341 replies to this topic

[Purlana]

If your a new player you benefit the most from joining a clan. At the point you start playing even other PUGs are going to stomp all over you until you start learning, and buy a non-trial mech that you can afford to customize...

Edited by Purlana, 29 July 2013 - 03:01 PM.

[Joseph Mallan]

DeadlyNerd, on 29 July 2013 - 02:54 PM, said:

Thing is, new players don't have the luxury us veterans do, that is, actual knowledge of how everything works. When you pit these newbies against stomping premades, you can guess who isn't going to have a good time (insert southpark meme).
Teamplay or not, the game has a legitimate deathmatch mode(capping is just a weak excuse), so actually allowing teams in there is breaking the basic rule.
I don't disagree with you, but am just pointing out why so many people are whining about this PuG v Premade thing.

Funny I had a good time learning and watching myself get better when I dropped into Beta.

[Aym]

Erghiez06, on 27 July 2013 - 03:11 PM, said:

tl:dr - (nutshell) Premades can render the game un-fun for others, and the state of communication in Pug games is too slow to give even a remote chance of countering a well organized premade.


I understand that this is a team based game, and that it is currently in Beta, but this is just ridiculous. Now I can't argue the effectiveness of such a tactic, or the possible fun. I have to be honest with myself and submit to the idea that I would most likely have enjoyed myself if I was on the other side of the fence, but I'd also have to be aware of how unbalanced and unfair this is.

This isn't as much a rant, or tantrum as it is a question of balance and concern for the current state of the game. Take for a moment the inability for our group to coordinate our efforts due to a lack of immediate communication options aside from third party software or services, which would of course require people to submit to the same unbalanced tactic. I Pug 99% of the games that I play. I've only played a handful of games with members found via the popular Teamspeak server advertised on these forums. It works, but it does take some time to find a group willing to knowingly take on a newer player. I've tried and I usually hear talk of things such as 'ELO' and whatnot. As a new player I had to look up what ELO was and why it was a concern, and of course once I understood what it was I couldn't argue.

I have to agree with alot of posters that due to the current state of the game premade groups should only be matched with other premades until there is a better form of in-game communication or the ability to choose your Mech while the game start is pending. Thats just me, but I find this sort of issue gamebreaking as it makes it un-fun and not playable at times.

[Tancred Radetzky]

As a new player, I could care less about voip or any other communications at the moment. The question I have for the more experienced is at what point does your targeting system actually hold on to the target and not jump around like a meth-addicted gerbil? When do your lasers actually hit what they are supposed to? I know it's possible, i've been the :30sec kill from deadly precise gauss rifles, PPCs and large lasers and the LRMs (let me not forget them). When do I get access to the upgrades that allow that sort of precision targeting? Yes, I pilot a Raven because I love it and know that if something hits me I'm dead, but I'm grasping at straws here for some reason as to why I can't do jack with any mech. (targeting seems to be borked for beginners from my limited perspective)

[Purlana]

Tancred Radetzky, on 29 July 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

When do I get access to the upgrades that allow that sort of precision targeting? Yes, I pilot a Raven because I love it and know that if something hits me I'm dead, but I'm grasping at straws here for some reason as to why I can't do jack with any mech. (targeting seems to be borked for beginners from my limited perspective)

There is nothing that upgrades your aim, if that is what your asking. Just practice more I guess...

Edited by Purlana, 29 July 2013 - 03:55 PM.

[JingleHell]

Tancred Radetzky, on 29 July 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

As a new player, I could care less about voip or any other communications at the moment. The question I have for the more experienced is at what point does your targeting system actually hold on to the target and not jump around like a meth-addicted gerbil? When do your lasers actually hit what they are supposed to? I know it's possible, i've been the :30sec kill from deadly precise gauss rifles, PPCs and large lasers and the LRMs (let me not forget them). When do I get access to the upgrades that allow that sort of precision targeting? Yes, I pilot a Raven because I love it and know that if something hits me I'm dead, but I'm grasping at straws here for some reason as to why I can't do jack with any mech. (targeting seems to be borked for beginners from my limited perspective)

There's the Arm reticle (Circle) and Torso reticle (Crosshair). The weapon menu on the right where you group weapons sorts by which reticle they shoot at.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

Why.
Why should players be required to join Voice Coms or a House/Merc Unit or face PUG stomp oblivion? New players are the lifeblood of any game yet some of you think they are simply there to pad your stats.

As a group player I do not want PUGs on my team, they are rarely able to contribute to the match in any meaningful way and usually end up wandering off to die alone.

As a PUG player I don’t want to face pre-made teams who skew the Matchmaker. I would much rather have 15 other equally skilled pilots and weight classes, rather than see the Matchmaker try to awkwardly balance teams around a premade group running all Assaults.

