114 replies to this topic

[Kobold]

That is a risk you need to choose for yourself. I pretty much decided as soon as I saw the gameplay videos that I'd be happy to spend it. If you are far more cautious, then don't spend it.

[Henchman 24]

Firefly....buddy you aren't the only old school sort that still has trouble with the newer concept of [beta=not finished enough to be called 1.0]+[please spend money on it].

It's one of those cases of frog/frypan....the first dev that got away with it and managed to attract scads of people willing to throw money at them, set the precedent, and undercut the integrity of beta vs. it's ready for consumption for cash.

This unfortunately is the new trend among new devs, and I still think it blurs the lines of value too much in some cases.

That all said....PGI has been working hard to please this community, it's evident. For a determination of value....I believe they have the interests of the IP, fans, and themselves balanced in such a way as to make this work well, and be a good value.

Not only that, like others hinted at, it's an investment in something we all love, and an investment in the future of the game...if they cannot hit the ground running, and show positive numbers....that clan invasion will be a long way off for sure.

Put another way....I'm sure we've all spent 60 bucks on worse values in our lives, none of which had the potential to last as long as well.
You could do far worse for your money I believe.

I had to justify this too, the economy sucks, and some of us who shouldn't probably spend money on a game right now, well....it's friggin Mechwarrior! and we want it.
Some things are worth it. And compared to the budget fests I've been playing lately(low cash)....this game is a no brainer to pull the trigger on.

I don't know if this helps, it just seemed things weren't addressing your need, just the post.

[Murphy7]

Firefly, on 12 June 2012 - 10:09 AM, said:

Okay. Really. I think some people are missing my point. Sorry to sound rude (too late) but please allow me to spell it out in small words.

*IF* you want the Founders package. You have to pay sixty dollars for a Founders package. Before you really play the game. At all. Unless you managed to get one of the rare beta invites. That's my point.

I must be one of the few people who actually thinks very thoroughly about dropping a fair amount of money on a product sight unseen (unplayed). Unfortunately this seems to happen all too often in online gaming these days. If you don't care about your money's worth, okay.

All I'm saying is, it seems like a silly idea for those who've not played the game. I refuse to confirm or deny whether I'm in that boat.

Understood you just fine, clarifying the language a bit.

Back in the day, playable demos for games were more common, and gave you exactly this chance to see if your computer was up to snuff, if the gameplay was the kind of thing you were looking for, etc. With these MMO style games, the closest you get to this is an open beta, which seems to be increasinly more common these days.

It is up to each player to make a judgement based on their perceived value of the game whether the $60 or $30 for the Founder's package is worth their investment - a very reasonable, responsible decision to make.

Speaking for myself - I was ready to buy Mechwarrior 5 when it was announced, provided my computer was able to handle it. But that would be an order of operations issue for me, because I have been holding off on a significant computer purchase based on a few things, of which Mechwarrior 5 was a significant component. As I got closer, on looking for Mechwarrior 5 I find Mechwarrior Online instead, very much like what I see so far, and am willing to purchase an Elite Founder's pack regardless of prior beta access. Your concerns and relative value on this may vary. It is entirely possible I could be deeply disappointed with this choice, but it is my choice to make.

And I for one do not care to be catagorized as to not caring how I am going to be spending this money. I expect other people have certainly given this some thought as well. Just because you may not feel it is worth the risk is not the same as others just being foolish with their money.

Decide for yourself, and please try to do so without denigrating the choices of others.

[Firefly]

Henchman 24, on 12 June 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Firefly....buddy you aren't the only old school sort that still has trouble with the newer concept of [beta=not finished enough to be called 1.0]+[please spend money on it].

It's one of those cases of frog/frypan....the first dev that got away with it and managed to attract scads of people willing to throw money at them, set the precedent, and undercut the integrity of beta vs. it's ready for consumption for cash.

