85 replies to this topic

[VXJaeger]

Last night I shot a Dragon 3 times straight into belly w/ dual-AC20, and didn't even lost it's armor. In another occasion I shot a Commando, and to my view I missed complitely shells flying past front of the mech, and still it died.
Also there was several occations when I shot sideways moving mechs w/ dual-Gauss...sparks flew nicely like there was a hit, but in paperdoll flashing but no damage.

Seems like lazors are only really reliable weapons now.

[Amberite]

VXJaeger, on 19 May 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:

Seems like lazors are only really reliable weapons now.

I'm afraid even lasers have their issues. Noted a few times now that dmg isn't registering correctly.

Example: 6 LL Stalker firing on Spider. Spider...stationary at ~340m (inside max dmg range). My stalker is stationary to ensure no strafe across target.

Center reticule on target (CT of spider) and fire. 54 dmg alphastrike in theory. In practice it only took his CT armour down to deep red. Max torso armour on CT of spider (even with everything pumped into front torso) is 40. Most spiders run with 28 or so. It should have melted a hole through him.

All beams converged properly (I had lots of time to makes sure the shot was lined up) and the hits registered on reticule. It was approx 2-3 seconds before he started moving as well, so I can be certain he was:
1: Not a DC or bugged out.
2: Not moving at all at the time of the shot.

[Kitane]

Amberite, on 20 May 2013 - 12:13 AM, said:

I'm afraid even lasers have their issues. Noted a few times now that dmg isn't registering correctly.

Example: 6 LL Stalker firing on Spider. Spider...stationary at ~340m (inside max dmg range). My stalker is stationary to ensure no strafe across target.

Center reticule on target (CT of spider) and fire. 54 dmg alphastrike in theory. In practice it only took his CT armour down to deep red. Max torso armour on CT of spider (even with everything pumped into front torso) is 40. Most spiders run with 28 or so. It should have melted a hole through him.

All beams converged properly (I had lots of time to makes sure the shot was lined up) and the hits registered on reticule. It was approx 2-3 seconds before he started moving as well, so I can be certain he was:
1: Not a DC or bugged out.
2: Not moving at all at the time of the shot.

28 armor or so would leave his CT at 48 HP total and your alpha was 54. Even a tiny amount of damage hitting LT/RT would allow him to survive. And maybe he did pump more armor to the front (to deal with Streak hax missiles)

Maybe some of your damage did not register. But it's not impossible for Spider to survive that.

[twibs]

What baffles me is why the f*** doesn't the OP use the R to target. Is he just a noob? In that case his point is invalid.

[Thoummim]

Your video prove only one thing : you have a terrible aim, come on you dont even try to lead the target.

I was an AC/gauss fanatic way before HSR and I used ppc from time to time, the situation is way way better there is no argue about that, there is still some strange stuff but 95% of the time when I hit the crosshair turn red.

Edited by Thoummim, 20 May 2013 - 04:04 AM.

[Amberite]

Kitane, on 20 May 2013 - 01:41 AM, said:

28 armor or so would leave his CT at 48 HP total and your alpha was 54. Even a tiny amount of damage hitting LT/RT would allow him to survive. And maybe he did pump more armor to the front (to deal with Streak hax missiles)

Maybe some of your damage did not register. But it's not impossible for Spider to survive that.

What is impossible is for the CT to not be damaged internally. All shots hit CT, no dmg done to other areas yet he still had armour left in that location. I wasn't intending to indicate he should be dead, merely that it should have melted through his armour, no matter how much he managed to stack on it.

Edited by Amberite, 20 May 2013 - 06:14 AM.

[Caballo]

Thoummim, on 20 May 2013 - 04:02 AM, said:

Your video prove only one thing : you have a terrible aim, come on you dont even try to lead the target.

I was an AC/gauss fanatic way before HSR and I used ppc from time to time, the situation is way way better there is no argue about that, there is still some strange stuff but 95% of the time when I hit the crosshair turn red.

Ever noticed your crosshair turned red, but the enemy didn't got any damage?

Look upper-right more often. You'll get surprised by how many impacts are not registered.

If we had our private matches, this issues would've been tested A LOT by ourselves.

Edited by Caballo, 20 May 2013 - 07:28 AM.

[Lynx7725]

Just tossing my video in to see if it helps PGI narrow things down.



Annotated where I think my hits weren't registering.

My ping is usually around 250 or so.

Edited by Lynx7725, 20 May 2013 - 11:35 AM.

[jay35]

I've seen a lot of wrong side torso hits for weeks now, where I clearly shoot and impact one side torso but the opposite side torso receives the damage. I always chalked it up to some sort of bug but perhaps it's actually related to this netcode issue after all.

[John MatriX82]

jay35, on 20 May 2013 - 11:57 AM, said:

I've seen a lot of wrong side torso hits for weeks now, where I clearly shoot and impact one side torso but the opposite side torso receives the damage. I always chalked it up to some sort of bug but perhaps it's actually related to this netcode issue after all.

That's probably because the server rolled back your shot some milliseconds earlier than where you finally tried to aim (and shoot).. maybe 200ms before you were aiming at the other side torso, then what happened in those 200ms wasn't accounted by the server.

[MavRCK]

John MatriX82, on 20 May 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

That's probably because the server rolled back your shot some milliseconds earlier than where you finally tried to aim (and shoot).. maybe 200ms before you were aiming at the other side torso, then what happened in those 200ms wasn't accounted by the server.

