82 replies to this topic

[Spawnsalot]

I'd love to see a (preferably large scale) TDM mode.

Yes, there most likely will be a spot of "Hunt-the-ECM-light-coward", but if you're tooled up in an ECM light and come into a TDM match with the intention to waste everyone's time then theres nothing stopping everyone else on the server from reporting you for greifing and quitting the match.

I might be mistaken but don't you still get your win/loss payout plus your match contribution payout when you quit a match?

[Wintersdark]

Spawnsalot, on 01 May 2013 - 03:59 AM, said:

I'd love to see a (preferably large scale) TDM mode.

Yes, there most likely will be a spot of "Hunt-the-ECM-light-coward", but if you're tooled up in an ECM light and come into a TDM match with the intention to waste everyone's time then theres nothing stopping everyone else on the server from reporting you for greifing and quitting the match.

I might be mistaken but don't you still get your win/loss payout plus your match contribution payout when you quit a match?

More than a spot of. When people can troll and grief others, people will troll and grief others. Are you new to the internet?

So, everyone else quits the match? Ok. 23 other people (we're going to 12v12 remember) have their match stalemated and ****ed up - this is worse than a match that just ends with a cap win early - and worse, all 23 people have their mech tied up for 15 minutes waiting for that timer to count down and actually end the match. That's why we have Assault instead of TDM: Because the Worst Case Scenario for Assault is much nicer than the Worst Case Scenario for TDM.


And, no, you can't opt out of game modes, you can only choose a specific one. So, if they added another game mode, a pure TDM:

1) They'd increase the exponential split on the playerbase.
2) They'd force people who don't want to deal with trolling lights to choose one of the other two game modes, further segmenting the player base.

Currently, most people just click LAUNCH. This essentially takes game mode out of the number of different player pools at matchmaking time, which is an exponential decrease. Forcing players to just choose one (of three!) would severely impact matchmaking.

[Ensaine]

I play mainly Assault, due to less of a chance the team will split up. Seems to me when I forget to change to Assault only, I get a Conquest match, and BOOM.... everyone shoots for different directions.. which would be fine IF everyone was in voice comms.......

[DrunkDrivin]

XM15, on 29 April 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

And I agree, there is not enough attention paid by the creators of this game in the forums. I also understand that there is a lot of crap being said. In reading this particular thread I notice it is mostly players looking for something more than what is currently offered. It is logical that players want more than what is currently being offered, especially if they are paying players like myself. For those that play for free and have no intention of putting up some funding, they just need to not post and not ask for anything.

You just made the founders look awesome. Let me educate you. You paid for a cool mech, mc, and other perks that I may not be aware of. You may have paid for vanity items, or premium time. Paying does not give you any more voice than a F2P. This type of attitude is what turns most people off of anything a "gold" says. Forums, or in matches.

[Tincan Nightmare]

To all those complaining about how a TDM would end in 'hunt the lone powered down light', just remember that BAP will probably become very common soon with the next patch and its ability to negate ECM within 150 meters. Powering down to be invisible might be much harder after that patch. Plus they could keep TDM for smaller maps like forest colony or river city so it would be much harder to hide. Honestly, I would just be happier with some mechanic that limited how soon you could cap in assault, say like a certain amount of the enemy must be destroyed first. If 2 enemy units circle opposite each other, they are probably not just going to say 'oh well' and give up because one sat on a spot of ground for longer than the other. Nor is a team that wiped out most of their opposition suddenly going to say 'damn it, we lost' because a lone mech survivor is sitting in their magical square when they still have enough combat power to wipe them out. Maybe they should make the base in assault an actual base that has sections that must be destroyed to win. Would make much more sense to lose to a lone survivor if he had just blown up all your supplies and repair bays and barracks then if he was keeping an oil rig like structure company.

[XM15]

DrunkDrivin, I paid to support this game. And though I do understand that it is free to play and you do not need to pay to win, paying players is what keeps the game up and running. If you are a paying player than good for you, if not, that is fine as well. But I believe, whether it matters or not, that the folks paying to keep this game going should have a louder voice than those that don't. You don't need to educate me, on what free-to -play means. I understand that very well. But this game does not survive without paying players. So you can keep your opinion of my post to yourself or disagree if you like, I don't really care. I could care less about your attempt to educate me. Free-to-Play is still money driven. And paying members should have more say than non paying players, even if it is only a few dollars.

Edited by XM15, 06 May 2013 - 05:32 PM.