This unfortunately is the new trend among new devs, and I still think it blurs the lines of value too much in some cases.

That all said....PGI has been working hard to please this community, it's evident. For a determination of value....I believe they have the interests of the IP, fans, and themselves balanced in such a way as to make this work well, and be a good value.

Not only that, like others hinted at, it's an investment in something we all love, and an investment in the future of the game...if they cannot hit the ground running, and show positive numbers....that clan invasion will be a long way off for sure.

Put another way....I'm sure we've all spent 60 bucks on worse values in our lives, none of which had the potential to last as long as well.
You could do far worse for your money I believe.

I had to justify this too, the economy sucks, and some of us who shouldn't probably spend money on a game right now, well....it's friggin Mechwarrior! and we want it.
Some things are worth it. And compared to the budget fests I've been playing lately(low cash)....this game is a no brainer to pull the trigger on.

I don't know if this helps, it just seemed things weren't addressing your need, just the post.

You've pretty much hit the nail on the head and I'm happy that someone gets what I'm saying.

Yeah - it's MechWarrior. And without a 'Mech title since what, 2002? most of us are clamouring for one. I hate to sound like the naysayer because I'm a hardcore 'Mech enthusiast. I really don't wanna be that guy. But come on - asking people to invest sixty dollars before they even get a chance to play? I dunno, it just seems a little far-fetched. I wanted to make sure I wasn't the only one thinking that.

Anyone who feels like they can't make their own choice in life, kindly keep your smart remarks to yourself. I'm not suggesting you follow my course of action, nor am I trying to change your mind. This is for me. If you decide it's for you, it's thoroughly without my assistance.

[Lucius Prospero]

If sixty dollars is a large amount of money to you, just wait and play it when it's free?

[Major Tom]

Welcome to the new world of video game developement.
Both Star Wars: the Old Republic and The Secret World, two games I follow(ed), offered Pre Sales that included beta access and early access, and both offered them before the monthly supbscription price was set. That means people put down their hard earned cash (sometiems collector or delux cash) for a game before then even know the quality or monthly cost.

The good news about this game is you can find out for free if you want to play or invest, the bad news you have to pay if you want a sneek peek. Pesonally I know I will be able to milk $60 (or $30) of value out of this game, but I'm still going to PGIs feet to the fire, I don't want them slacking off just because they have some money in the bank.

Edited by Major Tom, 12 June 2012 - 11:45 AM.

[QuantumStorm]

Russ Bullock, on 12 June 2012 - 09:28 AM, said:

This is pretty much it here...early access people get from Founders will come before open beta. it is also important to note that Open beta for our product means that anyone anywhere can now download and play the game it is not restricted in any way.

While I admit this wasn't the answer I was hoping for I am grateful for the clarification. Thank You.

With that being said may I ask how long exactly Founders Packs will be available? I am at the point unless something changes before then I will most likely be waiting for Open Beta. But that is more a moral choice than a requirement. the 60$ price tag is fortunately for me of no consequence. But I understand for others that isn't the case.

But I'll be honest I truly do hope the founders will still be available during open. Because not being able to get it after trying the game would really be seen by me personally as someone saying something akin to You must Choose between these option and no you have no time to think.

I have no problem waiting for the open beta. And while I have to be honest I would be sad to do so lol. I accept that is the way you choose to do it. But if I a told I am going to have my options limited by not purchasing without what I would consider acceptable levels of knowledge in hand. I would feel like I would have to morally take a pass at the game all together. I have always bought the CE's of most games for the extra in game goodies generally. Least if the CE's had extra in-game goodies. But there are certain marketing practices that I just cannot endorse or support.

So how long after Open Beta will we have to still purchase the Founders Packs or will we not have any chance at all?

[Scott]

The Founders Pack is an investment in the product, regardless of actual enjoyment or quality. There are plenty of people willing to play for it for various reasons, without playing the game. If you are on the fence about purchasing one, the Founders pack is not targeted to you. Just wait until the game is openly released and play for free. If you enjoy it, there will be opportunities within the game later to make financial purchases.

