. At least, when I stopped playing it did. It was a chore to play because your only options were severely limited.

I'd hate for this game to stay in the state it is because the options are so grossly limited. It isn't fun to have to play a certain way all the time--at least, in a game like Mechwarrior which is all about customization. Deciding, "Oh, should I take 2, 3 or 4 PPCs" isn't customizing.

Mechwarrior Living Legends actually does a pretty good job with variety--however, even then I can't say if their balance has nailed it or not due to being unable to customize mechs. Still, lots of things work in it. It isn't perfect, though--but it is better balanced than what we have in MWO right now.

It makes it a whole lot easier to balance though when you can't tweek stuff. The Awesome isn't OP with it's 3 PPCs but when Stalkers start taking 4 5 or 6 something starts to give, but how do you go about fixing that? adding in some arbitrary heat penalty for boating PPCs? nerfing PPCs?

[MustrumRidcully]

Mister Blastman, on 20 April 2013 - 07:07 AM, said:

I don't think missiles will fix things because we still have the ECM problem.

Remember, you have to stand out in the open and remain exposed to use that TAG. High alpha teams will wipe the tagger out in seconds, no matter how big or small the mech is.

The beauty currently is - None of the mechs that are deemed problematic right now can use ECM.

Of course, if PGI ever, in its eternal wisdom, decides to create an energy heavy heavy or assault that carries ECM, we might be in trouble.

[Novakaine]

The solution is simple.
PPC's are fine.
Jump jets and PPC's are not.
Fix the Jumps Jets.
A 75 ton mech should be shaking like crazy to get it's big *** of the ground.
Ask any Saturn V rocket.

[Mister Blastman]

MustrumRidcully, on 20 April 2013 - 07:14 AM, said:

The beauty currently is - None of the mechs that are deemed problematic right now can use ECM.

Of course, if PGI ever, in its eternal wisdom, decides to create an energy heavy heavy or assault that carries ECM, we might be in trouble.

Well they can't use it but their teammates can. Those teammates are enough to block the missile field long enough requiring tag... which exposes people.

[Mystere]

Nainkonami, on 20 April 2013 - 03:05 AM, said:

But the onl counter to PPC boats are PPC boats.

Hold a second. This sounds eerily faimiliar. Where did I see that bef... oh yes! It was:

The only counter is ECM is ECM.

AnubiteGroove, on 20 April 2013 - 03:29 AM, said:

Gauss is 15 tons, two PPC with 25% more damage is 14 tons. Gauss takes ammo, PPC does not, thus more tons.

I think you're missing the part about PCCs needing a whole lot of heat sinks.

[MustrumRidcully]

Mister Blastman, on 20 April 2013 - 07:24 AM, said:

Well they can't use it but their teammates can. Those teammates are enough to block the missile field long enough requiring tag... which exposes people.

Sure, but every team mate not a Stalker or Poptarter is a plus for you. One of the strengths poptarters and snipers have is that if you have enough, it matters even less taht you can, personally not sustain your firepower. 3 alpha strikes from 3 different mechs get the job done, too.

[XFactor777]

Lucian Nostra, on 20 April 2013 - 07:07 AM, said:

It makes it a whole lot easier to balance though when you can't tweek stuff. The Awesome isn't OP with it's 3 PPCs but when Stalkers start taking 4 5 or 6 something starts to give, but how do you go about fixing that? adding in some arbitrary heat penalty for boating PPCs? nerfing PPCs?

I think they need to look at hardpoints first, for example currently a mech with 6 energy hardpoints (lookin at you stalker) can equip 6 energy weapons. now what if we changethat so you only get a certain # of crit spots with those hardpoints say 1.5 crits per hardpoint for weapons rounded up now if you have 2 energy in 1 spot you have 3 crit spaces 1 ppc or lg laser, and with 1 hardpoint you can still mount a lg laser or the like. this will get rid of the ppc boats except for the mechs that were designed that way in the first place like the awesome.

[WhupAzz]

I'm in second place on the 'HGN-733C' leaderboard and i can safely say i have never used PPC's on it so no OP just no.

[Fox News Channel]

Dammit! When will it be Machine Gun Warrior Online?!?!

Edited by Fox News Channel, 20 April 2013 - 07:58 AM.

