46 replies to this topic

[Mahws]

The Locust 1V is the mech that your first $20 gets you. Considering that it'll be available to everyone else on the exact same day and will only cost 1 Mil Cbills, what you're really getting is the skin and the 30%Cbill/10%Loyalty earning boost. And 3 mechbays. Which may sound attractive, but at the very, very best you'll be breaking even with how much you'd earn with any other light mech.

That's because the Locust 1V is;

A Spider 5K with:
16 points less CT armor.
8 Points less side torso armor.
8 Points less leg armor.
8 points less arm armor.
4 required out of engine heatsinks (making for a total of 4 or 12 slots taken and 1.2 effective heatsinks lost if using doubles)
No lower arm actuators.
No jumpjets.
4.5 tonnes less to spend on weapons/ammo/sinks.*

For context, the Locust-1V can't even fit a Large Laser and 4xMG. The best you can reasonably do with it is a MPL + 4MG or an AC/2 with a single tonne of ammo. PPC aren't an option as the energy hardpoint is CT.

The other Locust variants will be better when it comes to weapons (they have a fair amount of energy slots, or some energy + missile), but they still won't have the tonnage to make anything useful of them. Too few Heatsinks to boat energy, too few missiles to SRM effectively. And that's not even taking into account the paper thin armor.

The locust will be, without a shadow of a doubt, an incredibly inferior mech. No amount of size reduction (and judging by the current scaling there won't be much) will put it on equal footing to any other light mech. It may be fun to pilot (if you really enjoy the different shape of the cockpit) but trying to level it, let alone play with it will be a massive, massive grind of failure and frustration. You will definitely not be using it to grind CBills.

If you still think you'll enjoy it, or you want early access to the other Phoenix mechs then don't let me stop you, but for those still on the fence, have a good think about what your first $20 is going towards.


* Frame weighs one tonne less (2.0 compared to 3.0). Adding in savings from a XL170 compared to a XL255 (4.5 tonnes) makes for 5.5 tonnes saved with 10 tonnes weight difference.

Edited by Mahws, 25 June 2013 - 09:02 PM.

[MechFrog1]

Locust > Spider

[The Mechromancer]

The ONLY way I can see this mech justified over a spider is if it had a trait that gave it "turn on a dime" capabilities.

It would need it.

[Johnny Reb]

I am sure I can fit an erLL in it. 8 tons engine w hs, 2 ton structure, 3 tons armor, leaves me with 7 tons minus erll 5 tons, 2 tons for 2 mg/1 ton ammo. before endo or ff. Yeah I can do it. Also justified, care less over another mech!

Edited by Johnny Reb, 25 June 2013 - 11:38 PM.

[Zyzyx66]

Mahws, on 25 June 2013 - 08:56 PM, said:

...It may be fun to pilot...

Is it just me, or is this all that matters?

[Zongoose]

If you think you can fit an AC2 with a ton of ammo then you can fit an ER large and 2 machine guns in at least. I'm sure I can find another ton somewhere to get the 3rd and 4th machine gun too, either a small engine size drop, some armour stripped or something.

[Johnny Reb]

Zyzyx66, on 25 June 2013 - 11:37 PM, said:

Is it just me, or is this all that matters?

To some, its all that matters! The rest can go to hell!

edit: getting another .5 tons on this mech is very hard, if you want some armor. So ac2 is out!

Edited by Johnny Reb, 25 June 2013 - 11:42 PM.

[Skadi]

Battlemaster or bust.

[Johnny Reb]

I'm not stoked about the locus or the flea but will grind them out, at least 3 to basic then sell the one I don't keep. If I buy the phonix its pretty much if I want to keep another one. (doubt it)

[Mahws]

Johnny Reb, on 25 June 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

I am sure I can fit an erLL in it. 8 tons engine w hs, 2 ton structure, 3 tons armor, leaves me with 7 tons minus erll 5 tons, 2 tons for 2 mg/1 ton ammo. before endo or ff. Yeah I can do it. Also justified, care less over another mech!

Rightyo, now see the bit where I said 4 MG? Endo + FF will give you all of ~0.7 tonnes extra. Not enough for an LL+4MG with a tonne of ammo. And to do that you'd need to use single heatsinks because of the four externals required with a 170, which means your ERLL is going to overheat.

Zongoose, on 25 June 2013 - 11:38 PM, said:

If you think you can fit an AC2 with a ton of ammo then you can fit an ER large and 2 machine guns in at least. I'm sure I can find another ton somewhere to get the 3rd and 4th machine gun too, either a small engine size drop, some armour stripped or something.

Endo-Steel nets you another 0.5 tonnes. FF gets you another 0.2 or so, but you need to use single heatsinks to have the space. So you can fit 4xMG, with a single tonne of ammo between them with a LL if you sacrifice 10 points of armor and double heatsinks.

You can run 4xMG + LL with minimal ammo, overheating problems and even more paper thin armor than stock. Or you could run the most fragile and vulnerable mech in the game at less than 150/kph. Which considering you're liable to die in a single shot to any serious weapon system is a terrible idea.

Edited by Mahws, 26 June 2013 - 01:55 AM.

[arghmace]

Locust getting a 175 would certainly help it out a lot. The main problem with it is not having enough 2.0 engine sinks and thus having to cram in those nerfed 1.4 sinks that take out all the space. I really wish PGI would do something to the heat system. At least turn it the other way around so that engine sinks would be 1.4 and external sinks 2.0.

[Mahws]

A 175 would help, but it wouldn't save it. Even with only 3 double heatsinks you still can't fit them in with ES+FF with six slots of weapons.