[Veevslav]

There is competition in gaming. I am seriously looking at the $120 founders pack and dont want wont spend a dime until I have seen the game and had a chance to give it a test run. A weekend of open play would give that experience. It would also give a good server stress test which is something the devs should really be looking at. There is a big difference between an artificial lab stress test and a real stress test. If the devs dont realize this then the game will probably never be worth playing because the net code will be garbage and non optimized, the servers will probably remain over burdened because the simulators in the labs said it should be fine..... and the list goes on.....

There are so many games available to play already and lots of games waiting to come out that burning a wad of cash on this game without any preplay to see if it is something I want to play in the long run would just be stupid and irresponsible.

I have spent a lot of money on world of tanks and am content over there, but I do like the mechwarrior universe and depending on how the game is laid out it could provide hundreds of hours of fun. But there is always the potential for play style issues, bad f2p implmentation and all the different variances into a games development. Plus Planetside 2 is waiting in the wings......
For me no test run means I wont be buying the founders pack. Further it probably means I will scrub my hands of the game.
If I dont buy the founders pack I wont be investing in the game since I would probably end up with a non buyers remorse later on if the game is good since the founders packs look like a really good deal.

As to the guy that talked about costs earlier on, there are a couple types of people in the world, those that understand the real value of things to themselves and those that dont. There are also those that can make ends meet and thrive with a family of 5 making $27k a year and those that cant make ends meet earning 127K a year. I fall into the first category in both those instances because I am selective in my spending habits and valuations.

WerewolfX, on 12 June 2012 - 09:40 AM, said:

Same concept as pre-ordering a game. and for this to be a "Collector's Edition" of sorts my money will be spent on this soon to be fine peice of software.

pre-order puts you out $5 if the game sucks..... This is 60-120.......
Big names and prior titles doesnt mean a game will be good......

Russ Bullock, on 12 June 2012 - 09:28 AM, said:

This is pretty much it here...early access people get from Founders will come before open beta. it is also important to note that Open beta for our product means that anyone anywhere can now download and play the game it is not restricted in any way.

What no stress test weekends?
Betas usually mean character wipes.... Open betas mean everyone can play it but expect a character wipe at the end of it.

I love the f2p model, that being said make sure your company understands it and the % of people that will spend money on a f2p game vs the number of people actually playing the game.
Further please dont isolate yourselves from a large % of people that express interest in your product but want a test drive before investing.
Either way I have told you my position on your game and my willingness to invest in it as long as I can test run it beforehand. It could be 2 hours for a stress test as long as I can actually play the game before throwing down my cash.

Still MWO needs to take some lessons from WOT.

The open beta of the English version of the game was launched on January 27, 2011;^[26] the official release was scheduled for April 12, 2011.^[27]
The World of Tanks pre-orders were scheduled to be available for the American and European clusters before the game release.^[28]
World of Tanks was released on April 12, 2011 in Europe and North America.^[29]
http://en.wikipedia....ks#cite_note-27

Pre-orderes are the same as founder packages for all intent.....

Scott, on 12 June 2012 - 03:10 PM, said:

The Founders Pack is an investment in the product, regardless of actual enjoyment or quality. There are plenty of people willing to play for it for various reasons, without playing the game. If you are on the fence about purchasing one, the Founders pack is not targeted to you. Just wait until the game is openly released and play for free. If you enjoy it, there will be opportunities within the game later to make financial purchases.

A reason so many get scammed is they justify everything as an "investment".... As I said, the founders pack could be a great deal. I wish I had known about world of tanks earlier so I could have bought their founders pack. AS it stands I came to that game 3 months too late.

Edited by Veevslav, 01 July 2012 - 09:41 AM.

