173 replies to this topic

[Iphariel]

their explanation is really strange.. another laser jumping mech. that really add something new to the meta

[Kwibl]

So to change up the meta of big energy hardpoint mechs, as well as JJ snipers, you're adding a mech with JJs that has predominantly energy hardpoints. Rather than a nice, big popular mech that has a very balanced loadout.

Can we get clarification of PGI's definition of "meta" - is it simply what you guys are seeing used in general across the board (in 4 mans and lone wolf random matches) or is it the actual competitive meta in 8 mans? Or did you realise that due to the current PPC meta, the orion wouldn't be used in those matches so you went for something that might actually get used in 8 mans?

If the latter is the case, i don't think you're changing the meta so much as catering to it.

[xDeityx]

I hope you guys didn't need Ekman's last post to realize that PGI has no idea what they are doing at anything other than art and monetization. It's comical to see him refer to the metagame as something that they are actively trying to shape according to a plan rather than the result of regurgitating assets onto the field and seeing how they happen to interact.

[Lee Ving]

Bryan Ekman, on 05 June 2013 - 08:31 AM, said:

Completely untrue. lol. We wanted to more variety to the mech meta game, so we changed it up a bit. The order in which mechs are announced will not always be the order in which they are released.

Quote

We wanted to more variety to the mech meta game, so we changed it up a bit.

Quote

We wanted to more variety to the mech meta

Quote

more variety to the mech meta

By providing us with a mech that almost certainly is going to see little use compared to one that would see widespread adoption?

[Thomas Dziegielewski]

where do you get this from? LOL

[Deathlike]

Lee Ving, on 05 June 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

By providing us with a mech that almost certainly is going to see little use compared to one that would see widespread adoption?

It may or may not replace the Trebuchet, Dragon, and/or Catapult in one fell swoop. I'm sure someone will be disappointed.

[Lee Ving]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 05 June 2013 - 12:10 PM, said:

where do you get this from? LOL

Are funds spent on the game being used to pay you to post this?

[stjobe]

Thomas Dziegielewski, on 05 June 2013 - 12:10 PM, said:

where do you get this from? LOL

Your own resident foot-in-the-mouth expert: https://twitter.com/bryanekman

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the Quickdraw offered more to the meta game at this point, so we pushed it up a cycle.

Mindbogglingly stupid, and the very next tweet is even better:

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Quickdraw offered more diversity to the meta game at this point in time so we pushed it up a cycle.

"more diversity" by introducing yet another jump-jet energy 'mech? You don't think anyone will poptart with that one, do you?

Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Edited by stjobe, 05 June 2013 - 12:28 PM.

[jakucha]

Lee Ving, on 05 June 2013 - 12:16 PM, said:

Are funds spent on the game being used to pay you to post this?

People complain when they post, people complain when they don't post. Make up your mind.

Edited by jakucha, 05 June 2013 - 12:35 PM.

[Pupecki]

I'm really disappointed by this announcement. It would be different if I felt they had a good reason for making the unexpected switch but as far as I can tell they don't. Honestly the quickdraw doesnt bring much to the table in terms or different varients and it certainly brings even less to the table in terms of "changing the meta". both things the the orion would do very well as well as bringing back a very iconic and fan favorite mech all in a weight class that we haven't seen before.

jakucha, on 05 June 2013 - 12:35 PM, said:

People complain when they post, people complain when they don't post. Make up your mind.

I believe they are more mad by the fact that what they do post doesnt really tell us anything and is rarely more than a sentence and rarely do they ever explain to us why they did this or that, its more of a we are doing this. then when asked why we get no responses.

[jakucha]

Pupecki, on 05 June 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

I'm really disappointed by this announcement. It would be different if I felt they had a good reason for making the unexpected switch but as far as I can tell they don't. Honestly the quickdraw doesnt bring much to the table in terms or different varients and it certainly brings even less to the table in terms of "changing the meta". both things the the orion would do very well as well as bringing back a very iconic and fan favorite mech all in a weight class that we haven't seen before.



I believe they are more mad by the fact that what they do post doesnt really tell us anything and is rarely more than a sentence and rarely do they ever explain to us why they did this or that, its more of a we are doing this. then when asked why we get no responses.

They confirmed why it wasn't added rather than letting people wrongly speculate.

[Lord Perversor]

Kwibl, on 05 June 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

So to change up the meta of big energy hardpoint mechs, as well as JJ snipers, you're adding a mech with JJs that has predominantly energy hardpoints. Rather than a nice, big popular mech that has a very balanced loadout.

Can we get clarification of PGI's definition of "meta" - is it simply what you guys are seeing used in general across the board (in 4 mans and lone wolf random matches) or is it the actual competitive meta in 8 mans? Or did you realise that due to the current PPC meta, the orion wouldn't be used in those matches so you went for something that might actually get used in 8 mans?