Clearly PGI has some concept of importance of segregating skill level or they wouldn’t have bothered to protect the 4-man teams from the 8-man teams. It is just a shame that MWO has lost so many new players because PGI insists on throwing them into the grinder.

I would love to see a unified team queue (8, 6, 5, 4, 3, or 2) and a solo queue. With that MWO would be fun when I want to have fun, and be competitive when I want to compete.

Edited by Agent 0 Fortune, 29 July 2013 - 04:02 PM.

[Aim64C]

Screech, on 29 July 2013 - 01:45 PM, said:

Crusader Kings 2 I didn't find too bad, though I did need to look up some feudal terms to get the succession lines right. But A-10 has to be the hardest game ever made. I really think calling it a game is a misnomer. I have never played it but I did watch this video and laughed my *** off.

Technically, it isn't a "game."

It is a simulator.

I was flying planes in simulators at the age of eight. Which is why I find the term "simulator" to address MechWarrior as ... well... lol. It's a simulator if you think Ace Combat even comes close in terms of aerodynamic simulation (obviously, aircraft don't carry 120+ missiles that fail to hit anything).

PGI should really take some hints from ARMA - it's gone about streamlining the core concepts of a simulator and offering "hardcore" and more casual modes of play without sacrificing too much either way. You can go from an arcade shooter like Call of Duty and transition quite well into the simulator shooter environment without being completely overwhelmed (though you will have to adjust your style of play because it's a simulator that doesn't pander to indiscriminate uses of dakka-dakka).

[PropagandaWar]

Tancred Radetzky, on 29 July 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

As a new player, I could care less about voip or any other communications at the moment. The question I have for the more experienced is at what point does your targeting system actually hold on to the target and not jump around like a meth-addicted gerbil? When do your lasers actually hit what they are supposed to? I know it's possible, i've been the :30sec kill from deadly precise gauss rifles, PPCs and large lasers and the LRMs (let me not forget them). When do I get access to the upgrades that allow that sort of precision targeting? Yes, I pilot a Raven because I love it and know that if something hits me I'm dead, but I'm grasping at straws here for some reason as to why I can't do jack with any mech. (targeting seems to be borked for beginners from my limited perspective)

are you moving? Are your arms and torso locked? Are you using a Joystick?. If no to first and yes to second third lifes going to be harder for you. What some people even vets seem to forget is this game takes time to get used to. Your going to lose a lot most likely while your finding out what your good with. I think the biggest problem with new players is they are in stuck in mechs nobody would play with. Instead of general good builds that anyone has these days they are stuck in garbage for the most part. The other thing is several games in and what is their first mech of choice usually? An assault. They are not easy to pilot and the builds at first are rough. So what you are essentially doing is taking 80-100 tons into the game and more than likely having a somewhat experienced player on the other side ready to nuke you. Get in a more nimble lighter mech at first and work from there. I just started piloting a victor. Been playing over a year. 2 games I had at a bit over 100 damage most well above 300. Yet some guys I play with who only pilot assaults get less than 100 all the time. I think I do better because I learned not to just sit there in my medium. It taught me how to move and work with the environment.

[Hellcat420]

Tancred Radetzky, on 29 July 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

As a new player, I could care less about voip or any other communications at the moment. The question I have for the more experienced is at what point does your targeting system actually hold on to the target and not jump around like a meth-addicted gerbil? When do your lasers actually hit what they are supposed to? I know it's possible, i've been the :30sec kill from deadly precise gauss rifles, PPCs and large lasers and the LRMs (let me not forget them). When do I get access to the upgrades that allow that sort of precision targeting? Yes, I pilot a Raven because I love it and know that if something hits me I'm dead, but I'm grasping at straws here for some reason as to why I can't do jack with any mech. (targeting seems to be borked for beginners from my limited perspective)

there is no form of autoaim in this game. your lasers hit where you are aiming when you pull the trigger(or hit the button).

[Erata]

Hellcat420, on 29 July 2013 - 04:08 PM, said:

there is no form of autoaim in this game. your lasers hit where you are aiming when you pull the trigger(or hit the button).

I aimed those streaks.

[Aim64C]

Tancred Radetzky, on 29 July 2013 - 03:50 PM, said:

As a new player, I could care less about voip or any other communications at the moment. The question I have for the more experienced is at what point does your targeting system actually hold on to the target and not jump around like a meth-addicted gerbil? When do your lasers actually hit what they are supposed to? I know it's possible, i've been the :30sec kill from deadly precise gauss rifles, PPCs and large lasers and the LRMs (let me not forget them). When do I get access to the upgrades that allow that sort of precision targeting? Yes, I pilot a Raven because I love it and know that if something hits me I'm dead, but I'm grasping at straws here for some reason as to why I can't do jack with any mech. (targeting seems to be borked for beginners from my limited perspective)

This sounds like it could be a bit of confusion regarding the reticule.

