152 replies to this topic

[Davers]

Sychodemus, on 12 June 2012 - 05:45 AM, said:

But, I do instinctively distrust anything that basically says, "That never happened" or, "Here's what really happened*" in regards to important events. Thankfully, BT has been pretty good about it unlike other franchises (I am looking at you, Highlander, and almost every superhero comic book ever written.)

What are you talking about? There was only one Highlander movie.

[Atlas3060]

I consider myself pretty die hard on the history of the game and the Universe spawned for it.
I've had plenty of arguments with people over the most little of things at times.
Yet here and now I sit and chuckle over the 7+ pages of responses because how many of us have altered the game?
Answer: Every one of us. Every little campaign we make, every alternate universe we craft (I've seen plenty on the Battletech forums), and every little design we make to "improve" something we've altered it.

And that's just fine, because we're allowed to do this. Yes this sounds nitpicky, but the point is whatever MWO does will not affect Battletech canon. The Line Developers (current and past) have stated this, because video games aren't in their control. Heck we can't even get minis for the MWO designs we see.

The game is non canon so we shouldn't worry too much about what they do. Yes I'll be one to admit if they start brining in talking sentient chickens flying warp shuttles or something silly like that I'd be upset. However I'd just simply uninstall the game and play against my friends with table top.

I trust Piranha because they go to Randall Bills and those in charge of Battletech for consultation and inspiration. We've got a huge Universe here and yes certain things might happen differently. At absolute worst the board game/books side might take inspiration (FedCom Civil War sourcebook talked about a Dresari family scuffle, but left it open if I remember, Carver V was talked about but still left open, and insert any other video game moments that were talked briefly but really don't impact much)

I'm taking this as a nice non canon game with digital friends on a digital table top. No different than if I were to remake the Universe's history with my friends at the actual table.

Now if you'll excuse me I have a Ghost Bear/Davion Alliance battle to fight with the lowly Capellan Wolves for the last bit of territory that isn't mine. *Evil laughter*

[Kazzamo]

If we can rewrite anything I'd like it to be the FedCom civil war. Long live the AFFC.

Edited by Kazzamo, 12 June 2012 - 08:42 AM.

[Atlas3060]

Kazzamo, on 12 June 2012 - 08:41 AM, said:

If we can rewrite anything I'd like it to be the FedCom civil war. Long live the AFFC.

*Fistbump* Amen to that soldier, long live the FedCom.

[Draelren]

After reading 3 pages of this.... I find all of this pointless, they've already said that it will stick to the major canon events, and we will only have minor control over various other systems and planets.

HOWEVER, having said that... I reject all of your realities and substitute my own.

All 20 clans invade, yes - even the Minnesota Tribe joins in. Widowmaker comes back too. Natasha was busy the last few years.

The IS is shattered, Clan Wolf becomes the ilClan. The End.

[SMDMadCow]

Maffa, on 11 June 2012 - 08:05 AM, said:

A dead IP.
I wonder why.

Maffa, on 11 June 2012 - 09:36 AM, said:

well, no. the game is yet to be released, last game was years ago, last TT manual god knows when, novels the same.

hhmmm... I think someone's google-fu is non-existant.
http://bg.battletech.com/?page_id=728

I guess ignorance isn't always bliss?

The IP has been alive and well for years thanks to TT players (yes Dark Age included).

[Insidious Johnson]

Welcome to FEBRUARY, 2012. This has SO been talked about before.

http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1

Search before post....

[Team Leader]

Michael Fury, on 11 June 2012 - 06:07 PM, said:

How are the books "obscure"? They've been around for 20 years. Sure, the first print run ones are long gone, and even the second print are hard to find. But just look online. I recently bought 6 out of the 12 Original FASA novels.

It's not like this is a collection of 10 books that were only available in Norway during their 4th blizzard of the year in 1783.. It's a ton of books that strech back 25 years or so. The first ones seem to be published in 1986.

Just because a very small minority of people own every book in the series ever, does not mean they are not obscure. In fact, I am quite certain if you asked a librarian, English major, literary scholar or whatever, they would not be familiar with BattleTech books. I can almost guarantee that in any average highschool or college with thousands of students, only a handful would have even heard of the books. And you can bet those 6-7 kids are not gonna exactly be the coolest kids on the block, to put it kindly. So please, anyone else who is a die-hard fan of Mechwarrior, stop trying to convince yourself that those books are not obscure. Im saying this earnestly, I am not trying to put people down here. If you like the books thats good for you, but they are not commonplace on most bookshelves is what Im saying.