[Atheus]

Niko Snow, on 10 May 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

If base caps disappeared, I'm fairly certain we'd be piled up with complaints of games extending all the way to the time limit being no fun because everyone has to chase a skittish Spider.

Hmm, I'm sure you could come up with a way to make it work without base caps, if you put your mind to it. There have been dozens of good suggestions in the forums already.

[Keifomofutu]

Niko Snow, on 10 May 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

If base caps disappeared, I'm fairly certain we'd be piled up with complaints of games extending all the way to the time limit being no fun because everyone has to chase a skittish Spider.

King of the Hill. Still a base to cap only you have to run towards the fight instead of away to cap it. Heck you could still call it assault if you wanted. A massed battle over a single point sounds like "assault" to me.

Edited by Keifomofutu, 10 May 2013 - 09:45 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Niko Snow, on 10 May 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

If base caps disappeared, I'm fairly certain we'd be piled up with complaints of games extending all the way to the time limit being no fun because everyone has to chase a skittish Spider.

You do realize that is really not what this is about?

Most people like objectives. The problem is the objectives in MW:O are not fun, and detract from gameplay.

And there has been a poor job of scaling them to fit with the larger maps as well, which is leading to this being a bigger issue than before.

The larger maps need their base cap timer's extended, and rewards on those maps need to be higher due to the time invested.

But here we are, 3 months or so after Alpine and something as simple as that hasn't happened.

[Marj]

Niko Snow, on 10 May 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

If base caps disappeared, I'm fairly certain we'd be piled up with complaints of games extending all the way to the time limit being no fun because everyone has to chase a skittish Spider.

Wasn't a problem in MW4 with hour long match timers and no respawn in league games (primarily NBT experience here). If it becomes a problem implement one of the many suggested solutions from previous TDM threads.

I haven't run a lot of 8 mans, but I've run enough in assault mode to see that defending the base works. Too well. Being able to sit on the base doesn't reauire any thought or tactics...you just sit there, wait for the enemy to get bored and do something stupid, then win. But winning a game by waiting for your opponent to do something dumb isn't fun, at least not for me. Winning by engaging your opponent and outplaying or being outplayed and learning from them is.

Capping is supposed to be a mechanic that allows one team to out play their opponent by outmanouvering them...but it doesn't actually work that way in MWO since many mechs simply aren't capable of having a fight with the enemy's main force and defending the base...you're forcing them to choose one or the other, especially on the large maps (which I love...more please ). In reality many people don't want to spend their time in your game standing around guarding a base. They want to fight. The base cap mechanic forces these players to do something they don't enjoy..or ignore it and play the way they enjoy. If the team also happens to have a couple of players that do enjoy defending (and they do so successfully and they don't cause a disadvantage by drawing needed firepower from the front line because the enemy's entire force decided to stick together) then there isn't a problem...but if there aren't any people who enjoy defending, or if they fail to defend, or if the front line ends up outnumbered and in a no-win situation, then the people that were having a good time with their big stompy robots suddenly see their fun cut short with no way for them to prevent it.

Unless of course they spend the next game standing on the base watching everyone else have a good time waiting for a fight that may never come. You are asking people playing a game for fun to play that game in a way they find boring or frustrating. Again, this isn't realistic.

So what is PGI going to do to correct this? Your current comms system is too slow for pugs to communicate effectively (it's not just slow, many players simply don't use chat even when they should). People don't know if all 8 mechs have been spotted or if one scout has slipped past until it's too late in a significant number of cases..enough to generate multiple complaint threads and many complaints in game. Expecting people to sit on base and not fire a shot all game 'just in case' a base capper (or two...or three...or a 4 man premade of 3L's...) comes by just isn't a good game mechanic. I REALLY hope you don't expect entire teams to sit on base all game defending.

You have lost customers because of this. Of course I have no idea how many, but plenty of people have commented about red friends lists...mine often is too. I never see 30 people online at once anymore. Not 20...occasionally I'll see 10. Most of the time I see 5 or less. I have 117 people in my friends list. Players are quitting MWO over this. Yes there are other issues too, and burnout, but no amount of bug fixing will bring people to a game they believe is fundamentally flawed...even if they're wrong.

I'll be the first to say PGI shouldn't go out of its way to appease the vocal minority, but I don't think this is a small problem. Every so often I take a light and go straight for the base just to see what happens. I've been seeing more defenders lately (lights/mediums near the cap), but I've also seen more complaints when I start capping. Does PGI keep records of in game chat? How often do you see "get off the cap" or similar? How often do you see "I'll defend the base" or similar?