THAT'S A PROBLEM!!!

[Garagano]

MWO is NOT a competitive game where milliseconds and pinpoint accuracy decide over a win or loose.
MWO is just a casual player FUN GAME!
deal with it!

[karoushi]

Garagano, on 20 May 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

MWO is NOT a competitive game where milliseconds and pinpoint accuracy decide over a win or loose.
MWO is just a casual player FUN GAME!
deal with it!

Or it is Suppose to be, anyway...

Targeting demographics has adverse affects, unless of course your demographic is everyone ~ which is actually the exact thing people will spout: "you can't please everyone"; But that isn't the intention you do the best you can do to facilitate their 'wallet' which means also, surprise surprise, facilitating their enjoyment.

If you are going to be in the entertainment industry people have to enjoy what you are doing, well, unless you don't mind following EA's example. Voted worst company in the world couple times now (there are much worse companies) but they still have people buying their products.

That tends to make people think that it is okay to treat your customers like dirt when tried and true successful business practice that built entire corporate empires say otherwise.
And don't try to suggest EA shows otherwise because they didn't get where they are at now by treating their customers bad they only started doing that recently, among the others things such as buying other peoples successful ideas and reproducing them quantitatively while lowering quality just to make money off of them.

People tend to despise such despicable acts and won't forgive and forget, ever.
The best hope businesses like these have are waiting for the next generation of brainless people who they haven't screwed over yet, leaving disgruntled generation after disgruntled generation; Tired of being screwed over for money.

Edited by karoushi, 20 May 2013 - 12:36 PM.

[Chavette]

I think we have enuff video and confirmation to figure its not our fault, and they should do something about it. I'll see what happens next patch and if it isn't fixed(not counting on it) I'll ask the mods to move this to the new patch feedback section as the problem didn't go away, if not, I'll just forward it to support and other similar annoying things.

[NinetyProof]

Watched the video, and regardless, you were almost never "leading" the target by the amount you would need to actually score most of the hits. A lot of your shots should have hit "behind" the player and been clear misses.

I do a lot of PPC's and if a target is running from left to right, you need to be slightly ahead of them on the right. You were not doing that for almost any shots, and ergo, would be prone to miss, regardless of the "cross hair colors".

You need to learn to *lead* the target, even if that means just aiming at the left half of a left moving target (ie: the *leading half*) ... or the right half of a right moving target (ie: the *leading half*).

[Deathlike]

NinetyProof, on 20 May 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

Watched the video, and regardless, you were almost never "leading" the target by the amount you would need to actually score most of the hits. A lot of your shots should have hit "behind" the player and been clear misses.

I do a lot of PPC's and if a target is running from left to right, you need to be slightly ahead of them on the right. You were not doing that for almost any shots, and ergo, would be prone to miss, regardless of the "cross hair colors".

You need to learn to *lead* the target, even if that means just aiming at the left half of a left moving target (ie: the *leading half*) ... or the right half of a right moving target (ie: the *leading half*).

I wonder if convergence is being applied here (to HSR)... because quick movements often lead to misplaced shots, which is indirectly allowing this behavior to occur.

Edited by Deathlike, 20 May 2013 - 03:31 PM.

[aniviron]

Garagano, on 20 May 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

MWO is NOT a competitive game where milliseconds and pinpoint accuracy decide over a win or loose.
MWO is just a casual player FUN GAME!
deal with it!

If they didn't want people to try and compete to win, they shouldn't have made an exclusively-multiplayer game where the only challenge comes from facing your opponents in combat.

[Lynx7725]

NinetyProof, on 20 May 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

Watched the video, and regardless, you were almost never "leading" the target by the amount you would need to actually score most of the hits. A lot of your shots should have hit "behind" the player and been clear misses.

I do a lot of PPC's and if a target is running from left to right, you need to be slightly ahead of them on the right. You were not doing that for almost any shots, and ergo, would be prone to miss, regardless of the "cross hair colors".

You need to learn to *lead* the target, even if that means just aiming at the left half of a left moving target (ie: the *leading half*) ... or the right half of a right moving target (ie: the *leading half*).

.... *facepalm*

Dude, you might be 100% right that I am not leading the target sufficiently, but that's not the point. The point is that if I'm not giving sufficient lead and missing the target, the visual feedback in game (i.e., big badaboom sound and light on the target mech) should not be showing up and telling me I hit. That way I will know that I am not leading enough and adjust accordingly.

Can't learn how much to lead if the feedback system is telling you the wrong story with half your information feed. The whole thing have to be consistent -- visual effects, crosshairs, paperdoll.

Put more accurately, the hit registration and hit animation triggering is out of sync with each other, thus giving the wrong feedback to the end user.

[Aleric]

This happens all the time on my Cata with PPC shots. I can normally lead well but I also just by the contacted hits at long range since the reticle obscures the target 50% of the time. On my Atlas with AC/20 if they are close in and I unload on them more than half the time my shot is not hitting and this is with the enemy mech right in my face walking backwards.

[Foster Bondroff]

Didn't go to all 4 pages. Just watched the two videos on the 1st page of this thread.

What i find great about those videos is that they show two things. First that boating PPCs is not very effective and that proper aiming is one of the core skills to learn for this game.

Since the ballistic HSR my hit registration (ping ~ 120ms) with PPC has gone way up and the number of times where a visual hit is not registered properly (red blinking crosshair) is neglible.

The only issue i sometimes noticed is that a registered PPC hit to internals seem not to do the full damage.