The circle represents where your arm-mounted weapons will fire to. The crosshairs represent where your torso weapons will fire to. Normally - those should be 'locked' together by default (threw me off when I launched into the test server - forgot that setting existed).

I don't recommend using arm lock. Countless studies have shown that you learn quicker in "sink or swim" situations rather than trying to put training wheels on. Your arms will adjust to your intended aim faster than your torso will - which is why your reticule will bounce around (though, honestly, I don't know if the Raven has full arm actuation or not).

I also recommend turning off throttle decay. You're better off learning to roll through a move with your momentum than forgetting to hold down a key during an engagement and realizing that you've come to a screeching halt in the worst possible place.

Those are better options to set for specific builds rather than to use as training ****.

I'm not sure if you're trying to use a joystick with this game - but I recommend you use a mouse. It may be more difficult to manage multiple weapon groups, depending upon what mouse you have - but I tend to stick to two main weapon groups that I have mapped to right and left mouse button with chain-fire being selectively activated on one or the other when necessary.

I tried to use a joystick with this game and immediately threw that idea out the window. It's just not responsive enough - and when it is - it's not precise enough. I might have to play around with it, again, some day - but I've found the mouse to be far more intuitive and just cleaner to use.

Lasers should always go exactly where you're pointing. Torso-mounted lasers will go straight to the middle of the cross-hairs while arm-mounted lasers will go straight to the circular indicator.

This is why PGI needs a tutorial... even if it's something as simple as respawning "dolls" in the "Testing Grounds" with a raw text output that goes through some explanations of the UI concepts, the basic controls, and the basic elements of combat (the 'dolls' don't even need to shoot back for you to understand that the opponent is going to be trying to do the same to you).

Anything is better than throwing them into the middle of a game with little loading tips referencing features that don't currently exist in the game.

[Mystere]

DeadlyNerd, on 29 July 2013 - 02:54 PM, said:

Teamplay or not, the game has a legitimate deathmatch mode(capping is just a weak excuse) ....

I will just have to disagree with this one. This game has no TDM and capping is a very legitimate win condition, whether you like it or not.

[New Day]

I'd like a free for all mode (Solaris).

Edited by NamesAreStupid, 29 July 2013 - 05:36 PM.

[MaxStr]

Mystere, on 29 July 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

Have you tried Dark Souls? Now that's a hell of a hard game as far as I am concerned.

Haha, what are the odds I see this post right after taking a break from Dark Souls

[Fugu]

I for one would like servers. Don't like the people you are up against? Switch the server! Worked in CS for ages and nobody is complaining about this kind of stuff there.

[Zylo]

Greyfyl, on 29 July 2013 - 08:38 AM, said:

I don't think anyone is blaming the people grouping for the problem, they are simply asking PGI to fix the balance issues created by premades. This has been beat to death, if PGI wants to cater to the small number of people that will go on teamspeak or vent, then that is their right. I don't get it at all considering how easy it would be for them to remedy, but at the end of the day I think they WANT the premade players to feel special.

And really who cares whether you would see a premade tag at the beginning or at the end - as long as it's visible it doesn't matter.

Didn't PGI state that most players run in groups now? Sure, that doesn't mean they are all in TS but it seems logical that the pre-made population might actually be larger than the solo population that never groups.

The pre-made balance issues would have been very easy to fix without the Elo BS we currently have to deal with. Similar size pre-made group per team, any size allowed for grouping. Since both teams have a similar size pre-made group the pre-made issue is now balanced.

Instead of an easy fix everyone had to deal with phases of matchmaker and sync-drop exploting by 2x groups of 4 who were afraid to try the 8-man pre-made games and this chased off both solo and small group players.

[Roland]

The bigger issue caused by the current travesty of a matchmaking system is that there were a bunch of groups that had more than four and less than exactly eight players much of the time.

And those folks, instead of getting more people to play and growing the game population, just quit and went to play games that let them play with their friends.

[Zylo]

Roland, on 29 July 2013 - 07:45 PM, said:

The bigger issue caused by the current travesty of a matchmaking system is that there were a bunch of groups that had more than four and less than exactly eight players much of the time.

And those folks, instead of getting more people to play and growing the game population, just quit and went to play games that let them play with their friends.

I have to agree there, losing the flexible group sizes between 2 and 8 really just made things more difficult for group players. Many chose to quit due to the limits of no more than 4 or exactly 8.

Others were very angry and decided the solo players needed to be punished for causing the group size limits and those players ended up casing off both solo and small group players by using sync-drop exploits.

Removing the flexible group size was never a good move by PGI. It would have been so easy to match similar size groups against each other. The game population would have been far greater as a result.

[I am]

This is a great idea. MWO definitely needs bigger 4mans. Can't see any unintended negative consequences there...

How'd that go over when open beta began? Must have inspired tremendous community growth.