507 replies to this topic

[Kmieciu]

AMS has 200 meter range. LRM speed is 120 meters/second. That means AMS has 1.67 seconds to shoot the incoming missiles.
AMS has 3.5 DPS while one LRM has 1 HP. 1.67*3.5/1 = 5.8.
Your AMS will shoot down 5 missiles. And the enemy LRM boats usually fire 45-100 missiles.

Edited by Kmieciu, 22 May 2013 - 02:19 PM.

[I Chaya]

Adrian Steel, on 22 May 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

Yes. We all want the game to get good, so don't forget to buy more MC while you're testing it for PGI.

QFT

pseudocoder, on 22 May 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

It's a beta. That means you can expect balance design decisions are made in design meetings, implemented, tested for TECHNICAL soundness (i.e., are they working as designed?), and released. If you don't like being a guinea pig then wait for final release of the game. I'm sure PGI will go to a much, much slower, more deliberate patch schedule at that time.

A Beta Test, a computer product prior to commercial release, is the last stage of testing, and normally can involve sending the product to beta test sites outside the company for real-world exposure or offering the product for a free trial download. (I grant you that, now-a-days, titles need funding because there is a greater risk aversion.

A beta version represents the first version that implements all features in the initial requirements. It is likely to be useful for internal demonstrations and previews to select customers, but unstable and not yet ready for release. Some developers refer to this stage as a preview, as a technical preview (TP) or as an early access.

As the second major stage in the release lifecycle, following the alpha stage, this stage often begins when the developers announce a feature freeze on the product, indicating that no more feature requirements (this would include the flight path change) will be accepted for this version of the product. Only software issues, or bugs and unimplemented features will be addressed.

Beta versions are an intermediate step in the development cycle. Developers release closed beta or open beta; closed versions are released to a select group of individuals for a user test, while open betas are to a larger community group, usually the general public. The testers report any bugs that they found and sometimes minor features they would like to see in the final version.

pseudocoder, on 22 May 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

As far as delaying the patch since fix A's balance is dependent on fix B and fix B isn't ready yet, that would cause way more problems than it solves. Let's just push patch day to Wednesday when we feel like it, how does that sound? How about Friday? Might as well, go to next week now, right? Nope. You can't delay the entire team and screw up everyone's scheduling because a feature didn't make it.

Incorrect. If done infrequently, to ensure the quality of the patch, it is acceptable. Done on a regular basis is not acceptable and shows a lack of time management.

pseudocoder, on 22 May 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

It's still a beta. It has a meaning, it means the game is not done and they INTEND to break it to test limits before the game is released. It's a beta. Also, what's your point? Edit: TLDR; It's a beta.

BETA does not mean that they INTEND to break it. It means they INTEND to fix it. The breaking occurs in the ALPHA phase.

[Karenai]

Do people even read the first dev post? LRM are bugged right now. That is a fact.

Kmieciu, on 22 May 2013 - 02:19 PM, said:

AMS has 200 meter range. LRM speed is 120 meters/second. That means AMS has 1.67 seconds to shoot the incoming missiles.
AMS has 3.5 DPS while one LRM has 1 HP. 1.67*3.5/1 = 5.8.
Your AMS will shoot down 5 missiles. And the enemy LRM boats usually fire 45-100 missiles.

Show me one LRM boat which shoots 100 missiles. More then one LRM boat? Ok, more then one mech with AMS...
Most LRM boats do not shoot their load in one big salvo.
LRM are bugged, but guys, put some AMS on your mechs. For real, put AMS on your builds. Had only one game tonight where almost all enemy mechs had AMS. I had a single LRM 20 on my mech and all my missiles exploded midair, not even one landed on target. With a true boat I would be able to punch trough, but it would be way less severe then what is happening now. People complain about the broken LRM, do not read dev posts and still spend more time on the forums complaining about it, then it would take to put 1.5t on their mech.
It is like complaining about shotguns beeing too powerfull but refusing to wear flak jacket. Sure, if they hit you in the head you die anyway, but let us make it even more easy for them to kill us. Let us not use the only soft counter there is against LRM, but still complain about it.