[AllOuttaBubbleGum]

There's always going to be some type of weapon system in ascendancy. Right now is the ballistic/PPC era. Just hold on to the wild ride and adapt. My problems are usually not the weapons its match making, bugs, and big maps.

[Yokaiko]

Novakaine, on 20 April 2013 - 07:18 AM, said:

The solution is simple.
PPC's are fine.
Jump jets and PPC's are not.
Fix the Jumps Jets.
A 75 ton mech should be shaking like crazy to get it's big *** of the ground.
Ask any Saturn V rocket.

Mechs are vaulting into space oddly enough.

[Fox News Channel]

WhupAzz, on 20 April 2013 - 07:57 AM, said:

I'm in second place on the 'HGN-733C' leaderboard and i can safely say i have never used PPC's on it so no OP just no.

Maybe if you used them you would be in first. XD




Jk

[Owlfeathers]

I notice that you died while standing in a big open area with no cover. I mean, I know that always seems to be the best way to deal with snipers, but you might consider trying something else.

[Antagonist]

Not this topic again.

Ok.

Alright, LRMs are nigh useless unless you're being focused on by several boats.

That said, if you get hit by a PPC boat and are wide in the open or too stupid to get to cover, you deserve to die.

A 6PPC Stalker will have very little in close in weaponry, exploit it, don't go running at it full tilt in an Atlas.

If you're engaged with the rest of the hostile team and two of those babies come around flanking you doesn't mean PPC Stalkers are OP, it means you let yourself get suckered into a trap, then get flanked. That usually doesn't end well, neither in RL nor in MWO.

But hey, if you want to refuse to use your brains playing this game, I'm fine with that as long as you're part of my OPFOR. Makes grinding XP and Cbills a whole lot easier.

In other words: HTFU!

Edited by Antagonist, 20 April 2013 - 08:12 AM.

[Mafalin]

I'm also of the opinion that it's a L2P issue. If you try to beat poptarts at their own game without being equipped for it you lose. Solution: Don't play their game! Split your team and flank them from different directions all at once. You might get one before they've understood what's happened and in a brawl ppcs are subpar because they cause so much heat. DPS + heat efficiency becomes extremely important when there's always a new shot to be taken as soon as your weapon has recycled.

[HiplyRustic]

MustrumRidcully, on 20 April 2013 - 07:14 AM, said:

The beauty currently is - None of the mechs that are deemed problematic right now can use ECM.

Of course, if PGI ever, in its eternal wisdom, decides to create an energy heavy heavy or assault that carries ECM, we might be in trouble.

Really....you're serious? You don't see 2, 3, or 4 poptarting snipers protected under an ECM umbrella? You think they need it on their own mech before there's a problem? Really?

[MustrumRidcully]

HiplyRustic, on 20 April 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

Really....you're serious? You don't see 2, 3, or 4 poptarting snipers protected under an ECM umbrella? You think they need it on their own mech before there's a problem? Really?

Of course some are. But every ECM guy is automatically not a poptarter, and the less ECM guys there are, the easier it is to know where the enemy is and get into a flanking position without being surprised by some mechs standing far away. (Of course, you still have the problem that once you get close, you're dealing with most of the enemy team).

[MadSavage]

Client-side fire delay, halving the heat capacity and doubling dissipation, and (maybe) slower projectile speed (for some weapons) would go a long way to balancing ballistic weapons, especially PPCs.

- slower refire rate, higher damage and higher heat per shot would also help put PPCs back in line xD

Edited by MadSavage, 20 April 2013 - 08:31 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Mystere, on 20 April 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

Hold a second. This sounds eerily faimiliar. Where did I see that bef... oh yes! It was:

The only counter is ECM is ECM.

I think you're missing the part about PCCs needing a whole lot of heat sinks.

That was a dumb post (not yours, the guy you quoted). The only hard counter to ECM is ECM. End of story.

You can counter PPC's. It's not even just PPC's that are the problem.

It's the lack of dynamic maps. Crappy game modes. Jump Jets not causing any sort of shake. The missile nerf. And a hard point customization system that allows you to put the biggest weapons anywhere you want.

Edited by Nicholas Carlyle, 20 April 2013 - 08:37 AM.