90 replies to this topic

[danneskold]

I am fine with SSRM doing less damage than SRM - the guidance should take up warhead space - that is fine.

BUT - I like to run lights and mediums, and the hit locations, esp hitting the legs - it not worth it now. To really use streaks, you should, really, carry a BAP. Each SSRM launcher is heavier, and then the BAP. So for a Jenner D, I now have 3 tons of launcher, 1 ton of ammo, and 1.5 tons of BAP. That is 5.5 tons for a weapon that hits consistently, but all over. With the lower damage and spread, it now is not worth its weight.

Changes I suggest:

Remove legs from the equation - just weird, it should be going more for center mass.

OR

entire volley hits one target, using current random spread - at least you do meaningful damage to one section. It is weird to me each missile hits a different section. The SSRM is being hit twice with this - the launcher weights more - implying it is part of the guidance - and the missile hits for less damage - also part of the guidance. If that is the case, the entire volley would hit one section. If the missiles selected own target, then I could see the spread - BUT the launcher would not be heavier.

As it is - with the current mechanic, my D would be better off with 2x SRM 4. same space, weight is 4 tons, 1 ton ammo - I can put in another JJ. SSRM will quickly be replaced by SRM at this point.

[ShinVector]

danneskold, on 17 July 2013 - 06:54 AM, said:

I am fine with SSRM doing less damage than SRM - the guidance should take up warhead space - that is fine.

BUT - I like to run lights and mediums, and the hit locations, esp hitting the legs - it not worth it now. To really use streaks, you should, really, carry a BAP. Each SSRM launcher is heavier, and then the BAP. So for a Jenner D, I now have 3 tons of launcher, 1 ton of ammo, and 1.5 tons of BAP. That is 5.5 tons for a weapon that hits consistently, but all over. With the lower damage and spread, it now is not worth its weight.

Changes I suggest:

Remove legs from the equation - just weird, it should be going more for center mass.

OR

entire volley hits one target, using current random spread - at least you do meaningful damage to one section. It is weird to me each missile hits a different section. The SSRM is being hit twice with this - the launcher weights more - implying it is part of the guidance - and the missile hits for less damage - also part of the guidance. If that is the case, the entire volley would hit one section. If the missiles selected own target, then I could see the spread - BUT the launcher would not be heavier.

As it is - with the current mechanic, my D would be better off with 2x SRM 4. same space, weight is 4 tons, 1 ton ammo - I can put in another JJ. SSRM will quickly be replaced by SRM at this point.

Nah... Cuz it takes a lot of skill to use SRM consistently on a light mech.
Very very few pilots can do this effectively.. It has a lot to do with taking an enemy mech by surprise, off guard and running away.
The big issue is that 2xSRM4 generates quite a bit of heat for a light mechs so, you have to make every shot count.
Above I was talking about using SRMs versus slow big mechs.

Versus other light mechs, it is a totally different ball game which I have seen most effectively used by using corridors like in river city as traps.
There are still uses for Streaks in light mech vs light mechs battles but its role will be more of a support weapon now and your lasers will be the primary damage dealers.

Edited by ShinVector, 17 July 2013 - 07:08 AM.

[danneskold]

I disagree. I am not going to carry streaks in their current form in my D (or a 3L if I had one - or even my X5). I was not countering any of your points, just making my statement on what I see from SSRM mechanic as it is now. On my X5, drop BAP and SSRM and get 2 LL in there - dump some armor. On D, not sure, but probably get 2 SRM4, or some other variant. I will take the loss of hit for the higher damage, since the damage is spread all over by the streaks now anyway. The guaranteed hit is not worth it as is, unless the mech is faling apart anyway.

As is, the F is now again the king jenner (if it wasnt anyway, but the D had become a reasonable 2nd or rival with SSRM+BAP and 4 ML)

[IceSerpent]

I've tested SRMs quite a bit yesterday, IMHO SSRMs are now completely useless and regular SRMs are a bit tricky - they seem to be just right on a Cent, but ineffective on a splat cat (to the point where I can take a Cent against A1 1-on-1 and win easily). Not sure what exactly the deal is.

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Thank you for this amazing change PGI. Well done dev's. Finally brawling and strikers are back. Theres still work for you to do, but now finally the game is somewhat more balanced. Now I can finally run my balanced builds with srm's again... and have them be worth taking. Thank you so much, you have increased my enjoyment of the game.

[Deathlike]

I haven't tested SRMs thoroughly in this patch, but I believe they are fine and will be better when HSR is working as intended. Streaks however need a buff, considering the randomness that they currently do. Boost SSRMs to 2 damage per missile and it should be fine.

[ATao]

2.0 SRM damage is fine. Just right where it should be. Please don't break that again. PLEASE.

Hitboxes are somewhat weird though, on fastmoving light mechs especially. Crosshair goes red, I visually see a hit. target's armor blinks but damage is... like nothing. It's either small mech's borken hitboxes or SRM HSR problems.

Now that streaks spread more and AMS is +50% effective (since one of last patches) they are like old machine gun. I.e. damage is crap and too spread over the target. Imo SSRMs deserve 2.0 damage buff as well.

Edited by Alexander Malthus, 17 July 2013 - 01:29 PM.

[Cest7]

Sweet, brawling is back!

[Flying Blind]

Hit reg isn't all bad on little mechs, I shot a clean spider with 3 srm6 from my victor today and the little pest curled up and died. Was nice to see.

Edited by Flying Blind, 17 July 2013 - 01:54 PM.

[Razerbeast]

these weapons are too small and insignificant to actually think you're giving us something worth using now.

