109 replies to this topic

[SmoothCriminal]

PanzerMagier, on 26 June 2013 - 03:49 PM, said:

The newest trend on MWO forum. Complain about something before it it's actually in the game.

"Ultra ac10 is op, please nerf when you implement it!"

The nerve of some of these people.

There's a mech coming called a Timberwolf that's SO OP.

[Ralgas]

PanzerMagier, on 26 June 2013 - 03:49 PM, said:

The newest trend on MWO forum. Complain about something before it it's actually in the game.

"Ultra ac10 is op, please nerf when you implement it!"

The nerve of some of these people.

What's new about it? People have been complaining about clan tech they may never see and mechs based off ss's and no hard info for as long as i've been here

[General Taskeen]

PanzerMagier, on 26 June 2013 - 03:49 PM, said:

"Ultra ac10 is op, please nerf when you implement it!"

Because Full Damage AC's should be re-featured isn't complaining, its smart, its just plain foresight.

[Monky]

You're getting 1 pay variant and there will be at least 3 non pay variants.

I do agree that in a largely philosophical sense, and somewhat real sense, payed variants ARE pay to win. This has proven true with Ilya, and can prove true to even worse degree with other mechs, and is why I don't pay these guys money.

We're essentially one bad dev decision from pay 2 win. One overlooked combination of weapons that isn't otherwise possible and is incredibly powerful. The only arguement to the contrary that is practical is flooding the system with non payed variants to eventually allow overlap in terms of hardpoints (jaeger semi-counters ilya in being able to mount 3x UAC5/3x MLas).

[One Medic Army]

Monky, on 26 June 2013 - 04:49 PM, said:

You're getting 1 pay variant and there will be at least 3 non pay variants.

I do agree that in a largely philosophical sense, and somewhat real sense, payed variants ARE pay to win. This has proven true with Ilya, and can prove true to even worse degree with other mechs, and is why I don't pay these guys money.

We're essentially one bad dev decision from pay 2 win. One overlooked combination of weapons that isn't otherwise possible and is incredibly powerful. The only arguement to the contrary that is practical is flooding the system with non payed variants to eventually allow overlap in terms of hardpoints (jaeger semi-counters ilya in being able to mount 3x UAC5/3x MLas).

Just pointing out that the Phoenix mechs are going to be like the Founder's mechs.
Same hardpoints and hitboxes as the non-payed variant of the same designation, different skin and a 30% CBill boost (and 10% loyalty whatever that ends up doing).
They're not hero mechs.

Edited by One Medic Army, 26 June 2013 - 04:53 PM.

[EyeOne]

FupDup, on 26 June 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

3 ballistic, 3 missile, 1 energy. That makes for 1 ERPPC + 1 Gauss/AC/20. Nothing that an assault or heavy can't do better.

Or a Treb-7K for that matter

[Kaspirikay]

Lol you guys

[Gallowglas]

Monky, on 26 June 2013 - 04:49 PM, said:

You're getting 1 pay variant and there will be at least 3 non pay variants.

I do agree that in a largely philosophical sense, and somewhat real sense, payed variants ARE pay to win. This has proven true with Ilya, and can prove true to even worse degree with other mechs, and is why I don't pay these guys money.

We're essentially one bad dev decision from pay 2 win. One overlooked combination of weapons that isn't otherwise possible and is incredibly powerful. The only arguement to the contrary that is practical is flooding the system with non payed variants to eventually allow overlap in terms of hardpoints (jaeger semi-counters ilya in being able to mount 3x UAC5/3x MLas).

The rampant drumbeat of paranoia over p2w is probably my single biggest problem with f2p games. Yes, I absolutely understand the problem. Yes, I absolutely get the negative impact such systems have on gameplay. No, I don't want a p2w system any more than the next guy, despite having disposable entertainment money. On the other hand, there's really only so much daily hand-wringing, horse-beating, and jumping at shadow(hawk)s that I can take. In essence, anything they could possibly ever produce that makes money SOMEONE is going to claim is p2w.

[Monky]

One Medic Army, on 26 June 2013 - 04:53 PM, said:

Just pointing out that the Phoenix mechs are going to be like the Founder's mechs.
Same hardpoints and hitboxes as the non-payed variant of the same designation, different skin and a 30% CBill boost (and 10% loyalty whatever that ends up doing).
They're not hero mechs.