I'd like to see a game mode where campling puts you at a disadvantage and moving to gain an advantage is a requirement. King of the hill with an exposed cap would achieve this. ANYTHING that allows a team to do more than "sit between the other team and the magic square" would be great.

If this isn't possible then at least fix the matchmaker to ensure teams have a loadout suitable for the game mode. If capping is possible then the team being capped has to have the tools required to stop that capper. This includes allowing for player stupidity, like the entire team rushing off to fight the enemy in a game about big stompy robots blowing each other up. Some of your players aren't tactical geniuses and you shouldn't expect them to be. Make sure the team has fast mediums or lights. Enough to have a chance of stopping the enemy. They'll still be screwed if those players suicide rush...but at least the team will have had a fair chance. Then make the cap timer long enough that those mechs can get back to the cap even if they chose to fight. Which is what they came for. In a game about big stompy robots blowing each other up.

[Vassago Rain]

XM15, on 29 April 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

And I agree, there is not enough attention paid by the creators of this game in the forums. I also understand that there is a lot of crap being said. In reading this particular thread I notice it is mostly players looking for something more than what is currently offered. It is logical that players want more than what is currently being offered, especially if they are paying players like myself. For those that play for free and have no intention of putting up some funding, they just need to not post and not ask for anything.

Contain your goldvision.

[Jabilo]

Homeless Bill, on 23 April 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

and if I play Assault, someone goes for the reach-around

*snigger*

Edited by Jabilo, 10 May 2013 - 02:35 PM.

[Sephlock]

I just want some way to punish bad teammates when I'm lance commander:

[Skunk Wolf]

Would be solved pretty quick by having an objective that needs to be destroyed in each base.

For conquest, it could be a chopper team flying in and rebuilding during re-cap (THEN the laser-field would show up), would make the map seem more alive. Then you could shoot them (The AI guys)! Basically, you blow the crap out of it until it's neutral, then roll in to the perimeter and the AI dudes build it again, to be blown up again by the opposing team.

You could tailor the sight lines at each base too.

It would stop the lights from just running around and capping, because most of them can't pack the firepower to drop it quickly.

You could probably even fiddle with it dynamically every match depending on ELO, tonnage, and zodiac (whatever they seem to be using).

Then again, these weird drill rigs are just placeholders, who knows what's coming.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

I play conquest to avoid 8-man poptarts camping base

[Plavis]

Only popturds and PPC snipers complain aboyt bascap, cose they dont get to do the I JUMP, I SHOOT, I WIN.

Yes latley a lot off assult games end up on base cap, but base cap is 1 of the wining condition.

Yes latley i myself and friends are using light weapon loadout in favor of speed, cose the best counter for PPC/POOPTURDS is capping

Sweet POPTURD TEARS.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Plavis, on 11 May 2013 - 07:04 AM, said:

Only popturds and PPC snipers complain aboyt bascap, cose they dont get to do the I JUMP, I SHOOT, I WIN.

Yes latley a lot off assult games end up on base cap, but base cap is 1 of the wining condition.

Yes latley i myself and friends are using light weapon loadout in favor of speed, cose the best counter for PPC/POOPTURDS is capping

Sweet POPTURD TEARS.

That's not true.

I was 4-manning last night. I was an LRM Centurion, Teammates were a PPC Stalker, DDC Atlas, and a Hunchie.

Our team rarely dropped with any poptarters (or never did, I honestly don't remember seeing any when we were fighting).

Every match the opposing team seemed to have someone trying to cap (two games in a row, we had the same 2man drop and try it).

Now we mopped the floor with them anyway, but it wasn't fun at all really. It was more of "Crap this is a hassle".

And one game I had to literally sacrifice my mech because doing damage doesn't stop the cap. I had to literally melee with my pair of medium lasers.

It's just stupid.

Edited by Nicholas Carlyle, 12 May 2013 - 05:48 AM.

[Keifomofutu]

Ring around the Rosie base defense is the most idiotic mechanic I've ever seen in a professional game.

It is the only change PGI ever made to Assault since beta. They put the oil thingy in there so that you can't actually defend your base without it.

[Denno]

We just need more matchmaking infrastructure like a lobby. Maybe then folks can easily find more 8 mans and setup gentlemans agreements and tournaments to suit differing play styles.

[MrTarget]

I play it to avoid PopTarts also my spider reigns supreme on there