Really if sub 30 tonne lights are to be even remotely viable there needs to be a rethink about external heatsinks for sub 250 engines. There's no reason whatsoever that smaller engines should be handicapped by external heatsinks. You're either sacrificing a tonne of speed in a light mech or significant speed and turn rate in a larger mech. Small engines are already a massive handicap without making them take up more room as well.

[Abaddun]

Granted the combat capabilities are mediocre, but the locust was designed as a reconnaissance mech which therefore implies it should be used like one, with a tag to aid missile boats though spotting /marking and mgs to clean up after a brawl. And I will be honest, the mech will curb the aggressive tendencies of many light pilots out there.

Edited by Abaddun, 26 June 2013 - 02:27 AM.

[Kissamies]

The lack of jump jets is the biggest, maybe the only real problem to me. Still, I really want a 20 ton light and being an iconic one helps too. I'm funny that way.

[stjobe]

Meh.

I'll pilot it, and I'll train for it in the Flea before that. I'll train for the Flea in my Commandos.

OP's line of reasoning ultimately leads to "why take anything but a 100-tonner".

Sure, if you want to compete in the top tiers, you should never drop in anything but a min-maxed Jenner or possibly a RVN-3L - if you *had* to drop in a light. If you had a choice you wouldn't drop in a light at all.

But competing in the top tiers is only one aspect of the game, and even for those who do it's not all they may want out of a game. Sometimes you just want to have some fun, and I think the Locust (and the Flea) will provide that fun in a big way.

[The Cheese]

Abaddun, on 26 June 2013 - 02:26 AM, said:

And I will be honest, the mech will curb the aggressive tendencies of many light pilots out there.

Nope. If the Locust doesn't suit someone's light mech play style, they'll just switch back to a mech that does. Same with any other class.

As much as I love the look and feel of the spindly little superlights, this one is going to be a pig to grind out.

Edited by The Cheese, 26 June 2013 - 03:25 AM.

[Huge]

I will not be grab dealing for a few reasons.

First off the Founder's program. Which was supposed to get MWO made. Had much much better incentives and the entire point was to get MWO influxed with enough cash to get finished.

Here we are a year later and the game is still in beta. Changes and patches are slower then honey in a jar during a Minnesota freeze. Massive meta imbalances are not addressed for weeks and months. Then to boot most of the money was spirited away to IGP and other projects instead of MWO.

So that is a big frigan hold up as far as I'm concerned. The entire idea seems like one massive cash grab since their Founder's gold is running low and they either lack the will,skill, or desire to actually put out a product they could get a steady cash revenue from. So they are hoping to rope in another round of suckers to pay for the hookers and blow for another year.

But back to the reasons why this deal is highway robbery.

No MC.

They made that mistake the first time. Gave so many of their core fans so much in game currency and then forgot to make a game and content worth spending it on. So we have grossly overpriced hero mechs and camos, All in hope to drain our banks so they can finally get us to buy MC again. A second round of that investors gold would mean another year of no new cash because I still doubt we'll have anything worth spending it on.


Also does anyone else think it is odd they do not allow you to select your mech? I think it is godamn hilarious because it shows they are pushing to sell Battlemasters for $80 because they know in their game. Assaults = King. So not only is it the most expensive option. They do not even allow you to pick it with the lowest pledge amount. Founder's you were given a choice, but as with the MC. They have learned from their past mistake.

Think of all the damage and potential that was inflicted and lost because of the mountain of money PGI got to sit on. I know it sounds cruel but an artist that isn't starving is an artist who is not making good art. They need to feel that desperation. They need to know the feeling of impeding failure of MWO because if they don't make a game worth playing within a reasonable timeframe. They will run out of money. Instead they will have another year of slide time. Which is great if you really really really like Garth, but hate good quality games.

In closing ask yourself this. If the last 3 months of PPC Armageddon was what they allow while we are still lacking CW and features promised a year ago. Would you grab deal Founders way back then? Why would you do it now with less rewards?

[stjobe]

For your $80 you get twelve 'mechs - four of which are basically Hero 'mechs. And you get the 'mechbays to hold all twelve.
You also get 90 days of premium, or 120 days if you order within a month.

That's pretty good value for money, actually.

And yes, they learned their lesson with Founders. If you let people pick, they'll pay the absolute minimum to get the heaviest 'mech available. Not good if you want to get the average tonnage of a match down.
And of course, if you give people MC, you won't sell any MC.

I can't say those two decisions are bad, they make absolute sense from a business perspective, and they don't really fly in the face of the customer either.

Personally, I bought the Overlord pack within seconds of loading the page for the first time. It was truly a no-brainer for me, despite the fact that I'm worried about the direction of the game and the balance issues it has.

Why? Because of three things:

• Firstly, they're Reseen. I've always missed some classic BattleMechs in MWO, and these are as classic as it gets.
  
• Secondly, I understand that development costs money. Lots of money. Those "mountains of money" you talk of is in actuality just a little bump. And to be frank, I mostly don't mind to help pay for this game.
  
• Finally, because I can. $80 isn't a large amount of money to me; I probably spend more on coffee every month. It's no sacrifice, and I don't have to abstain from something else do do it.

I fully understand the third reason isn't shared with everyone, or even that many, but the first and the second should be relate-able to by just anyone.

Edited by stjobe, 26 June 2013 - 03:53 AM.

[Deathlike]

Locust is DOA, w/o wasting much time on mechlabbin' it.

[zraven7]

For some people, the Lore behind the locust is reason to get it. That's a large part of all of these mechs: There is a large amount of Lore behind all of them.