Interesting, what I read lead me to believe that they are indeed unique variants, but if that's the case then that is perfectly fine (indeed how I hoped 'hero' mechs would have been in the first place). If that's true, and MWO keeps making strides forward in balance, I may invest to show them that this approach IS viable.

[mack sabbath]

One Medic Army, on 26 June 2013 - 04:53 PM, said:

Just pointing out that the Phoenix mechs are going to be like the Founder's mechs.
Same hardpoints and hitboxes as the non-payed variant of the same designation, different skin and a 30% CBill boost (and 10% loyalty whatever that ends up doing).
They're not hero mechs.

And normally, a non-Founders variant is a better performer (HBK, anybody?).

[Monky]

Gallowglas, on 26 June 2013 - 05:03 PM, said:

The rampant drumbeat of paranoia over p2w is probably my single biggest problem with f2p games. Yes, I absolutely understand the problem. Yes, I absolutely get the negative impact such systems have on gameplay. No, I don't want a p2w system any more than the next guy, despite having disposable entertainment money. On the other hand, there's really only so much daily hand-wringing, horse-beating, and jumping at shadow(hawk)s that I can take. In essence, anything they could possibly ever produce that makes money SOMEONE is going to claim is p2w.

I totally get that, I try not to harp on it too much. But I have a hard-on for good game design and ethical monetization I guess.

[Bhael Fire]

Shadow Hawk is definitely going to be a great medium mech, but I don't think it's going to replace any of the other mediums. I'm pretty sure it'll have quirks that will make it unattractive to some people's individual fighting style.

[CancR]

Which is in part why there needs to be tonnage limits. With out it mechs that can take more in each weight category will be the only mechs we will continue to see

[Riffleman]

Your implying these new mechs will be good, when pgi's current strategy is "meak heug meck". I am seriously betting that the locust will be at minimum as tall as a hunchie, and the shadow hawk up to the atlas eyes.

[Sybreed]

only gripe about the new medium is that its torso ballistic HP will turn it into a better Hunchback... but it's not really the Shadow Hawk's fault, it's PGI's hardpoint system fault..

[Lynx7725]

Y'know, seriously? A Shadowhawk has never been seen as a top-tier 55 tonners in the boardgame. If it's considered... disruptive and P2W, imagine the QQ that will come when other, more popular 55 tonners come around.

[Chavette]

MustrumRidcully, on 26 June 2013 - 09:54 AM, said:

Because of reading comprehension?

It could of course be that the Hero/Phoenix version of the Shadow Hawk with its unique model is 25 % smaller than the non-heroic version, which would be a P2W advantage.

Maybe it actually looks like the shadow of a hawk, completely invisible at night even...

They are standard hero mechs. As p2w as those are.

[One Medic Army]

Chavette, on 26 June 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

They are standard hero mechs. As p2w as those are.

They're not even hero mechs, they're variants which will be available for CBills but with a custom skin and CBill/Loyalty bonus, same as with the Founder's mechs (aside from the Loyalty bonus obviously).

[Grimmnyr]

ryoma, on 26 June 2013 - 09:47 AM, said:

The Shadow Hawk seems like it it will disrupt medium power balance and be pay to win in that field. It has 5 tons on cents, hunchies, and trebs, jump jets, and it seems like it will have good hardpoints.

5 tons often means a lot in combat, so putting this mech behind a pay wall for a month is actually pay to win.

Sorry bud, 55 ton mechs were always in Battletech, I am not sure why it took PGI so long to add one, but looking at the Shadow Hawk, it was worth the wait. No mech is invincible, I see 100 ton Atlases (Yes Atlases, LOL) getting rolled by lighter mechs on a daily basis, so your argument holds no weight. Good Hunchback / Centurion / Cicada.... pilots will still be able to kill bad Shadow Hawk pilots as easily as any other mech.

Edited by Ed Steele, 26 June 2013 - 06:36 PM.

[Molachai]

verybad, on 26 June 2013 - 03:47 PM, said:

It's like reading responses at Yahoo...You feel dumber after you read them, but you can't stop...you just can't stop.

I wish this wasn't true but you hit the nail on the head. I just cant stop looking even though this and many of the threads here are completely fail.