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Hacking Accusations


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#21 TheSteelRhino

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Posted 16 May 2013 - 08:10 AM

This is a very interesting topic.

So, are macros hacking or cheating?

Here is one to think about....Hacking is not necessarily cheating. And cheating does not necessarily mean you are hacking.

For example: Macros that might ease the use of a particular piece of gaming hardware (or windows registry changes/hacks) would be a legitimate use case. Especially if someone were disabled in some way. Maybe they broke a finger, or got it caught in a blender...etc.

Macros or software packages that are used to circumvent or change game mechanics outside what is provided by PGI is cheating.

Breaking the games files, by altering or replacing them, in a way to change the game functionality (especially if it provides an advantage like "auto targeting") would be cheating. Unless it is a file that is editable per PGI like user.cfg.

I really don't think mouse macros are bad. (and I don't use them)
- this would be similar to a player with a regular 2 button mouse vs a player with a 15 button mouse, or a $200 joystick and flight control system.

-Although if it is used to circumvent jamming on the UAC5, then yes..that is cheating because you are circumventing a game mechanic. Since jamming issues have improved drammatically (at least for me) since the netcode improvement, I'm having a hard time coming up with a justification for it.

-somehow using a macro to "snap" to target meaning you have to just click the fire button instead of aim, are cheating.

Honestly, I wish PGI would post some sort "ethical gaming" standard.

Thanks.

Edited by Rhinehardt Ritter, 16 May 2013 - 08:13 AM.


#22 TheFlyingScotsman

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Posted 16 May 2013 - 08:44 AM

Hacking does not simply mean cheating or botting. Hacking is a very broad term for programming used to adjust or externally manipulate other software. Hacking can refer to anything from using third party macros to adjusting base code in your game files to give yourself any level of advantage not built into the software.

While I could care less about firing or command input macros, anything beyond that in any form from (now impossible.) map segregation to aiming programs is cheating through a hack. Even if your advantage is a slight UI or graphical adjustment, it is cheating. I don't care how mundane or utilitarian you think it is, if it gives you an advantage over the base client, it is cheating, and you are a lazy chump for doing it.

;)

Edited by TheFlyingScotsman, 16 May 2013 - 08:45 AM.


#23 ArmageddonKnight

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Posted 16 May 2013 - 09:28 AM

View PostFiona Marshe, on 09 May 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:


Games where two Atlai get headshot at 800m+ by snipers in the first two minutes... *thats* aimbot hacking. At that range the head is barely one pixel in size on most screens, so having it happen twice in 30 seconds by the same pilot is very damning evidence (and gets a report sent to Support email).


So som1 using a 42" screen where said atlas head is much more than a pixel smaller than the size of a needle point on a small 22" screen, and headshoting them is cheat ?
Now i dont use sniping mechs myself, but i can easily hit some of the 'harder' head shots becouse i do have a 42" screen, everything is bigger. But i paid £1000 for my Plasma TV when i got it.

Not trying to get into an argument here, but saying that som1 is cheating becouse they got a shot like that done, and attributing it to the asumption they are using a small screen and thus the point to aim and hit is so small and impossible to hit, is not sound, becouse people can and do use much larger screens.

As for the whole macro arugment.

AC2 macro has been talked to death about. the end result is ..its not a cheat ..its not a hack ..its not evne a shortcut, becouse it actually lower DPS, and make aiming harder due to dmg spread. its all for theatrics.

The UAC5 anti jam macro is simular, Even with a precisly timied macro to gain as much dps without jaming a possible, u still get MUCH more DPS without the macro when using the UAC5's double shot ability and thats whilst including jamming.

The User.cfg file has many grpahics options availabe that are not in the game options, u can tweek these urself and its perfectly legit, u can remove the distant blur so u can see things slightly more clearly, or disable other effects to speed up for FPS. These are all graphics options like in any other game, the only difference is, the game Developer hasnt bothered ot make a fancy in game UI to make it simpler for users to alter. So changing user.cfg options is NOT cheating. Any change that works in game, is legit, PGI can and have disabled the ones they dont want ppl messing with, like brightness (so u can see easier on night maps), However u can get around that by using 3rd party programs like SweetFX, which again although technicaly not cheating (becouse it doesnt alter game files) it can be frowned apon.

Are there hacks/cheats available ..porbably, i honestly havnt looked BUT, asuming som1 is cheating bassed on the limited information we have at our disposal is obsurd.

'cheating' is such a broad term nowerdays due to the ways in which it can be done, and thats only if som1 considers it cheating in the first place.
For example, my idea of cheating is anything that gives a SIGNIFICANT advantage directly. (small indirect, like the use of expensive hardware, graphcis tweeks, simple macro's etc, are fine)
By directly i mean.
Aimbot, it direclty increase ur hit rate.
Speeds hacks, Damage buffs, Invisible walls. All are direct and big advantages.
But i also consider the use of Broken game mechanics as cheating becouse its pritty much the same as altering somthing to be OP to then use and beat people.
So poptarts with High alphas ..broken...
Super speedy lights with silly weapon loadout ..broken,
Massive high alpha builds. .broken.
you cheat , u unbalance the game. u use somthing alreayd unalanced. .the result is the same.