If the latter is the case, i don't think you're changing the meta so much as catering to it.

I think they refer to the PPc+Gauss meta, as the Orion will become a 5 tons heavier CTF thus bringing very few changes to the overall loadout.

The Quickdraw while still can bring 3-4 PPC builds, should have more options as a heavier version of the 8-9 med lasers Hunch and BJ, plus added JJ and some missiles for short range.

Think they expect some pilots trying the Quickdraw as 105+Kph mechs with JJ ability for flanking than another long range sniper.

[xDeityx]

jakucha, on 05 June 2013 - 12:35 PM, said:

People complain when they post, people complain when they don't post. Make up your mind.

Please don't confuse communication with posting.

[jakucha]

xDeityx, on 05 June 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Please don't confuse communication with posting.

They got communication in this and they're complaining over that, which is why I'm confused.

[kesuga7]

welp
a pgi guy tries to explain why it was delayed (And disproving this thread) and all it adds up to is backfire from the thread.

at least they didn't keep us in the dark like other developers/publishers (And giving his reason why it was delayed)

anyways im definitely boating 6 medium pulse and always going to aim for cockpit

Edited by kesuga7, 05 June 2013 - 12:55 PM.

[FupDup]

kesuga7, on 05 June 2013 - 12:54 PM, said:

welp
a pgi guy tries to explain why it was delayed (And disproving this thread) and all it adds up to is backfire from the thread.

at least they didn't keep us in the dark like other developers/publishers (And giving his reason why it was delayed)

anyways im definitely boating 6 medium pulse and always going to aim for cockpit

His "try" at explaining it was pretty weak at best.

Let's see what the Quickdraw brings to the table:
1. Jump-capable 60-tonner
2. More lasers and missiles than Dragons

The thing about those two attributes, though, is that Catapults and Trebuchets somewhat already fulfill them. The 60-ton weight increment is already filled by the Dragon anyways (even though Dragons can't jump).

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Orion:
1. Fills the weight gap between the Awesome and Cataphract (75 tons)
2. Even blend of ballistic, missile, and ballistic hardpoints (Catapult is energy/missile, Cataphract is energy/ballistic, Dragon is bleh)


Ultimately, it stands to reason that the Orion would add more diversity to the game than another fast, Streak-totting jumper. The Orion would basically behave much like a Brawler Atlas but slightly smaller and more maneuverable.

Edited by FupDup, 05 June 2013 - 01:08 PM.

[BlueSanta]

Bryan Ekman, on 05 June 2013 - 08:31 AM, said:

Completely untrue. lol. We wanted to more variety to the mech meta game, so we changed it up a bit. The order in which mechs are announced will not always be the order in which they are released.

I am not laughing, Bryan. The order the mechs were announced has been the order they have been released, except for the Flea, which was announced beforehand on an NGNG podcast by you or Garth, and the reason was given right then and there why (because of MASC needing to be in the game first).

There wasn't a big fuss made because not many people care about the Flea and your reasoning was totally valid. The Flea would have been DOA without MASC.

A lot more people care about the Orion because it has a lot of positive history, is a varied chassis, and fills a current void in the game. They expected it this month, which was perfectly logical.

You yourself said the mech was BUMPED, which means it had a release date and that date was this month.

Imagine if this has been the Mad Cat and the community was expecting it to be released in the present month, but suddenly that expectation was crushed and replaced with an arguably worse mech that they had no idea was going to even appear in the game? The outrage would be 2-5x what this is.

Just communicate openly with your community.

Edited by BlueSanta, 05 June 2013 - 02:49 PM.

[Lightfoot]

Banky, on 05 June 2013 - 11:07 AM, said:

Totally agree. But I think from PGIs standpoint they're figuring its best to get all the similar mechs out of the way at once. Since that's a big part of what they're working on balancing it does kinda make sense. All the same I'm still pissed to have to wait even longer on the Orion. It's one of the mechs I've been looking forward to most.

I see your point, but why would I buy a Quickdraw? I accidently spent my hoarded CBills on a Jagermech so I was going to pay cash for the Orion because at 75 tons it's a very special mech. I don't think I would even waste CBills for a Quickdraw. 60 ton mechs are at the nerfy end of heavy mechs. You can release these odd mechs, but that doesn't mean I will buy one. You want to sell some mechs for MC's? Release the Orion while it's still unique. Once the Clan mechs appear the Orion will have lost alot of it's shiny singularity.

Edited by Lightfoot, 05 June 2013 - 02:07 PM.

[Davoke]

Unless...the Orion and OrionIIC come out at the same time O:



I better get some brownie points for that.

Checkmate PGI!

[Jetfire]

Orthos done first according to Alex, the artist. I could see where the Orion might take a while longer given the arms. Such is life.