Edited by Karenai, 22 May 2013 - 02:48 PM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

aniviron, on 21 May 2013 - 06:20 PM, said:

Needs more than just a trajectory change.

I really hate this video. If any of you took a mech onto the training grounds with 3 LRM 15's or larger. Every mech except the Atlas dies in 2-3 volley's. The atlas takes 5-6.

It's not indicative of anything. It reminds me of political fear mongering.

Karenai, on 22 May 2013 - 02:43 PM, said:

Do people even read the first dev post? LRM are bugged right now. That is a fact.


Show me one LRM boat which shoots 100 missiles. More then one LRM boat? Ok, more then one mech with AMS...
Most LRM boats do not shoot their load in one big salvo.
LRM are bugged, but guys, put some AMS on your mechs. For real, put AMS on your builds. Had only one game tonight where almost all enemy mechs had AMS. I had a single LRM 20 on my mech and all my missiles exploded midair, not even one landed on target. With a true boat I would be able to punch trough, but it would be way less severe then what is happening now. People complain about the broken LRM, do not read dev posts and still spend more time on the forums complaining about it, then it would take to put 1.5t on their mech.
It is like complaining about shotguns beeing too powerfull but refusing to wear flak jacket. Sure, if they hit you in the head you die anyway, but let us make it even more easy for them to kill us. Let us not use the only soft counter there is against LRM, but still complain about it.

PS. LRM users for the last two months.

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=a0qwntteukc

This is exactly right I stripped a heatsink and .5 tons from my legs to add AMS. Guess who wins when my mech with LRM's goes against the LRM mech without AMS?

[PaidtoKill]

I agree the damage + the arc is OP if they would have just done the Arc we would be Peachy Takes care of some of the Poptart problems <<< that's the Bright side.. However i made a wrong turn in my Cent -9A ... Now loaded back up with streaks and bap ... and I barely got a warning before Smash ..... By no means am i QQ ing i was in wrong Place but it was a little overwhelming

[Kraven Kor]

Yeah, pretty much none of the mechs in testing grounds have max armor. Not really a great test.

Centurion, Jaggermech, and Cataphract - for me - took many LRM's and generally didn't die unless they caught me in the open, in which case, well, that's my own stupid fault.

[shintakie]

So you knew splash damage was still borked yet increased the damage of missiles anyway.

Couldn't you have like...delayed the patch a day or two to get it in? If that wasn't viable, couldn't you have held the damage buff back until you could get the splash damage fix in so as to not bork everythin or is that just crazy talk.

[Pericles]

LRM's seem to bee hitting mainly the front CT...From an angle. I even moved to the rear of the targets and was still hitting the front CT. As it stands if I can hit with 4 volleys or LRM 10x2 I can take out most mech CT's

[TheCaptainJZ]

Right now, I am traveling at 100 kph and using cover when I see LRMs approaching but there is no escape. As soon as the enemy launches them, they are almost certain to all hit you. I think they fly too fast. Slow them down a tad--like in between where they were and where they are now. Also, they should spread out more the farther they fly. I like the new flight path, but it's too fast and precise. There is simply no escape right now without the issue of enemy spotters.

[Wintersdark]

I'm fine with everything but the (known broken) splash issue. The reality is that you get centerpunched in very short order under any amount of LRM fire.

The interesting thing is, however, they don't do unreasonable damage. I stuffed a Stalker full of LRM's to try it out, and indeed: Low but reasonable damage done numbers, but lots of kills. Thus, once the splash damage centerpunching mechs issue is resolved, they should be fine.

