459 replies to this topic

[Adrienne Vorton]

DocBach, on 13 June 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

I wish this was way more MMORPGish, where XP could be translated to improve your piloting skill to make convergence tighter and faster, and the pilot "skills" had different trees and such to unlock rather than the bland mastering system we have currently.

afaik it was planned this way with more specific trees and such...but PGI decided to throw it out the windwow "to let the players decide how they play the game"... my guess is, it was too much work on top of what they have on the table...

Edited by Adrienne Vorton, 13 June 2013 - 09:35 PM.

[Asmudius Heng]

Slashmckill, on 13 June 2013 - 09:11 PM, said:

I would so love to play that mechwarrior game.... Too bad it doesn't exist. Now i'am sad.

I once thought that, but i also understand why they are bad. Eventually the best path is found and too many things become obsolete.

I made a topic about making the efficiencies something you could turn on and off rather than get ALL of them. You need to earn them all but can only apply half or something so you have to choose what you want to boost in your mech for the role you need.

The modules are another ay they are giving a different take on things. However I feel all of these things need to come with a risk reward situation.

Efficiencies and modules might give you a bonus to something, but should give you a negative to something else so everything you do is a choice - the bonus should be bigger than the negative, but it should make you think about what you equip rather than the obvious choices.

wait this isnt the thread for this ...

[Slashmckill]

Asmudius Heng, on 13 June 2013 - 09:43 PM, said:

I once thought that, but i also understand why they are bad. Eventually the best path is found and too many things become obsolete.

I made a topic about making the efficiencies something you could turn on and off rather than get ALL of them. You need to earn them all but can only apply half or something so you have to choose what you want to boost in your mech for the role you need.

The modules are another ay they are giving a different take on things. However I feel all of these things need to come with a risk reward situation.

Efficiencies and modules might give you a bonus to something, but should give you a negative to something else so everything you do is a choice - the bonus should be bigger than the negative, but it should make you think about what you equip rather than the obvious choices.

wait this isnt the thread for this ...

There is always going to be the "Best" build, just like right now every mech is a f#@king ppc boat. Of course seeing as they don't balance s%$t as it is now i shudder to think what that would be like. (At any rate i would still like to see far more depth from this game in general, the gameplay is far too shallow to even remotely begin calling it an mmo)

[Iacov]

i'd be fine with that!

[Asmudius Heng]

Slashmckill, on 13 June 2013 - 10:07 PM, said:

There is always going to be the "Best" build, just like right now every mech is a f#@king ppc boat. Of course seeing as they don't balance s%$t as it is now i shudder to think what that would be like. (At any rate i would still like to see far more depth from this game in general, the gameplay is far too shallow to even remotely begin calling it an mmo)

There will always be best build(s)

The more of them around the more variety - nothing will be perfectly balanced but as long as at the pointy end of the competitive spectrum there is still enough variety of roles and play styles we will be ok - as you state we are not. Though i was talkig about a system of trade offs on nearly all choices which creates depth. I you cannot get everything without suffering in another department you build in weaknesses to mechs not just strengths

[PEEFsmash]

I would not be okay with a cone of fire. No reason to make the game aim for me when I can aim for myself.

[Johnny Reb]

No, if I want tanks then I will go there. Would, TF2 be better with that crap? no! And this is not tf2 but a stompy robot game.

[One Medic Army]

Johnny Reb, on 13 June 2013 - 10:31 PM, said:

No, if I want tanks then I will go there. Would, TF2 be better with that crap? no! And this is not tf2 but a stompy robot game.

I dunno wtf you're even talking about, TF2 has cones of fire unless you play one one of the servers modded for perfect accuracy.

[Ralgas]

PEEFsmash, on 13 June 2013 - 10:23 PM, said:

I would not be okay with a cone of fire. No reason to make the game aim for me when I can aim for myself.

My god we agree on something!!

The only cone of fire i'd accept is in a convergence type model where from pinpoint it spread in a straight line to fixed forward hardpoint. The problem with "randomness" many want in just copy pasting most fps cones is that it is too hard to balance the cone over the variety of chassis we have to shoot at. Would lead to one of 2 issues

1) wont be enough to alter damage on assaults, and they just die even faster

2) you'll create a situation where getting the patterning right for the larger mechs gives the smaller lights back their lag shield, only now there's no way to compensate for it.

[Johnny Reb]

One Medic Army, on 13 June 2013 - 10:32 PM, said:

I dunno wtf you're even talking about, TF2 has cones of fire unless you play one one of the servers modded for perfect accuracy.

Not the tf2 I played before I went to this game last year.

[Zyllos]

I personally would go for Homeless Bill's suggestion: http://mwomercs.com/...oats-and-clans/

Quote

No skimming on this part. My solution is to implement a scale that represents the load on the targeting computer (TCL). Each weapon would, similar to heat, have an associated targeting computer stress value (TCS). When a weapon (or group) is fired, the stress value of all about-to-fire weapons are added to the load on the targeting computer. The targeting computer load automatically dissipates at a constant rate of 100 per second.

When the load is between 0 and 100, there are no ill effects. When it goes over 100, all missile locks and Artemis functionality are lost, convergence stops working, and you begin to take a small accuracy penalty to any shots fired. Locking capability, Artemis, and convergence are not restored until the load on the targeting computer reaches 100 or below.

From 101 to 200, the accuracy penalty gets progressively worse (the cone of fire expands). Each weapon fires at its own accuracy offset, rather than all picking the same skew. The pilot can continue to drive the targeting computer load up to a maximum of 500 by continuing to fire, but the effects of a targeting computer overload reach their worst at 200.