Now i use 'old fashion' senses of pride,honor, and morality. so many gamers nowerdays will laugh at such things, but its doesnt mean im wrong, it means the gaming society has gone downhil since the days i used to enjoy. Just becouse the majority has an opinion on somthing over a minority, doesnt make the majority correct, history has shown us this.

Edited by ArmageddonKnight, 16 May 2013 - 09:42 AM.


#24 buttmonkey

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 04:40 AM

there are hackers out there for sure no matter how many times people say to me its just that your a bad loser it doesnt change the fact that there are a lot of aimbots.
if some one is hitting you again and again in the same part of your body when you cant even see the ****** hes so far away, then its a hack simple as. if you cant see him cos hes so far away then he cant see you either so how on earth is he able to hit the same spot? doesnt matter hhow good an aim you are you cant aim at something you cant see, but an aimbot can. thats the biggest give away that your up against an aimbot

and before you say wel he might have advanced zoom, that doesnt increase your visibilty range it only increases the zoom, making the target bigger, not clearer

#25 TitanAE

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 11:56 AM

there are just too many hackers in the game as compared to what makes for punk buster or something else but so it goes further nich you have to do something that makes no fun ( I LOVE THIS GAME )

Edited by TitanAE, 25 May 2013 - 06:11 PM.


#26 Drunk Canuck

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 03:02 PM

I guess I am a hacker because I got 6 kills in a match once by LRM boating in a Stalker. I call it luck when you manage to score the killing blow on an enemy. I have had a lot of kills sniped from me since I started playing this game, I am sure some people were cheesed off that they only got Kill Assists while I was just sniping with LRM's. I just don't let it bother me when someone manages to get a kill from my prey, but I will call hacker when I feel that someone is cheating the game, especially people who aim bot.

Edited by Drunk Canuck, 27 May 2013 - 03:03 PM.


#27 Hellen Wheels

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 03:28 PM

View PostRhinehardt Ritter, on 16 May 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

So, are macros hacking or cheating?


Neither. They're just crutches used by the lame.

Edited by Hellen Wheels, 27 May 2013 - 03:28 PM.


#28 White Bear 84

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 04:00 PM

Its ok OP, last night i felt your pain. I was piloting a 3M cicada with an ER PPC and 2 medlas.. ..i ended up getting 5 kills and 550 damage. Given the enemy team got totally stomped they pretty much complained about everything, it was embarrasing;
  • LRMS ARE OP AND BEING SPAMMED
  • EVERYONE IS JUST SNIPING WITH PPC
  • MY TEAM ARE ALL NOOBS
  • THE CICADA 3M IS HACKING...
Sounds like a bunch of lame excuses to me.

#29 BFett

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 04:08 PM

In all the time I've been playing MWO I have only been called a hacker once for head-shooting a guy with my dual AC20 Jaggermech. Needless to say he wouldn't listen to me when I said his head only had 18 points of armor on it.

#30 White Bear 84

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 04:44 PM

View PostBFett, on 27 May 2013 - 04:08 PM, said:

In all the time I've been playing MWO I have only been called a hacker once for head-shooting a guy with my dual AC20 Jaggermech. Needless to say he wouldn't listen to me when I said his head only had 18 points of armor on it.


You know i wonder if the devs could actually find a way to display damage from various weapons to components. If you can see how much damage has been done could greatly reduce hackuzations - especially the ones where you get a headshot and take out a total of 18 armor with 40 damage lol

#31 TB Azrael

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 06:03 PM

View PostFiona Marshe, on 09 May 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

......
Games where two Atlai get headshot at 800m+ by snipers in the first two minutes... *thats* aimbot hacking. At that range the head is barely one pixel in size on most screens, so having it happen twice in 30 seconds by the same pilot is very damning evidence (and gets a report sent to Support email).


Actually the aimbots I've heard about only target the CT. What you had there, more than likely, was the good ole chesseball modification of the view in the user.cfg. Elimating haze, trees, distortion and so on and increasing view - the sooner they lock that file out the better.

View PostBFett, on 27 May 2013 - 04:08 PM, said:

In all the time I've been playing MWO I have only been called a hacker once for head-shooting a guy with my dual AC20 Jaggermech. Needless to say he wouldn't listen to me when I said his head only had 18 points of armor on it.

Don't forget all the structure under that armor, but yea that was just a cheese-build kill anyway.