Insidious Johnson, on 12 June 2012 - 05:08 PM, said:

Welcome to FEBRUARY, 2012. This has SO been talked about before.

http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1

Search before post....

27 replies vs 131 at this point sorry uh nothing I can do now

Edited by Team Leader, 12 June 2012 - 05:21 PM.

[Ogre Magi]

as it stands if this was not a BT game ask yourself teh question would there be as much interest in it??????

If so then rename it, Robot Jocks, gears, hammer slammers ect ect ect, and see how well it does. As a long time boardgamer playing these games from 1980 forward there have been a LOT of cool Mech related games that had great art, nice combat systems, neat game play ect ect that all ended up in the dollar discount bin at the hobby store.

Stray to far from Canon then you risk losing the large player base. Kill the goose and it stops laying eggs, ( See clicky tech Mechwarrior)

Nuff Said.

[Sychodemus]

The Battletech canon scares some people because it means they have to read.

There.

Can we stop now?

No?

'Kay.

[Insidious Johnson]

Team Leader, on 12 June 2012 - 05:19 PM, said:

Just because a very small minority of people own every book in the series ever, does not mean they are not obscure. In fact, I am quite certain if you asked a librarian, English major, literary scholar or whatever, they would not be familiar with BattleTech books. I can almost guarantee that in any average highschool or college with thousands of students, only a handful would have even heard of the books. And you can bet those 6-7 kids are not gonna exactly be the coolest kids on the block, to put it kindly. So please, anyone else who is a die-hard fan of Mechwarrior, stop trying to convince yourself that those books are not obscure.


27 replies vs 131 at this point sorry uh nothing I can do now

Gotcha. Didn't search, didn't care. The appearance of having an original thought more important than KNOWING. You are right, nothing you can do now. Not one thing. Welcome to plagerism. Enjoy your stay.

[BFalcon]

I think there's two degrees of "canon" we can look at here.

1) Major plots - these, like the Galahad Exercises and subsquent liberation of the Liao systems have already happened, but Clan victories that are mentioned in books (sourcebooks and novels, since they usually agree) and the like should go ahead as pre-planned - this will keep the general shape of the universe as we know it.

2) Minor plots, such as which precise systems fell as a secondary effect of the clan invasion, might be a good thing TO change.

For example, we don't want to flood the initial clan successes with every player on the server, but we DO want to have the pleasure of seeing (for example) some of Jade Falcon's systems turn back to Steiner hands, making their success a little less "absolute" than it was before - the only problem being that we just won't have the manpower to take on the major systems that Jade Falcon have fortified, so can't kick them out completely.

That preserves the main storyline, while letting players run riot...

[HighlandWolf]

Amarus Cameron, on 11 June 2012 - 03:37 AM, said:

We have been told multiple times that story events will be driven by the devs and important planets will NOT change hands, what opportunity is there for an alternate time line when the important things do not change. Maybe instead of complaining about this game being driven some 'obscure' books as you say you should read them and realize what you are saying before you say it. If you call the books something along those lines then it is obvious you never read them.

Pics for fun...








^just some obscure books that no one reads of course (also these pictures are months old, those are only 10 of my clusters worth of minis, and I have double the source books as ALL of the novels, including the sword and dagger)

Thanks for these pics, spent most of my time on this page going...read it, read it, read it, got it, got it, read it, got it, ..shelf, shelf, shelf, box, bedside cabinet, box, bedside cabinet, read it, got it..haha..yours look as well read as mine too

[Gidonihah]

Id be happy with some minor rewriting, like allowing secondary invading clans like Hell's Horses and Diamond sharks to play more of a role if players will them too. Or perhaps players successfuly defend/invade planet X during the clan Invasion despite what canon says.

Yknow stuff that shouldnt be predetermined cause we are the forces in the game. Stuff that players shouldnt have any effect on, is stuff like New mechs and weapons.
But I just cant imagine their being much point if we have no controll over the war in the grand scheme. (yay I won a battle but my sides destined to lose regardless that we win every battle)

[Frisk]

Skylarr, on 10 June 2012 - 07:29 PM, said:

no

There is no reason to rewrite the stuff that's been written... there is plenty of room to play within the current Battletech cannon. Now back to your cave, troll.

[Forscythe]

Frisk, on 12 June 2012 - 06:52 PM, said:

There is no reason to rewrite the stuff that's been written... there is plenty of room to play within the current Battletech cannon. Now back to your cave, troll.

