325 replies to this topic

[blinkin]

I am, on 24 May 2013 - 05:55 AM, said:

IAmSalvation,

You are doing it wrong good sir. You are trying to cal them out on something they all are partaking in. Of course they will come in here and argue tooth and nail to preserve it. Try a different route. Ask them why they still avoid the 8 man queue like the plague. You know why. So do tey. So do I. They can't handle good fights, and will argue the current meta is stale no matter what that meta is, to justify pub farming in the random queue. Go ahead ask them, ask the quasi-l33ts. See if you get a meaningful answer.

Just a thought.

woooo! someone who hasn't read any of the posts, and is just trying to shame our side into submission. and of course iamsalvation has auto hit the like button because that is what he does for anything that even slightly resembles agreement.

i want tools to increase teamwork across the board not some moronic system that shelters groups of players from learning tactics. give everyone voip. add more command tools. add hot key commands for rapid communication (help, attack this target, etc.).

this is a tactics based game and we shouldn't be hiding a group of players from tactics and teamwork. we should be empowering the lonewolves to work together better.

[blinkin]

I am, on 24 May 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

Are you one giant lie, or a bunch of smaller lies taped together?

I am, on 24 May 2013 - 06:51 AM, said:

"Mech Warrior Online" ...... where team stacking is l33t.

is having an alt, with an unimaginative name, specifically for trolling actually that useful iamsalvation?



here is a video that seems to be very relevant to the current topic (not trolling i think everyone involved should watch this):
http://youtu.be/cOIZXxB1nlI

Edited by blinkin, 24 May 2013 - 01:11 PM.

[Soy]

IamSalvation, on 24 May 2013 - 12:07 PM, said:

[...]Despite the evidence that most players play in groups. Despite this being a team oriented game. Despite the fact that teaming up is both legitimate, and even encouraged, with tools coming with each patch to help in its use[...]

...word.

[IamSalvation]

blinkin, on 24 May 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

is having an alt, with an unimaginative name, specifically for trolling actually that useful iamsalvation?

LoL i thougth some one would bring that up when i read his name.
He is not my alt and i don´t even know him... also we both have a bit much postings never before in the same topic to be a "troll alt" don´t you think so?

[Xie Belvoule]

All I hear is....

Edited by Xie Belvoule, 24 May 2013 - 01:32 PM.

[Hoaggie]

IamSalvation, on 23 May 2013 - 06:17 AM, said:

To me 4 Man Players are nothing better then Cheaters/Exploiters, doing everything they can, how cheap it ever may be, to win at a video game.

[sarcasm] You're right, it is not fair that we work as a team and enjoy ourselves. Teamwork is a massive exploit and needs to be patched out [/sarcasm]

IamSalvation, I understand that you don’t have anybody to play with, but right now we have room one more in our group. Contact me for the TS info.

[IamSalvation]

Hoaggie, on 24 May 2013 - 02:35 PM, said:

[sarcasm] You're right, it is not fair that we work as a team and enjoy ourselves. Teamwork is a massive exploit and needs to be patched out [/sarcasm]

IamSalvation, I understand that you don’t have anybody to play with, but right now we have room one more in our group. Contact me for the TS info.

Read the post.
If have many friends and some even started MWO...
I play Planetside2 with friends, play World of Tanks with friends, RUSE and Civ5 with and against Friends.
As you may have read i was in a group in MWO. I am not interested in getting in a group for MWO in its current state where groups are only for pug stomping.. or as you say "enjoying yourselfe"

[LordBraxton]

IamSalvation, on 24 May 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

Read the post.
If have many friends and some even started MWO...
I play Planetside2 with friends, play World of Tanks with friends, RUSE and Civ5 with and against Friends.
As you may have read i was in a group in MWO. I am not interested in getting in a group for MWO in its current state where groups are only for pug stomping.. or as you say "enjoying yourselfe"

you gotta be kidding me right?

I'll say it again.

running solo is way easier for me

When I run solo I see a bunch of green mechs with ****** loadouts

When I 4 man the enemies are brightly painted and carrying min\maxxed loadouts, and using teamwork

Elo is doing SOMETHING

Edited by LordBraxton, 24 May 2013 - 04:29 PM.

[Alekzander Smirnoff]

12 V 12. Problem solved, move along.

[Ninthshadow]

Prosperity Park hit the nail on the head all the way back on page 2.

I play a majority of the time on my own and the last percentage as a pair or ever so rarely a trio with people I know. If what you are suggested went through I am sure the next big complaint would be about 3-man premades.