[Sunflare]

Veevslav, on 01 July 2012 - 08:57 AM, said:

There is competition in gaming. I am seriously looking at the $120 founders pack and dont want wont spend a dime until I have seen the game and had a chance to give it a test run. A weekend of open play would give that experience. It would also give a good server stress test which is something the devs should really be looking at. There is a big difference between an artificial lab stress test and a real stress test. If the devs dont realize this then the game will probably never be worth playing because the net code will be garbage and non optimized, the servers will probably remain over burdened because the simulators in the labs said it should be fine..... and the list goes on.....

There are so many games available to play already and lots of games waiting to come out that burning a wad of cash on this game without any preplay to see if it is something I want to play in the long run would just be stupid and irresponsible.

I have spent a lot of money on world of tanks and am content over there, but I do like the mechwarrior universe and depending on how the game is laid out it could provide hundreds of hours of fun. But there is always the potential for play style issues, bad f2p implmentation and all the different variances into a games development. Plus Planetside 2 is waiting in the wings......
For me no test run means I wont be buying the founders pack. Further it probably means I will scrub my hands of the game.
If I dont buy the founders pack I wont be investing in the game since I would probably end up with a non buyers remorse later on if the game is good since the founders packs look like a really good deal.

As to the guy that talked about costs earlier on, there are a couple types of people in the world, those that understand the real value of things to themselves and those that dont. There are also those that can make ends meet and thrive with a family of 5 making $27k a year and those that cant make ends meet earning 127K a year. I fall into the first category in both those instances because I am selective in my spending habits and valuations.


pre-order puts you out $5 if the game sucks..... This is 60-120.......
Big names and prior titles doesnt mean a game will be good......

Im with you Veevslav!! I am a huge Battletech fan and have played all the battletech/mechwarrior games. I am dying to give these people my money. That said I refuse to give them a cent untill I see the game and if the founders packs are gone after open beta I will more than likely not play at all as I will always feel like Im playing with one foot in the hole. WoT did it right with closed beta/open beta/prerelease packages. Everyone KNEW what they were buying into. Also I have yet to hear anymore about the strategic element of the game. For me I want to see the innersphere and how the houses will be fighting against each other. One thing lacking in WoT is a point to the battles. Clan Wars is a sad pathetic joke. Lets hear about the other part of the game DEVs!!

Overall this is very poor marketing and I think they are losing alot of money if they had just waited until after open beta. I can count atleast 10 guys I play with that feel the same way as I do.

Edited by Sunflare, 01 July 2012 - 09:33 AM.

[Rolan26]

seriously, i think their marketing was great. You think the 6k ppl who bought Legendary and 4k ppl who bought elites would have bought them if they couldn't get guaranteed access to the game before open beta? True, i dun like them holding that over us but they are making a proper Mechwarrior game after a decade of no mech. The founders package are rewards for ppl having faith in PGI with only bits of info and some gameplay footage to go along, and i doubt they will be on sale after Aug 7.

[Khloros]

Looking at all these post you can see one common trend...with or without buying the Founders package...WE ALL WANT TO PLAY!!!!! Those with the spare cash, have the option to play early....those who don't can read the posts as the Founders go though the Beta-Zone and help the developers find and fix the bugs before the full release as we hammer the armour off our opponents in advance, getting ready to lay the smack down on those who choose to wait and become early cannon fodder.

Think about it, paying $120.00 bucks for a game we have all wanted to play online seems a small price to pay, To help you who are undecided if you what to get a jump on the mech brawling....a date with the woman to pay for a founders package can be switched from Red Lobster to the McD's value menu or a nice home cooked Mac and Cheese...both options save you money...and don't take a lot of gamming time away when its time to play.

No moral dilemmas, nor irresponsibility, it is enthusiasm and hysteria to play this title. Free or working a few extra hours to play early, I'm looking forward to getting a jump on smacking around some Jenners and Huntchbacks.