[ShinVector]

danneskold, on 17 July 2013 - 07:24 AM, said:

I disagree. I am not going to carry streaks in their current form in my D (or a 3L if I had one - or even my X5). I was not countering any of your points, just making my statement on what I see from SSRM mechanic as it is now. On my X5, drop BAP and SSRM and get 2 LL in there - dump some armor. On D, not sure, but probably get 2 SRM4, or some other variant. I will take the loss of hit for the higher damage, since the damage is spread all over by the streaks now anyway. The guaranteed hit is not worth it as is, unless the mech is faling apart anyway.

As is, the F is now again the king jenner (if it wasnt anyway, but the D had become a reasonable 2nd or rival with SSRM+BAP and 4 ML)

Too bad I am not playing right now to verify the Jenner F vs. Jenner D fight.
I still believe the Streak Jenner still has an advantage but not overpowerfully so, reason being is that dual Streak2s are very heat effecient weapons and you can fire them all day long (barring ammo constraints). BAP is not a requiement in this fight though.
The aim of streak now is to constantly support in stripping armour to help your 20 damage quad med laser burn right through critical parts eg. Legs !

Good luck with the SRMs by the way.. ;p

Alexander Malthus, on 17 July 2013 - 01:22 PM, said:

2.0 SRM damage is fine. Just right where it should be. Please don't break that again. PLEASE.

Hitboxes are somewhat weird though, on fastmoving light mechs especially. Crosshair goes red, I visually see a hit. target's armor blinks but damage is... like nothing. It's either small mech's borken hitboxes or SRM HSR problems.

Now that streaks spread more and AMS is +50% effective (since one of last patches) they are like old machine gun. I.e. damage is crap and too spread over the target. Imo SSRMs deserve 2.0 damage buff as well.

There are SSRM hit registration problems right ? Might not HSR, I believe more to be hitbox issues.
I even see this problem happening in Testing Grounds. What doe PGI support say ? "Oh it is the known problem where the paper doll where it doesn't update properly ! "
Yeah Right... ! Asked them to bring in armour point indicators into Testing Grounds so, we can verify this claim our selves !!

Edited by ShinVector, 17 July 2013 - 05:19 PM.

[Event Horizon]

Bravo! Well done PGI! My brawler is back in the action!

[Corvus Antaka]

im happy with SRM and SSRM changes. Brawling is definitely more viable. SSRM remains useful vs lights.

Now, where is my LBX-20?

[tigermaster]

deleted

Edited by tigermaster, 18 July 2013 - 01:31 AM.

[Ares Morgan]

Thank you for this patch i have had fun brawling the last 2 days and i think srm's are fine now, and please dont buff ssrm's they need to stay an anti light weapon not a main stay brawling weapon.

[Jam the Bam]

Liking the 2.0 damage, seems to be in a nice sweet-spot just now.

Now just to sort the hit reg for all the weapons....

[danneskold]

ShinVector, on 17 July 2013 - 05:15 PM, said:

Too bad I am not playing right now to verify the Jenner F vs. Jenner D fight.
I still believe the Streak Jenner still has an advantage but not overpowerfully so, reason being is that dual Streak2s are very heat effecient weapons and you can fire them all day long (barring ammo constraints). BAP is not a requiement in this fight though.
The aim of streak now is to constantly support in stripping armour to help your 20 damage quad med laser burn right through critical parts eg. Legs !

Good luck with the SRMs by the way.. ;p

Well, the SRMS will, no doubt, harm me in the light fight - but my SSRM on the D are fired against more large mechs than lights - just by the numbers on the field! Given that, I am better off to take the higher damage of the SRM for the weight I am carrying. And, while true the BAP is not needed when you fight Jenner vs Jenner - that is not the battlefield. With Spiders, ravens, and cicadas carrying ECM, you better have a BAP or your SSRMs are taken out of the fight. My point was about overall utility of the weapon vs all types. It will hurt vs lights, but the srm is now better vs all other chassis. The SSRM damage spread makes it weight not worth it.

That is what makes the F great - 6ML ( or 6SPL, whatever) - its weapons are not dependent on locks - its all you and your aim.

[TexAce]

Hey PGI notice how nobody is screaming bloody murder?! No one is yelling "SRMs are too OP / SRMs still too weak!"

See that? That's called balance.

Now just improve their hitdetection (its miserable) and buff SSRMs to 2dmg per missile and you balanced a complete weapon group for once!

[Blue Shadow]

fleshwoundNPG, on 16 July 2013 - 05:29 PM, said:

Making SSRMs less powerful than SRMs is not only fair, but far more realistic. Why? The guidance systems in the front of the SSRMs (and LRMs) take up space, therefore less space for a powerful warhead. Also SSRMs and LRMs need to be lighter for better maneuverability to hit moving targets.

SRMs need not worry about that and can therefore pack a bigger warhead and a much bigger punch.

Those of you still crying about SSRMs doing less damage, don't come back crying to us when a salvo of twin (...or more!) clan SSRM6s core your a$$ in the near future...

This! Streaks don't need more damage it makes sense the way it is now. Also SRMs are perfect and I like the direction of the new heat penalty system a few tweaks and it should be sweet.

[ShinVector]

Blue Shadow, on 18 July 2013 - 04:56 AM, said:

This! Streaks don't need more damage it makes sense the way it is now. Also SRMs are perfect and I like the direction of the new heat penalty system a few tweaks and it should be sweet.

It would be fair that SSRM2 be the only weapon that does damage below TT values. Even at 2.0 damage the random tracking will make it difficult to kill anyone with SSRMS.