325 replies to this topic

[Voidcrafter]

IamSalvation, on 23 May 2013 - 06:17 AM, said:

~Stuff~

Well I disagree with you and I think anyone who has brain and like competitive play should too.
My personal point of view is like follows:
I just don't care who I drop against.
Weither would it be a 2/3/4 man, or would it be two of them, or would it be completely random people.
I. Do. Not. Give. A. Damn.
And by that - I mean that I always tend to give 100% of what I can.
I don't demotivate when I see organized team on the other side - quite much the countrary - I'm even more motivated to do the best I can to win the game.
I always(well... when I'm not too tired from work anyways ) try to report contacts, positions, etc. etc. etc. even if I know that no one is giving me signs that listens.
Why the hell should one expect the game to be soften up on him?
What when there're not premades?
You have an easy win? You're feeling skilled? Justified? You're feeling that this is a fair game?

Bulls I tell you - no matter what you drop against you MUST give a 100% of what you can do. And you must be a teamplayer. And you should report, and, and, and...
That's the only issue when you drop against coordinated team - yours is not doing that.

I play both solo and with (a) friend(s) I think currently I have about 2.5 k/d - which in reallity should be alot higher due the fact I like to test builds let we say often which I think is quite alright, since I don't play like a sissie and I have nothing against dieing if it contribute to the team and about 1.2 win ratio - so you can say that I partially know how you feel.

I remember a game though - I dropped against some Steiner premade guys with terrible(in my understandings) attitude - the game started with the line:
"some-site-dot-com -> Premade. PUG stomping since closed beta!"
After I killed the third mech from those guys drop group I couldn't help myself to ask:
"So PUG stomping din't went all that well, did it unknown fella?"
Of course I got some rude attitude and emtpy words, but I didn't cared already - too bad my game crashed to desktop then, but I can tell how it ended anyways with 5 of them dead and only me DCed.

Anyways to my point -
Being in a group with people shoudln't make you act like you're better than the others.
and you can add another one:
Being better than the others shouldn't make you act like a complete douche.

And you shouldn't be on any of those two sides, cause honestly, I can't really tell on which side are you - no offense
And about the cheesy builds - I dislike them so much, that three times those words in my post won't be enough to even begin to describe it, but I feel like I've wasted too much of your time already -
'Tis not their fault that currently this is how the game works, tho this is the real cheating for me.
I've never piloted this sort of build cause I simply feel if I start doing that the game would lose it's charm for me.
You drop against that kind of teams just cause you got high ELO(probably...) - currently high ELO doesn't necessary means that you'll get against better pilots - it means mostly that you'll get matched agaisnt what currently works the most.

I haven't played a game against less than 2 poptarts since...
I can't really tell
I was dropping against cata 3D-s even before ballistics state rewind - I wanna channel my rage, of course, but I know very well, that no matter the target I chose for it I would be that much half wrong as much as half right about it.
As I dropped against all sort of house-premades, PGIs, people with terrible attitude, etc. etc. - but I don't expect the game to have any mercy on me and I always expect the worse from any single game.
I think those things are actually working in my favour and are making me as cold-blooded as I am.
You could've just dropped a word of advice to all the players that are PUG-ing in the game to be more coordinate and actually read what's in the chat, and mourn the abscence of any build-in voice chat.
Because behind all your words that's the only thing I managed to read.

Edited by Voidcrafter, 25 May 2013 - 10:39 PM.

[X1Viper]

4-mans are cheaters?? LOL. **** off troll. I drink your pitiful tears of newb rage.

[Agent CraZy DiP]

Had to stop reading after the Q.Q

[SuperJoe]

should get mad at the devs for implimenting such awful match making, not the group of friends or whatever that want to play with each other.

[Hot Rod]

I don't know if ELO is doing his job.
I don't know if the MM is filing the ranks with lower ELO players.
I don't know if i get matched up regularly against groups.
I don't know if i am just terrible bad in 6 of 10 games,
I don't know my ELO and i don't see the ELO rating of others to compare.
I don't know if i am in a game with a group because its not pointed out at the beginning.