I approve this message! The best way to make history is to write it yourself. You have the setting you have a giant community to sway. Write some Fan Fic you have until the invasion of the clans to write something awesome and generate a fan base. Then if all goes well find a publisher an editor and get it done.(over simplified I know) A year is a great buildup and the clan invasion is an awesome catalyst there is no reason that you cant find some story in there somewhere.

[Tincan Nightmare]

Thorn Hallis, on 12 June 2012 - 03:55 AM, said:

Lincoln Osis was first described as a mechwarrior (ComStar and Invading Clans sourcebooks), he was later retconned to be an Elemental.

At the introduction of the Clans, all second line units and the provisional garrison clustrers were outfitted with Star League era mechs without any Clantech (as seen in the Clan Wolf sourcebook). This was retconned once "true" Clan second line mechs were added.

Seriously! This is your gripe about rewritten history, with the dozens of sourcebooks and rulebooks and novels and TRO's! That they changed one characters role, and the issue about second line mechs? For that matter there are designs of older mechs like the victor where the only change was swapping out older weapons for modern clan models that show up in the record sheets books (Victor IIC I think is one) that shows that some Star League era mechs were still in service. That doesn't mean they could not have more capable second line machines around in addition to those mechs. Considering the long years BT has been around, consistency with the overall timeline and stories is really good, especially when compared with alot of other similar franchises.

[Jayboltz]

I wouldn't care either way. To be honest, there is a lot in the Btech canon that left me thinking "***?" For starters, the great houses; you've got your space Chinese, your space Japanese, your space America and your space Britain, etc. Woah so cool. I mean comon, you're going to tell me that entire quadrants of space spanning 500 lightyears in every direction has been colonzied, and they all share the same culture as one tiny little nation on Earth? It doesn't make sense.

Its like, "Ok everyone, we're going to colonize space! Now everyone from Japan has to colonize 1000 star systems in this direction, and everyone from China gets this part of the pie, and somehow we'll maintain these distinct cultural differences a thousand years later with the advent of faster-than-light travel being common place. Yeah thats right we're gonna walk around with katanas and pretend we're samurais in the 31st century!! Derp!"

[AceTimberwolf]

Jayboltz, on 12 June 2012 - 08:42 PM, said:

I wouldn't care either way. To be honest, there is a lot in the Btech canon that left me thinking "***?" For starters, the great houses; you've got your space Chinese, your space Japanese, your space America and your space Britain, etc. Woah so cool. I mean comon, you're going to tell me that entire quadrants of space spanning 500 lightyears in every direction has been colonzied, and they all share the same culture as one tiny little nation on Earth? It doesn't make sense.

Its like, "Ok everyone, we're going to colonize space! Now everyone from Japan has to colonize 1000 star systems in this direction, and everyone from China gets this part of the pie, and somehow we'll maintain these distinct cultural differences a thousand years later with the advent of faster-than-light travel being common place. Yeah thats right we're gonna walk around with katanas and pretend we're samurais in the 31st century!! Derp!"

Hell yea we are gonna pretend we are samurais in the 31st Century!!!

[TKG]

My thoughts on changing BT cannon...

Delete the jihad, Word of blake, and dark age.

No seriously that has been the stupidest thing to be added to battletech since well dare I say the phoenix project in which btw all the mechs are hideous garbage art-wise. The problem with everything from 3058 onward was simply that all the mech designs became more and more rediculous, and thus it was less about a joy of the game and more about wizkids grabbing for cash.


Edit for comments:

Jayboltz, on 12 June 2012 - 08:42 PM, said:

I wouldn't care either way. To be honest, there is a lot in the Btech canon that left me thinking "***?" For starters, the great houses; you've got your space Chinese, your space Japanese, your space America and your space Britain, etc. Woah so cool. I mean comon, you're going to tell me that entire quadrants of space spanning 500 lightyears in every direction has been colonzied, and they all share the same culture as one tiny little nation on Earth? It doesn't make sense.

Its like, "Ok everyone, we're going to colonize space! Now everyone from Japan has to colonize 1000 star systems in this direction, and everyone from China gets this part of the pie, and somehow we'll maintain these distinct cultural differences a thousand years later with the advent of faster-than-light travel being common place. Yeah thats right we're gonna walk around with katanas and pretend we're samurais in the 31st century!! Derp!"

The boundaries are not so well defined, inf act they're more or less centralized territories but there are many noted incidences of people of varied decents living within primary areas of other ethinic decent the Azami in the DC come to mind, Rassulhage is another...before they broke off that is.

Edited by TKG, 12 June 2012 - 10:18 PM.