With that said, I'm really not enjoying playing right now. There's so very many LRM's, it's like the weekend of the LRMpocalypse. Not nearly as bad, as nobody is getting 1k+ damage with LRM's, but they're still killing very quickly. It's frustrating that you can't afford to weather a few LRM salvos for fear of having your CT armor stripped early in the match, no matter how much you wriggle.

And, with LRM's being so good, there's LOTS of them out there; even more because they've been really weak for a long time. Regardless of why there are so many, there are. It's kind of a "Perfect Storm" problem... If the missiles didn't have the steep trajectory, it wouldn't be so bad. If the missiles didn't focus damage on the center torso, it would be fine. If there weren't zounds of LRM mechs, it would be fine. But with the combination of all three, it's crazy out there.

[Oy of MidWorld]

There really needs to be a hotfix asap. Two weeks of this is going to leave new players with a terrible impression.

[Dude42]

Oy of MidWorld, on 22 May 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

There really needs to be a hotfix asap. Two weeks of this is going to leave new players with a terrible impression.

Yea they won't even know what a poptart even is.

[Scarcer]

Thankyou for the changes, LRMS are looking a lot nicer now; and they reach behind objects quite nicely, a little too nicely though.

I also like how useful AMS is right now. They really start to shine when 3+ teammates have them mounted; creating a virtual safe haven.

[FuzzyLog1c]

Am I the only person that thinks it's HEEELARIOUS that they had time to make these graphics to depict their mistake:





And not just fix the effing mistake?

[pesco]

I love how your paranoid patch schedule still doesn't help with the screw-ups.

[Thunder Child]

After playing SniperWarrior Online since the LRM nerf, I'm glad to see that LRMs finally get a buff. However, as a long time LRM user, even while they were nerfed, I have to agree with Pauls post. The end of flight trajectory is a tad too steep. Yes, they function like a real world Missile would, but this IS a game, and compromises must be made. I believe the speed and damage buffs are about right, as is "most" of the new trajectory. But for the love of Holy Atlases (Atlasai?, Atlas'?), please, please REMOVE Splash damage entirely from LRMs. Problem solved. Sure, the fluff says they are a High Explosive Warhead and should explode with splash damage. But so far, the only thing splash damage has done is completely messed with numbers. Buff LRMs to 1 damage per missile, remove Splash. Then, we can still fling missiles around, and the poptarts can still use their pinpoint accurate 40pt Alphas (an arguement for another day).

[GargoyleVine]

I tried last night to press up against a rather tall building and still could not away from them dang missiles! The only thing that worked barely was waiting till they arc'd downward waiting till the last seconds then used jump jets to jump over them, then the next batch came and blew the s**t out of me

[Fabe]

FuzzyLog1c, on 22 May 2013 - 04:19 PM, said:

Am I the only person that thinks it's HEEELARIOUS that they had time to make these graphics to depict their mistake:





And not just fix the effing mistake?

No, what I find "HEEELARIOUS" is that you believe that they can't have one person explain the problem to the community while other people fix the problem.

[Honk the Wondergoose]

If the missile speed was changed to 110 and the damage to 0.8, i would be a happy camper. Its hard to enjoy the new map when my CT is being crushed by a constant rain of missiles that can get me even when I'm hugging vertical cover. And that is in my CN9-A!

[Wintersdark]

Honk the Wondergoose, on 22 May 2013 - 04:49 PM, said:

If the missile speed was changed to 110 and the damage to 0.8, i would be a happy camper. Its hard to enjoy the new map when my CT is being crushed by a constant rain of missiles that can get me even when I'm hugging vertical cover. And that is in my CN9-A!

So, you even note the real problem, and yet recommend changing damage and speed - neither of which are actually problems?

LRM's don't do a whole lot of damage now, the problem is simple (and known by PGI, re: Paul's CC post) - They fly high, then arc downwards very steeply making cover extremely difficult to use, and when they do hit the known Splash Damage Bug results in them doing damage primarily to the center torso.