What i know is:
- I drop 99% of the time as solo player.
- I have a W/L of [color=#EEEEEE]435 / 461[/color]
- I have a K/D of [color=#EEEEEE]697 / 446[/color]
- My games are ALWAYS starting with a full 8 man Enemy Team and then starting to fill up my team (consisting of 2+ players at this time) to hopefully get 8 man together. ( I usually end up in 7 vs 8 or 6 vs 8 games with me being at the short end of the stick.)
- After about nearly 900 games i can see if there's a group (4man) that beat the hell out of my teammates.
- After about nearly 900 games i can see if my team has decent players and is using a strategy.
- If a team has a premade and the other not, its a huge advantage for the premade because likely they wont face tactics.

- Out of 20 games, i clearly face (or have) a premade in 5 games, get 5 unbalanced games (1 or more fewer players, or disconnects or simply afk), around 2 games where 1 or more players of my team decides to get killed in the first 1 or 2 minutes into the match. 1 game where we annihilate the enemy in like no time, its the type of games where i know that theres a group on my side and the other has none. The rest are normal matches.

The ones who say its a teambased game i agree, but they should not forget that everbody has started at some point and not everybody has the time to organize a team (i don't talk about a "pickup 4 man group" for 1 night).

For the game to get new players its necessary to separate them from groups first and "let them choose" if they want to be a filler for 3 or 7 man groups or not.

"But , but we dont have enough players to fill up the 4 man only bracket!" Yeah whom failure is that? Def. not the new players fault. You drove them away first and now you need them to overcome your selfishly created problem?

They should create a 4 man bracket, drop the weight-balance for the 4 man bracket (like they did for the 8 man) and put two 4 man groups against each other or 2 4 man against an 8 man.

They should make a lone wolf bracket, the "i pug only" bracket for all the players out there that don't wish nor enjoy the presence of syncdrops/4man fotm setups that by themself enjoy beeing put up against a team that obviously has no chance to win.

"But you said you only face or play with groups 7 out of 20 games!" Right, but thats only me, for every 4 man group that starts a game there are 12 others who are in the same game with them. Chances are high that will be 12 pugs.

If i would play games without the presence of an organized group i would have only 6 out of 20 games that are "meh" because of player imbalance. That's what i would call an improvement!

Edited by Hot Rod, 26 May 2013 - 04:12 AM.

[Voidcrafter]

Hot Rod, on 26 May 2013 - 04:04 AM, said:

~Long not bad argumented stuff~

Well... I've made 2265 games till this moment(or at least since there is a counter at all ) and I'm still having troubles telling if a team have 4-man in it(except those, dropping with the same clan/faction mark).
After all those games I'm still having troubles reading if someone is a good player or a bad one(excluded the time spent as spectator - then is pretty obvious).
People are individuals - everyone has it's own idea of how things should/shouldn't be done and some times the game reward you for some insane risks, that may make you look like a complete ***** to anyone who's spectating you.
Sometimes the game punishes you for those mentioned.

Again - what's the deal?
Why do you so much care who do you play against?
Would you play different if you're 100% positive, that there are random people on the enemy side?
Or that and you're 100% positive that there is a premade on yours?
Would you play different if you drop against PGI members?
Against me?

That's the point I'm trying to make everyone see - if you(and by YOU I mean every player from this game) give 100% of yourself all the time and simply don't give a damn who you drop against, just cause no matter who it will be you'll be giving your best no matter what - it simply will (almost) stop matter weither would you drop against/with a premade or not.
Yea I lose - big deal.
I've been left alone at the end and game ended with me killing 2/3/4/5 even 6 people by my own and we've lost it...
You know what - I don't feel pissed off - I feel satisfied
And not cause I've been against bad players, neither it's cause I'm feeling better.
It's cause all the people who spectated me actually (I really hope so at least)learned something and I've helped.
Alright... in the end of that kinda games I really feel a bit like Rambo and s**t, which is also satisfieing

My point - if you're doing everything you can and if it works well - you'll always feel satisfied.
Not going like "AAAH S**T PREMADE... MEEH WTH SHOULD I PLAY AT ALL...".