Besides that most of the other arguments against the current separation are still just as good, including you cannot tell for certain. The number of times I’ve arrived in a lance with one to three other Steiner players would probably surprise you.

On a side note, I would look forward to weight playing a bigger part in the Matchmaker. However the Devs seem to have some pretty convincing numbers for the MM working as planned. A built in voice system probably would probably ease the ‘unfair’ feeling quite a bit.

This thread was good for a laugh though. I’m surprised it got so dang long. I’m even more surprised I bothered to read it all.

It was a fun little journey of discovery. It even took a detour through networking problems. It was kind of like a plot twist.

Edited by Ninthshadow, 24 May 2013 - 05:37 PM.

[Hoaggie]

IamSalvation, on 24 May 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

Read the post.
If have many friends and some even started MWO...
I play Planetside2 with friends, play World of Tanks with friends, RUSE and Civ5 with and against Friends.
As you may have read i was in a group in MWO. I am not interested in getting in a group for MWO in its current state where groups are only for pug stomping.. or as you say "enjoying yourselfe"

So you refuse to use the tools implemented by the game designers (PGI ran a TS server during closed beta), that is exactly the same thing as refusing to put more than half armor on mech then complaining because everyone else has full armor. If you choose not to do something that is a basic part of an activity, don’t complain because you refuse to do it.

Hold on, I want to be like you so I’m going to go take 3 tires off my car, drive it around, then send a letter to Dodge because I don’t like the way it drives. I shouldn’t have to use tires not made by Dodge. After that I’m going to unplug my mouse and use only my keyboard to operate my PC, then go to the Microsoft forums and blast them for making an inefficient interface.

[NineTails]

My Little Pony: Friendship is OP

Edited by NineTails, 24 May 2013 - 07:47 PM.

[Taemien]

IamSalvation, on 24 May 2013 - 12:07 PM, said:

Do you think so many would have read it if i seleceted a more "tame" title?
Its not that i hate all 4 Mans.
Its not that i don´t understand that they like to play with friends.
I play with some (Noobish) Friends too atm
In the End, yes its more PGIs fault.
But its the Communitys fault not beeing more vocal about this Problem imho.
Rigth in this thread you can see that some Players are with me, dropping mostly solo, seeing this problem too.
Some are dropping mostly in Groups, but too see that its a Problem and they would like to have better Group Matchmaking. Some of them even stated that they run less powerfull builds when group dropping. This is really great!

AND

then you find several that openly admit they like stomping, only want to win no matter how or just pretending that there is no Problem at all.

THIS are the only Players i call out in my Thread Title.

Your title reads: "4 Player Premades are Exploiters"

You did that to incite people. That is what I am grilling you for. Would a 'lamer' title be less noticed? No, I don't believe it would be. If the content of the message was unique, intelligent, and insightful, then it would stand on its own. Instead you went for something controversial, inciteful, trollish, and insulting.

I don't care why players run four mans. What they do is their own business. If they're on my team, so what? If they are my opponents, god help them (I don't give a damn how many friends you bring, I will mess you up). When I run my own four mans, its because I have 3 buddies hanging out on TS, two of which I served in the Army with, and thats how we do stuff together and hang out thousands of miles apart. So forgive me if something like your title gets my disdain.

The way to go about fixing this issue is to encourage players to play in groups and reap the benefits and fun that cooperative, competitive, and social interactive playing has to offer. Not polarize the community into Solo'ers vs Groupers. Your title is venomous and does little to help the situation.

The changes I spoke of are coming within the next few patches if their roadmap is still on schedule for phase one of CW. So all we have to do is be patient. In the mean time, there IS something the community can do to help the situation. Units and individuals can get together with like minded players and start grouping now.

I urge everyone to do this. In the last 15 years of online gaming, the most fun I've had has been with groups. It started with a Davion oriented group back in the 1990's when I was playing MechWarrior 3. I had a great group of people to run matches with and just hang out and chat with. This continued to all other games I played where I was in a unit, guild, clan, outfit ect.

Joining a unit isn't about PUG stomping, its about building camaraderie and friendships. In addition to taking the challenge to the next level and facing off against similar groups. The players that do this to PUG stomp are a very small minority.

It seems like you're a bit rattled by what I've been saying, but at least you seem to be listening. So I'll ask you again, change the title and leave the venomous nature that started behind us. Its doing very little except causing flaming, trolling, and dividing our community.

[Applecrow]

There are seven blue arrows on the map for a reason.

Its not the red arrows fault if the blue arrows refuse to work together.

