FupDup, on 29 July 2013 - 09:09 AM, said:
Ultimate solution: add in an extra firing mode that is a variation of chain-fire, but without the 0.5 second delay. Or, maybe even allow the player to set the firing delay themselves from the mechlab.
I could agree with that. It would create the same kind of effect as the macro, but completely in the game. It would solve the problem and debate (and feelings) so that anyone can do it too. Without resorting to loading up their whole weapon bar to specifically create the macro in a long, difficult manner, like this quote:
Dracol, on 29 July 2013 - 09:26 AM, said:
The macro only replaces a technique that can be done manually. I run a trip AC/2 dakka dragon and replicate the macro manually thusly: Fire group 1 has 1 AC/2 and is on the lmb Fire group 3 has a differant AC/2 and is on the mouse wheel button Fire group 2 has all three AC/2's and is on the rmb In quick succession I hit lmb, mouse wheel button, and then hold down the rmb. Due to their refire rates and with no chain fire selected, the rmb will fire each AC/2 as it reloads, creating a dakka dakka dakka firing pattern. Now, if the macro allowed one the ability to do something beyond what normally can be done, then I'd say Yes ban them. But it does not, it only makes it easier.... it's the same with my throttle controller.... I can turn, adjust speed, target, and change view modes simultaniously. I could do it with a keyboard, but its a pain in the ***.
Macros do that, with only taking one weapon group and no run around gimics to achieve the desired effect. But do you have a trick to get an UAC5 to fire rapid fire without having a chance of jamming because you slow it down from chain fire (or just as soon as it is ready to fire again) timing? Don't know about you, but I tried UAC5. Sometimes I'll get 5 shots before a jam, most times I jam after the first shot and don't even get a second till it unjams. A macro could/would be programed to only permit you to shoot the UAC5 when it is safe and can't jam, while retaining as much of it's rapid fire abilities as possible.
As far as what your user interface is capable of over a more standard interface, it still requires you to move buttons and know how the system works. The joystick doesn't take your state of view and auto change it to look at the nearest threat. It just places the buttons to change your view and other abilities into a more convenient location. If you wished, you could do that manually with a keyboard instead of working with the default configuration. The game has that built right on in.
Agent 0 Fortune, on 29 July 2013 - 09:15 AM, said:
Chain fring AC2s isn't the issue. The issue is being hit with 16-20 DPS. Every second you are being shot you are taking 20 damage (in the case of 5x AC2). If you want to figure out how powerful that is, get on smurfy's and start stacking weapons and see what it takes to get to 20 DPS. (hint: it is a lot more than 9 medium lasers, more than 6 PPCs, and double 2x AC20) I'm not suggesting there is anything wrong with AC2, I am just pointing out that the reason they wrecks mechs has nothing to do with a 3rd party macro.
I've felt that DPS, and a Macro makes it hurt more than a group fired or normal chain fire of the weapons. A normal chain fire will slow down the DPS (unless you preform the work around mentioned by someone else). A burst fire will cause the DPS to stay the same, while causing 10 damage (for x5 like your example) to one place if you hit. The Macro lets you chain fire quickly while at the same time letting you lead your target, blind slower targets with smoke (that's a lot of smoke that doesn't let up) among other advantages.
And I recall some people complaining about LRM hits blinding one with too much smoke. AC2s seem to be getting this, but not when used in group fire or normal chain fire modes.
KuruptU4Fun, on 29 July 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:
Ok, first of all, try using a search function before creating a brand new thread that has been that has been talked to death. Second. PGI has stated categorically that as long as any outside software (IE Macros) do NOT change the server based statistics for weapons or mechs (IE an Aimbot) and only remain on the computer of the person connected to the game. Then they will not stop us from using them. So despite your feelings which you are certainly entitled to. Your opinion isn't going to change it. Third, where in the rulebooks has it stated that they do not have software that can or cannot allow chain firing of weapons?
So, I could respond to a thread that's been dead for months, instead of creating a freash thread in a forum website that has plenty of room for more threads as needed or desired? I can't bring a different approach to the subject? I'm not suppose to ask others their opinion on the subject, just because someone else did months ago? If not even older than that? And how many "ECM is bad" threads did we see? All at once?
So, I understand that. There is a reason I'm asking what others think on the subject. If we have enough people with a shared opinion on the matter, we could approach PGI and ask politely if they have/could or are considering an in game approach to duplicate the same abilities as these out of game, 3rd party macro programs. I feel if they are going to allow it, then they should try (eventually/have it in the works/be considering it) to place it into the game. That way, no one needs to get an untrusted program to gain the benefits of other players.
If you want to take a lore approach to it, they (from what I read in novels, as my knowledge of TT is limited) typically made a lot of small weapon groupings. ACs also typically stippled a target with a small burst of fire. They never mention in the novels that there was non-stop AC fire from a single mech. (ACs also tended to have more of a burst fire than a single shot, but that depended upon the AC itself. Some did a burst of fire, others did a single shot. It was then rated into class by damage it caused in x amount of time and range.)
Mystere, on 29 July 2013 - 09:24 AM, said:
What's so difficult about rhythmically pressing 1234 on the keyboard to get the same effect as a macro? FYI, when I use one or more AC2s, I specifically use it for it's blinding effect against a heavily armed opponent. So your issue is really with the weapon itself and not macros. That is also why I sometimes want to stream LRMs/SRMs instead of firing them in big groups. It's called suppressive fire.
If I'm moving fast and dodging, I can't press 1234 and move at the same time. But I do understand what you are saying. It's like having 1234 on a 4 button mouse. However, you still can't shoot as fast as that Macro can. It just isn't manually humanly possible. Maybe if it can be done with a combo of different chain fire groups... or the gimic like the Dragon pilot above... But not having it base in game while others have access to it by a macro that is never intended to be in the game, just seems like it's not quite right.
A single AC2 doesn't produce enough blinding smoke to be of a problem. It's the macro speed of several AC2s that produce a shake like how the AC2s used to, combined with intense smoke. I've been completely unable to see or aim against such a mech in my Quickdraw before. I couldn't even fight back, and was too slow to run. I might have been able to handle it better, but with that match, it just wasn't working for me.
I've chain fired my LRMs often to cause a nice rain of fire upon my foes. It's not for smoke, but for suppression fire. Once the warnings go off, people tend to want to hide. I understand the suppression fire. I've used AC2s to force someone into hiding, because they saw themselves taking damage and couldn't understand where it was coming from.
Apparently, for a "dead" topic that I could have "searched" for a preexisting thread, it's getting a lot of attention here. Maybe a new thread was needed?
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