I don't know how many times from those 2265 games when I was pugging I ended up against a premade and we've actually won it - I can bet my back that the numbers go about 40% of the time.
And whenever I actually note I'm against an organized team, a premade, I actually motivate myself even more, cause I know the game could turn out VERY challenging.

And as a final note - download teamspeak, there were posted official NGNG TS server somewhere on those forums - I'm there from time to time.
And everytime I asked some random person(seing they are less than 4 man in the channel) could I join them - they've always accepted.
It's fun
And only once till now I actually hit a douche-channel.

Sorry fellah' until they implement some sort of build-in way to communicate, there aint just another way.
Is this DEVs fault for not doing so, or everyone else, that's not team-playing properly - it's not for me to judge

[Keifomofutu]

SuperJoe, on 26 May 2013 - 02:34 AM, said:

should get mad at the devs for implimenting such awful match making, not the group of friends or whatever that want to play with each other.

This. If the devs can't see the super obvious solution of matching premades of similar size against each other then lonewolves to fill in then you know who to blame.

[Hotthedd]

How has this thread survived this long?

TeamSpeak is not an exploit.

Gaming mice are not an exploit.

Being in a co-ordinated group is not an exploit.

All of these things give an advantage, yet none are required to play MW:O.

Edited by Hotthedd, 26 May 2013 - 09:12 AM.

[One Medic Army]

Hot Rod, on 26 May 2013 - 04:04 AM, said:

- My games are ALWAYS starting with a full 8 man Enemy Team and then starting to fill up my team (consisting of 2+ players at this time) to hopefully get 8 man together. ( I usually end up in 7 vs 8 or 6 vs 8 games with me being at the short end of the stick.)

Actually, this is because it's deciding how to allocate the lances and waiting for people to connect to the match before they show up on the friendly team.
The enemy team shows all 8 from the start regardless of if they've connected yet or been assigned to a lance.

[Roughneck45]

LoL at this thread OP.

Groups are not the problem, those direct fire builds are, as far as the stomping goes.

If you put 8 pugs with direct fire against a group with mixed weaponry, with roughly equal pilot skill, the pugs will probably win.

Edited by Roughneck45, 26 May 2013 - 09:06 AM.

[Keifomofutu]

Roughneck45, on 26 May 2013 - 09:05 AM, said:

LoL at this thread OP.

Groups are not the problem, those direct fire builds are, as far as the stomping goes.

If you put 8 pugs with direct fire against a group with mixed weaponry, with roughly equal pilot skill, the pugs will probably win.

Yeah no.

[Grunkzzz]

I find the game boring when playing by myself. If I am not in a group I usually dont play. It has nothing to do with winning I just enjoy the team dynamic.

[Chavette]

Premades abuse the game, and some even livestream it!

You can see one example here: http://www.twitch.tv/igp

[Deathlike]

Chavette, on 30 May 2013 - 09:19 AM, said:

Premades abuse the game, and some even livestream it!

You can see one example here: http://www.twitch.tv/igp

I see what you did there...!

[Joseph Mallan]

SuperJoe, on 26 May 2013 - 02:34 AM, said:

should get mad at the devs for implimenting such awful match making, not the group of friends or whatever that want to play with each other.

Really? So we should be mad at the DEVs cause some players are using teamwork to stomp PUGs? I am a PUG now. I have no problem getting rolled. They were the Dragoons I was planetary militia! Ok hit start again.

[Belazaar]

LordBraxton, on 23 May 2013 - 11:09 AM, said:

In game voice chat.

End the whining

Done

Lets get real like every game has\needs built in VOIP

I don't think this will fix the issue by itself. A large problem is group make up. In most MMOs you are able to setup up groups based on rolls needed. Tank, Healer, DPS.

Right now pugs drop with whatever drops. So you can have a team with too many or not enough of the normal roles like battle line, in/direct fire, brawler, harasser or scout. I've seen to many matches end of defeat because the team was too heavy in one thing or didn't have anything of the other.