If you still can't bring yourself to forking out even $30 to give it a whirl and take a risk at having fun, think about what you spend in the average week on coffee of junk food...you're probably half way there to being a founder. Still find it too much money to fork out.....might be time for a better paying job.

[Celldoor]

i have read all info that i can locate online and still feel like a mushroom. so much plain out guessing at facts by future possible players is crazy. my reference to a mushroom is common with new games. so many little bits of info released by admin makes feel like i am in dark and being given little bits of bullcrap to survive off of. many include quotes that help loads but still little is really known and changes daily..

[NegativeX]

Can't wait.

[PewPew]

Firely, I feel you man. Most early purchase options come out after reasonable gameplay information has been released. I'm thinking maybe they will eventually release more videos and info. A prerelease this early may just be to test the waters and collect some data on how many foam-mouthed fans they have with no regard for money.

[Darq]

Russ Bullock, on 12 June 2012 - 09:28 AM, said:

This is pretty much it here...early access people get from Founders will come before open beta. it is also important to note that Open beta for our product means that anyone anywhere can now download and play the game it is not restricted in any way.

I thought it had been said that we would keep any gains made during Early Access - that after that point the founders would be active and wouldnt be wiped?

[Jess Hazen]

QuantumStorm, on 12 June 2012 - 08:50 AM, said:

I am just curious if this game will be followoing the usual progression of Closed Beta > Open Beta > Live Early Access (Founders packs) > Live I ask because I do want to purchase a Founders Pack if the game is good enough to warrant it. But Since I am assuming no closed beta just due to the numbers of people who want vrs spots available. I am really relying on an open beta to ascertain if this game is worth the pack. Without a Open Beta I have to wait till the game goes live and am not sure if the founders will be available after it goes live.

no sorry this is not the order. early access implies that access is still limited. open beta means that the game is available to everyone.

[Zynk]

Russ Bullock, on 12 June 2012 - 09:28 AM, said:

This is pretty much it here...early access people get from Founders will come before open beta. it is also important to note that Open beta for our product means that anyone anywhere can now download and play the game it is not restricted in any way.

Firefly, on 12 June 2012 - 09:37 AM, said:

So, just to clarify... to make sure I'm reading this right... people are expected to fork over their hard-earned megabux (let's face it, sixty dollars in this economy for a video game option is a lot) for Founders package/early access *BEFORE* getting into Open Beta. Do I have that right?

YES and BTW you spent $120.

[Sunflare]

Rolan26, on 01 July 2012 - 09:52 AM, said:

seriously, i think their marketing was great. You think the 6k ppl who bought Legendary and 4k ppl who bought elites would have bought them if they couldn't get guaranteed access to the game before open beta? True, i dun like them holding that over us but they are making a proper Mechwarrior game after a decade of no mech. The founders package are rewards for ppl having faith in PGI with only bits of info and some gameplay footage to go along, and i doubt they will be on sale after Aug 7.

People like you Rolan will buy in no matter what. The early option is icing on the cake. Its the other things in the founders packs that make them worth 120 smackers. The maketing sucks because they could have had alot MORE people laying down the cash if they had waited till after open beta so people knew what they were getting. As it is they are absolutly LOSING sales becaus of this. Its not that most of us dont have cash....I WANT to give them my money......but all we want is to see what we are getting first.

As for this being a PROPER mechwarrior/battletech game waits to be seen. For all I know its another steaming pile of crap. Very little info and they ALREADY want my money..........

P.S. for those of you living in your parents basement makeing 8 an hour stop insulting those of us not willing to waste money on a game we have not seen. We have plenty of money BECAUSE we dont waste it.

[Kobold]

PewPew, on 01 July 2012 - 10:11 AM, said:

Firely, I feel you man. Most early purchase options come out after reasonable gameplay information has been released.

There has already been quite a bit of information released, including gameplay videos. Many games don't even have that, just relying on pre-rendered CGI trailers.