[p00k]

Applecrow, on 24 May 2013 - 09:32 PM, said:

There are seven blue arrows on the map for a reason.

Its not the red arrows fault if the blue arrows refuse to work together.

actually there's usually only 4 blue arrows, and 3 teal arrows
sometimes 5/2, sometimes 6/1, but rarely are there 7 blue arrows

[Lykaon]

Galenit, on 23 May 2013 - 06:39 AM, said:

What did the devs say about premade numbers?
If i remember right, it was only a small number of the playerbase and not 50% as you say.
Maybe a lot of the real pug players left after encountering to much 4 man fotm groups or heard a "gg close" one time to much?

You are flawed in your assumption that every match ever includes premades.

In order for you to derive that 50% of all players are premades requires that 100% of matches include 50% premade compositions.

The poster you replied to stated that when their 4 man drops they very frequently face another premade.Since this player's four man premade can not be in every match ongoing at every moment their sampling was derived from ONLY the matches they participated in.

ELO scores of premade groups are likely to be higher because nobody is arguing that 3rd party voice coms and tight team work don't get wins.

It is then a possibility that the ELO bracket that this player drew their sampling from has a disproportionate number of 4 man players resulting in a high value of 4 man vs 4 man games.

This is far from stating that 50% of all MWo players are premade players.All they said was frequently they were matched against 4 mans in THEIR games.

And as a frequent 4 man premade player I agree I often find matches drop us against one or more premade groups.I actually had a couple a few days ago that had nothing but premades and no puggies.

I also would not be suprised to find that many players make an assumption that they faced a premade when they lose to a very one sided fight.

Of course these days it's a fairly safe bet that you were against a premade when 4 players in one lace all have the same affiliation and did most of the killing.

[Lykaon]

IamSalvation, on 24 May 2013 - 05:45 AM, said:

You don´t like to read, do you?

I said it many times here.

I find it also boring if the Pug stomping Lance is in my team.

You know, i want close games, fair games. not 8-0 / 0-8

No matter on what side of it i am playing...

Have you tried the 8 man only que?These are usually very hard fought games.At least the ones I have been through have been.

You will however find it difficult to keep an eight man team running for several matches so you will only likely get a handful of 8 v 8 matches in a typical gaming session.

And then there are the smaller pool of players (as you have stated only a tiny fraction of players are in groups compared to pugs) results in longer waits and failures to find matches and poor matches for ELO due to smaller samplings in the segregated 8 man pool.

And then of course you will probably not be using 8 mans for XP grinding on chassis because using a non mastered chassis is a handycap to your team that ELO does not calculate.Not to mention that you would probably complete three to four times as many matches in the solo or 4 man que than the 8 man que would allow for.

Then of course there is the issue with needing to grind XP on 3 mech chassis for any specific mech that you actually want to master (better hope you don't want to master Ravens the non 3L Ravens are not nearly as versitile as a 3L and your team will be at a handycap because of the inferior chassis)

And of course if you decide that you prefer team play within a premade group structure and stick to your guns when it comes to being anti 4 man in PUG matches you will of course only ever drop 8 v 8 dispite the vastly slower accumulation of C-bills and XP.

I mean after all there should be some penalty for wanting to partake in a play style that is not like the vast majority of the player base right?

So I am sure that sucking it up and just accepting that as a premade preferanced player you will progress much more slowly than a puggie counterpart.

That is IF everyone did what you wished right? The premade players get to be pushed into a smaller sampling for less accurate matchmaker taking longer to find matches and only ever getting to play as they prefer when 7 other players have the same amount of time to spend grouping.

But seriously though 8 v8 are where I have experience my most tense and close matches it's worth a try if you don't mind all the complications.

Edited by Lykaon, 25 May 2013 - 02:27 AM.

[Dmitri Valenov]

Dear OP,

4 man teams are not exploiting. Not are they as prevalent as you seem to believe. Most likely the reason you get defeated is because your team refused to cover each other or focus damage.

[Hoaggie]

I hate how people that are really bad at thig agame come to the forums to complain, and their complaints ruin it for the people that actually enjoy the game.

[DeaconW]

LordBraxton, on 24 May 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

I lose MORE when I run 4 mans because I am more likely to be up against tough opponents.

When I solo I fight a bunch of stock green mechs than can't shoot straight.

Yeah...and the MM seems to put me on *their* side most of the time...how do you get them to be on the *other* side? Oh...I'm sorry...I am expecting the MM and ELO to work. I agree there should be a solo-only que. I play with a unit but when I am pugging I would prefer a solo que.