View Postbuttmonkey, on 20 May 2013 - 04:40 AM, said:

there are hackers out there for sure no matter how many times people say to me its just that your a bad loser it doesnt change the fact that there are a lot of aimbots.
if some one is hitting you again and again in the same part of your body when you cant even see the ****** hes so far away, then its a hack simple as. if you cant see him cos hes so far away then he cant see you either so how on earth is he able to hit the same spot? doesnt matter hhow good an aim you are you cant aim at something you cant see, but an aimbot can. thats the biggest give away that your up against an aimbot

and before you say wel he might have advanced zoom, that doesnt increase your visibilty range it only increases the zoom, making the target bigger, not clearer


Your field of view may not equal their field of view....

#32 TB Azrael

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 06:10 PM

View PostRhinehardt Ritter, on 16 May 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

...... Breaking the games files, by altering or replacing them, in a way to change the game functionality (especially if it provides an advantage like "auto targeting") would be cheating. Unless it is a file that is editable per PGI like user.cfg. ....

Might want to look at this, there are still some rules for working the user.cfg, but yea I agree with you more or less. I still find macros to be a form of cheat - maybe a low level cheese form but it goes more toward the ethics you speak of.

http://mwomercs.com/...wo-game-client/

#33 The Verge

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 10:15 PM

I'm sorry, but "hacking" being called out by the enemy or teamates is a joke. an inside joke saying, "he's on a hot streak."
or just bitching that they got killed in "30sec"

I guess It's 2011 Again

but either way, Macros are viable and allowed by PGI in their rules that EVERYONE on the forum agrees to.
just check it out in your game files.

just search for license.rtf in your drive that has the game installed if you don't want to search google.

#34 That Token Canadian Guy

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 05:07 PM

Well, look online MWO hacks in ur search engine and see what u find. More and more people are breaking the code threw 3rd party programs.MWO network is not secure if thats the case.
Last match I played, a Spider took over 400damage, that's interesting , I know this because it was the only mech i hit.I took all but one leg and his center torso, at that point he stopped taking damage, but it still accumulated the damage on my score.If that isnt a hack, then code is broken yet again. But doing the research shows there are hacks and people are using them.
I'm not complaining, just pointing out the facts. Since the game is still not completely launched. They have a chance to fix this issue(If they notice even) and will address it.To those who will just say people are complaining because they suck, then you havent bothered actually looking into things and just troll,but,at the same time too many people scream hack on a player for being a good shot.Even with the aim hack , it is still up to you to be a better pilot and move under cover.Give the guys a chance to find a better way to keep 3rd party programs out and report an ACTUAL hack if seen.Sometimes it may be a glitch, take that into consideration.

#35 Skadi

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 06:07 PM

If you headshot about ANY catapult in a pug match because they were too stupid to move you will generaly be called a hacker, ive personaly gotten used to it.

#36 Spirit of the Wolf

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 08:01 PM

View PostSkadi, on 26 June 2013 - 06:07 PM, said:

If you headshot about ANY catapult in a pug match because they were too stupid to move you will generaly be called a hacker, ive personaly gotten used to it.


Only if they're a new player.
The more experienced ones know that the head hitbox on a catapult is the size of a planet.

#37 B0oN

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 08:36 PM

Found one !Posted Image
Oh wait, what ... ?

#38 Borengar629

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 03:11 AM

It is all not that plain obvious as most players think. Yeah when you come around a corner and thers an AC/40 JM DD blowing you away with two good shots most peoply immidiatly call him aimbot user, cheater and stuff like that. But that doesn't nesseceraly have to be the truth.
You simply got good games and bad games for the most part. A raven taht deals 500 DMG and got 5 kills? No big deal. You circle assaults and hit them without properly aming for specific parts. That way they will eat tons of damage and you will get a high score. And if your team mates support you but you get the last shot you get 5 kills. There is no mystery or hack involved there.
Just yesterday we had a game in which not one of us dit more than 230 DMG but we won 8:0. We simply had a really good run with headshots and XL-carring opponents there. In other games we lose and all of us has about 500 DMG.
The numbers are pretty complex if you think these thoughts through. Winning with a lot of damage doesn't make you a hacker... it pretty much makes you a really bad shot and nothing else. And you having most of the kills in a group that coorporates like they should just makes you more lucky than your team mates.

#39 B0oN

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 05:40 AM

Waiiit, outdancing badly manouvering enemies, opening up their rearsides and generally taking any shot I could doesnt make me a hacker anymore ?
Damn^^

Plus adding the fact that the other survivor was doing nothing for most of the time being afk at base and only started to move and fight in the last two or three minutes of the presented match while I was heartily racing through the furball of this match counts for naught and hence earns your dismissal as luck ?

I barely survived only due to my teammates and my own hard work, thus :

I would really love to fight some Zellbriggen duels with you :P

Edited by Rad Hanzo, 27 June 2013 - 05:42 AM.


#40 Chavette

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 06:02 AM

Get it right, Hacking+Accusations=Haccusations.



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