To clarify, you can't get away with one free alpha strike; TCL values are added and penalties are applied before the shots are fired.

The only thing I would modify is that instead of losing convergence and missile locks at 100+, I would just add a Cone-of-Fire and increase missile lock time and all current locks are reset until it reaches 200. At 200, the Cone-of-Fire is very large and you lose missile locks.

On top of this, this system is easily implementable, modifiable, and balanced. It's also a system that is easy to expand on (say, like add a TCS value to throttle speeds, arm actuator hits, ect).

Edited by Zyllos, 13 June 2013 - 10:52 PM.

[Deathlike]

Wow...a thread where people didn't really argue and made good points.

I thought that hope was lost in the mega-thread of fail.

Keep up with the good ideas.

[One Medic Army]

Johnny Reb, on 13 June 2013 - 10:45 PM, said:

Not the tf2 I played before I went to this game last year.

http://steamcommunit...y/games?tab=all
1710.5 hours of TF2 on record, I think I know what I'm talking about here.
THe only weapons that had pinpoint precision were the sniper rifles, and a few of the pistols (first shot only).

[Johnny Reb]

One Medic Army, on 13 June 2013 - 10:50 PM, said:

http://steamcommunit...y/games?tab=all
1710.5 hours of TF2 on record, I think I know what I'm talking about here.
THe only weapons that had pinpoint precision were the sniper rifles, and a few of the pistols (first shot only).

Guess, my 3,776 hrs on the game mean nothing. What cone convergence are you talking about?

Till then let my hats talk: http://www.tf2items.com/id/JohnnyReb

if that matters to you which it shouldn't.

same name isnt it great!

Edited by Johnny Reb, 13 June 2013 - 11:01 PM.

[One Medic Army]

Johnny Reb, on 13 June 2013 - 10:56 PM, said:

Guess, my 3,776 hrs on the game mean nothing. What cone convergence are you talking about?

I'm talking about cone of fire.
Pretty much every weapon in TF2 had random cone.

Heavy miniguns, shotguns with random pattern, sniper SMG, even the medic syringe guns had spread.

Edited by One Medic Army, 13 June 2013 - 11:00 PM.

[90upznoobz]

I like the cone of fire idea, but I think it would need to be integrated with a nerfed alpha strike to be effective. Here's how I think it should be: When you alpha, the cone of fire instantly increases due to high recoil (seriously, 3-6 ppcs? Your mech will not be able to stand still). Then, it will take a while for your cone of fire to readjust and reduce to a pinpoint again. The recent usage and high heat of the barrel also causes the mech's cone to stay temporarily enlarged until it cools down. Also, by using multiple weapons at once, your system heats very quickly, and gains extra heat. The way we ensure that ppc, ac/20, gauss, MLL, etc. boats are limited is by increasing the current heat costs and creating a cone of fire when using alpha.

Edited by 90upznoobz, 13 June 2013 - 11:02 PM.

[Johnny Reb]

One Medic Army, on 13 June 2013 - 11:00 PM, said:

I'm talking about cone of fire.
Pretty much every weapon in TF2 had random cone.

Heavy miniguns, shotguns with random pattern, sniper SMG, even the medic syringe guns had spread.

I see the same here I dont see the argument till it should be randomdnized.

We have a cone for arms and the target for chest. Looks good why change it?

edit: so randon spread? that is crazy for a non team based fps which is what this is!

i dont play tf2 NOW but that is class based! Not so here if you do that **** , stupid and unnecessary!

Edited by Johnny Reb, 13 June 2013 - 11:08 PM.

[PEEFsmash]

90upznoobz, on 13 June 2013 - 11:00 PM, said:

I like the cone of fire idea, but I think it would need to be integrated with a nerfed alpha strike to be effective. Here's how I think it should be: When you alpha, the cone of fire instantly increases due to high recoil (seriously, 3-6 ppcs? Your mech will not be able to stand still). Then, it will take a while for your cone of fire to readjust and reduce to a pinpoint again. The recent usage and high heat of the barrel also causes the mech's cone to stay temporarily enlarged until it cools down. Also, by using multiple weapons at once, your system heats very quickly, and gains extra heat. The way we ensure that ppc, ac/20, gauss, MLL, etc. boats are limited is by increasing the current heat costs and creating a cone of fire when using alpha.

Recoil is the effect of projectiles leaving the barrel, and does not affect the shot itself. The most accurate sniper rifles in the world also have very high recoil.

Edited by PEEFsmash, 13 June 2013 - 11:05 PM.

[One Medic Army]

Johnny Reb, on 13 June 2013 - 11:04 PM, said:

I see the same here I dont see the argument till it should be randomdnized.

We have a cone for arms and the target for chest. Looks good why change it?

MWO has perfect accuracy for every weapon (not counting guided/spread weapons), excepting the random cone for jumpjetting mechs that's ticking off certain persons.

PEEFsmash, on 13 June 2013 - 11:04 PM, said:

Recoil is the effect of projectiles leaving the barrel, and does not affect the shot itself. The most accurate sniper rifles in the world also have very high recoil.

Um, recoil affects the bullet, since the recoil begins moving the rifle before the bullet leaves the barrel.
Specifically recoil is the "opposite and equal" part of the explosion which propels the bullet forward.
High powered sniper rifles use recoil compensation methods like bipods, recoil compensators, prone firing positions, and being really fracking heavy.

I've got a .308 I shoot sometimes, recoil definitely can spoil your aim.

Edited by One Medic Army, 13 June 2013 - 11:09 PM.

[Johnny Reb]

iF i WANT REALISEM i AM SURE i HAVE 4 GAMES TO PLAY