One advantage a coordinated group has is to be able to pick what mechs they bring into the game.

Voice and pre-game coordination would go along way to make things better.

Edited by Belazaar, 30 May 2013 - 10:09 AM.

[Postumus]

I play almost exclusively in groups (I wont say premades, that term is idiotic, this isn't WOW PVP), and while a group of four players on voice comms has an undeniable advantage against a random four players without, a group of four plus four pubbies does not have a huge advantage on an entirely uncoordinated group. Why is this? Because getting pubbies to work with you is like herding cats. Giant, slow, confusingly equipped cats, with a predilection for suicide runs. Exacerbating this is the fact that matchmaker handles team ELO by playing averages. Based on my win/loss ratio and other stats, I can reasonably say that I have a higher than average ELO. My usual teammates are the same. But, instead of matching us with players of a similar ELO score, the four that get tacked on to our group are used by matchmaker to bring the average ELO down. So, about half the games I play in end up with our non-grouped lance wandering off and getting annihilated, followed by a fierce but pointless 6-8 vs. 4 firefight.

[Cheatos]

IamSalvation, on 23 May 2013 - 06:17 AM, said:

Really PGI.. fix it.... ! Finaly!

Its just a bad joke how you keep catering a minority of players with your matchmaking that allows every veteran group of 4 to kill everyone and laugh about how easy it is.

Just make Matchmaking give each Team a premade or non at all.

Or let Groups ONLY play other groups, or max Groupsize of 2 for Random Games.

And no, its not ok.

I see 4 Man Premade groups with FOTM Builds all the time. Every 2nd game i run into them, either in my team or in the enemy team. Both is boring.

The only interesting Battles are when both have one or non.

To me 4 Man Players are nothing better then Cheaters/Exploiters, doing everything they can, how cheap it ever may be, to win at a video game.

It will ruin the game for every new player, just the last days i brought 2 old CB Veterans and one new player into the game.

All quit because of the Premade Stuff.

If they would at least take Builds that are a bit less in Power to make it fair.. no.. they all run the latest Chees/FOTM.

Another solution would be to give us 12Man Games FINALY... to compensate a bit for 4 man Teams.... but best would be 12 Players and limit groups to 2 Players... THIS would be about the right ratio for random games....

Yeah i know now all Players come in "get in a Premade yourselfe" "L2P" blabla...

I was in a Clan at start of OB, it was super boring, 90% winratio... really whats the point to rofl stomp everyone every game?
@"L2P" You can play how awesome you want, you can´t make up for 4 players that selected Mechs that work together, working together ingame and beein able to communicate 200% faster and better.... really its just easymode playing like that....

WOW.

How dare people group and fight in a team based game, its deplorable. You have every right to be mad with people who group up in a team. There shouldn't be anything of the kind. You know that every time you lose its against a premade right? not the fact that statistically speaking its no where near every other game. But cry on with your righteous indignation over the fact that you are playing a MMO and not a single player game. Or.... You could team up with some people, use a more efficient means of communicating like TS and play a team based game as its meant to be played. WITH A TEAM

[GumbyC2C]

sounds like someone needs more friends.

If I see a premade lance drop on the other team, it just makes me want to really step up my game and ruin their pubstomp. And more often than not, I succeed. And I smile and tell them GG when it's over.

A better solution BTW would be for PGI to add true integrated VOIP that way the non-grouped pubbers can coordinate just as well as the lance drops with their fancy-schmancy TS or Vent.

Edited by GumbyC2C, 30 May 2013 - 11:24 AM.

[saintchuck]

Niko Snow, on 30 May 2013 - 09:18 AM, said:

Matchmaking should be prioritizing groups to face off with the closest similar sized group within the ELO bracket. If no such groups are available, it will be begin taking from the pick-up queue.

Then Matchmaking is broke. If it were working like this, sync-dropping 2x4s wouldn't be possible unless the opposing team had at least 1 4-man. Sync-dropping 2x4s is possible and does happen.