Medium Mechs Useless: Because Of Alpha Boating & Convergence
#1
Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:31 PM
I fear a spider a lot more than any medium (except cicada since their hitboxes are so wonky).
The problem lies with the alpha boating and convergence mechanics.
You should have a heat penalty for firing 2 or more of the same kind of weapon at once (energy weapons since ballistics already pay dearly in weight, slot, heat and ammo).
Convergence should not be instant and automatic.
Convergence should work only for arm mounted weapons. Torso mounted weapons should always be straight-forward firing with no convergence.
#2
Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:33 PM
Part of the problem is that Cents and Trebs are both as tall as assault mechs. Treb can even see eye-to-eye with an Atlas FFS.
#3
Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:47 PM
Skyfaller, on 30 May 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:
Convergence should work only for arm mounted weapons. Torso mounted weapons should always be straight-forward firing with no convergence.
Why?
There is no reason why torso mounted weapons cant be on gimbles. Sure, aiming 5 feet in front of you is a bit off, but it only needs 10-15 degrees to make almost any of the shots.
#4
Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:48 PM
Divine Madcat, on 30 May 2013 - 04:47 PM, said:
There is no reason why torso mounted weapons cant be on gimbles. Sure, aiming 5 feet in front of you is a bit off, but it only needs 10-15 degrees to make almost any of the shots.
If you look at some of the original Mech designs from Battletech... yes the lasers, even the torso mounted ones, were on gimbles.
#5
Posted 30 May 2013 - 04:52 PM
but yeah mediums have sucked since the SRM nerf
the one where they went from 2.5 to 1.5 thats like 40% of a medium mechs damage GONE
#6
Posted 30 May 2013 - 05:03 PM
#7
Posted 30 May 2013 - 06:43 PM
#8
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:00 PM
#9
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:06 PM
Darvaza, on 30 May 2013 - 07:00 PM, said:
If I was roleplaying
I would be a trebuchet pilot.
Thats how much I just love the chassis
But I always use something bigger because I feel like a hindrance to my team
I feel like my cataphracts\highlanders\stalkers reach 600-700 damage in a solid game, whereas my trebuchet only reaches those numbers in a PERFECT game
#10
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:06 PM
Lights = Scouts and Harrassers
Mediums = Flankers and Strikers
Heavies = Main Battle Mechs
Assaults = Weapons Platforms
#11
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:13 PM
And yes, OP is correct about the speed, size, and armor factor. I am tempted to just disconnect every time alpine comes up because there is just nowhere to hide, and a medium chassis just cannot take a pounding at 800m. Here is my mech after getting hit twice; this is why nobody plays medium:
#12
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:21 PM
#13
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:23 PM
Blacke, on 30 May 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:
Lights = Scouts and Harrassers
Mediums = Flankers and Strikers
Heavies = Main Battle Mechs
Assaults = Weapons Platforms
I play a heavy like a flanker\striker
my cataphracts have 4.0 kdrs
my stalker 3f has a 6.0 kdr
you know what kdr means?
nothing
so I am real sick of people quoting their kdrs as "PROOF' that something is OK or BALANCED
#14
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:28 PM
LordBraxton, on 30 May 2013 - 04:52 PM, said:
but yeah mediums have sucked since the SRM nerf
the one where they went from 2.5 to 1.5 thats like 40% of a medium mechs damage GONE
Honestly if mediums require a specific weapon system to be useful, then they are broken. You are right that SRM's gave mediums a good punch up close, but many popular designs from BT in the medium class didn't carry them at all. The Phoenix Hawk, Enforcer, Vindicator (well it had an LRM5 so I guess you could mechlab it to have SRM's), Crab, Hatchetman.... If SRM's are the only thing that can make mediums useful, then something really is broken about them.
#15
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:28 PM
#16
Posted 30 May 2013 - 07:44 PM
Blacke, on 30 May 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:
Lights = Scouts and Harrassers
Mediums = Flankers and Strikers
Heavies = Main Battle Mechs
Assaults = Weapons Platforms
Lights = Cappers/Harrassers (scouting is virtually pointless currently).
Mediums = Meat shields (slow mediums are far outclassed by heavies, and the Cicada by lights)
Heavies = Flankers/support
Assaults = Main Battle Mechs (rarely do I play a game where there's fewer than 3 or 4 Assaults per team)
#17
Posted 30 May 2013 - 08:01 PM
#18
Posted 30 May 2013 - 08:10 PM
Blacke, on 30 May 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:
Lights = Scouts and Harrassers
Mediums = Flankers and Strikers
Heavies = Main Battle Mechs
Assaults = Weapons Platforms
The problem with that is this game does not conform to TT 'roles' of the mechs.
Mediums as flankers and strikers.. umm.. not in this game. Yes, they can use their speed to flank and yes they can use their speed to strike .. but they do so in an environment where one or two alpha strikes kills them. They do not have the superb speed of lights nor are they small like lights...they get hit very hard, quick. I've tried HIDING after flanking the enemy and waiting for them to engage my team..and strike via hit & run any mech that is fighting one of my team-mates on the perimeter... know what happens? I strike once or twice and then some enemy mech 500m away happens to see me and takes a snapshot at me with its alpha and... my armor goes from 100% to deep red in one hit.
The issue is... a blackjack with its biggest engine can reach just over 100kph. That engine size means its weaponry is reduced. In contrast, I can load a jager with four times the firepower, carrying twice the armor...and running at 90'ish kph.
Did I mention lights have the same armor as mediums? Kind of weird isn't it?
Mediums need to be given a real niche in this game. Real time first person shooter game throws most TT roles out the window.
Perhaps the mediums could be given similar engine speed multipliers that lights receive..not as much but more than what they have now. Mediums could also be given a boost to heat capacitor size...making them be bigger lights but with a bigger ability to sustain their fire.
So if you were to compare a 6 energy jenner with a 6 energy blackjack (same weapons/engine/HS# equipped) under the above mentioned medium perks:
- The blackjack would be running 10kph slower than the jenner.
- The blackjack would be able to fire 2 more alphas than the jenner before overheating.
#19
Posted 30 May 2013 - 08:34 PM
If you use your medium to support assaults and take shots of opportunity you'll find you do a lot better. With the Hunchback and Centurions you have to learn to move your torso to take the damage in non-critical areas. The Centurions great in this regard to it's left arm shield. The Trebuchet is obviously more of a support unit but you can use it as a good JJ or hit and run unit with the right builds. Cicada is more of a scout or "heavy light" then it is a medium. And the new blackjack is tough to get down with it's odd weight but can be used to great effect with the right build. It's also a jump jet capable medium you can use both PPCs, Gauss and AC20's with.
#20
Posted 30 May 2013 - 08:40 PM
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