142 replies to this topic

[Team Leader]

Well, I got the Phoenix pack, only the $20 one though, before Paul had a stroke of "genius" and they cut this cbill thing... I dont think its a good direction for them to be making in the meta. So yeah, im a f2p gamer now. If they undo all this malarkey I might go up to the $60 pack.. idk.. we will see. I hope they fix third person view too. By fix I mean put in a real tutorial instead.

[KuruptU4Fun]

Team Leader, on 10 August 2013 - 12:43 PM, said:

I hope they fix third person view too. By fix I mean put in a real tutorial instead.

I'd agree to that..

[Danny Crane]

With Premium, Founder mechs and Hero mechs, it was taking me a somewhat long time to have enough money to buy a mech and equip it. Right now there are several mechs in my bays that are sharing engines because I don't have the cBills. With the patch it is even harder.

Something no one has mentioned is MC use for things other than Premium time and Hero mechs, as if thoes purchases are the only things that make PGI money. What about all the other things?

I don't sell mechs, I buy a new slot. Now along with that new mech in my staple, there is a chance I might buy some paint or camo for that new mech. More money for PGI. Now, with this patch, it feel like it will take me a lot more days between having enough money to buy a new mech. Even if I were to break down and buy stock mechs with MC (which is something I will NEVER do), It will still take me forever to outfit it the way I would want.

For me, the longer it takes me to get a new toy in a game to play with, the less I feel like playing the game.

[Shifty Eyes]

I've always felt that the monetazation was a little off in MWO. MC price for Hero mechs (and even regular mechs) are astronomical when converted to $$$, a couple of MC mech purchases would by you an entire AAA game title in some cases. They're never getting any mech purchases or premium time out of me with these prices. I might do a mech bay or two, when the time comes.

Edited by Shifty Eyes, 11 August 2013 - 12:01 AM.

[Ralgas]

Team Leader, on 10 August 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

this is freakin candy crush and if you spend money on those sort of mobile games you must have more money than sense

(i really, REALLY hate monetized mobile games, sorry)

Which is THE real problem, unless you're churning out the episodic sequel of a very profitable proven franchise or cross platforming (see limiting control and detail options) the big publishers don't want to know. I hope to god star citizen doesn't faceplant massively as before long noone will be trusting or backing a "aaa" title again and we're back to praying the backers that be agree with our gaming tastes.

the apple store, steam, xbox live, and monetized mobile apps are killing the pc genre and in response the genre is turning to this drip fed f2p model because getting 10 subs to spend $5-10 is far easier than getting 1 to pay $60-100.

[Zerberus]

KuruptU4Fun, on 09 August 2013 - 03:51 PM, said:

Play Candy Crush Saga and see just how much a game can be monetized...

Or take a look at Plants vs Zombie 2

I`m not a fan of the nerf, but tbh I don`t reallyfeel much effect from it..... probably becasue the lion`s share of my income has always been savior kills and assists... I dare say it may even have gone up a little....

It does however make me want my 4 phoenix mechs now and not in October, though

Edited by Zerberus, 11 August 2013 - 03:04 AM.

[AntharPrime]

Simple, I don't buy mechs with real money and the faster I get cbills, the faster I buy mechbays. Before I'd say I was buying mechbays on average of 1 every 2 weeks now I'm forced to slow down with my cbill earnings and I might only be buying mechbays once every 4 weeks or more.

Edited by AntharPrime, 11 August 2013 - 06:52 AM.

[ztac]

It's funny ... I have a whole host of F2P games that have got to be just extortionate and then unenjoyable (grindfest), these games now occupy a blank part on my hardrive!

I am beginning to wonder how long before this game ends up there too? Incidently once I finished playing those games I have no desire to ever play them again, despite numerous offers of free currency and ingame items, I know them for what they have become.

This game if PGI are not very careful will end up down that road, they have already started the journey :- lower C-Bill earnings (even with premium account too), Time sinks to lower your hourly earning capacity (larger maps, longer capping time , weapon nerfs, time matchmaker takes to find/load a game and get it started (secret C-Bill nerf , well it would be except the player base can work it out, seems we are not as dumb as PGI hoped)).

But then there are already other enjoyable aspects to this game too ...... insane matchmaking system .

[scJazz]

WARNING: Wall of Text with Maths!

TL;DR: CBill earnings dropped by roughly 40% and XP by 13%

So I missed the first few days of the Aug 6th patch because I was sick. I didn't even get a chance to log on to the forums for about a week. So I got back Friday night and read up on the patch. I noticed the change to Match Earnings and realized I was well positioned to get a clear picture of the change after doing a bunch of Maths.

I do not own a Hero mech, I'm not a founder, and I've only played with the one free day of Premium Time. In other words there is very little skewing my match statistics. 32 matches of Premium Time and 25 matches of Cadet Bonus, 57 skewed match results out of a sample size of 1612 matches or 3.5% of my matches.

I was going to wait to gather a much larger sample before I posted, but this morning when I started entering match data into OOCalc it dawned on me (coffee must have taken effect) that the samples I had were closely correlated with pre-Aug 6th patch data. So I decided what the heck I'll post now and update later if serious changes in my results start showing.

Controls: I used the same mechs that I always use in basically similar fashion. I played as always using ANY match. I played as always as a solo PUG. Insofar as I can detect there is no bias.

Probable Bias: It does seem like Finding a Match is taking longer overall but since there is no way of measuring the wait time without a stopwatch and serious tedium I'm ignoring this factor.

What I found so far is as follows...
16 Matches recorded
1 Fake Win Match added to normalize my data. The data for this is an average of the other wins.
Sample size 17 matches

Average CBills Pre-Patch: 78,384.61
Average CBills Post-Patch: 79,238.76
Percentage Change: +1.1%

Average XP Pre-Patch: 347.18
Average XP Post-Patch: 515.12
Percentage Change: +48.4%

Average Match Time Pre-Patch: 5:10
Average Match Time Post-Patch: 8:48
Percentage Change: +70.3%

Simulated Earnings for 1 Hour of Play Pre-Patch: 910,272.89
Simulated Earnings for 1 Hour of Play Post-Patch: 540264.27
Percentage Change: -40.6%

Simulated XP for 1 Hour of Play Pre-Patch: 4031.77
Simulated XP for 1 Hour of Play Post-Patch: 3512.18
Percentage Change: -12.9%

I've been writing this post for quite awhile now so I'm not going to enter the sample data, etc right now.

[Rasc4l]

I like the reduction. They should do the same for XP. People get new mechs too easily and master them too fast. I know I'm quite alone with this opinion but I just think these things should take longer. That would also filter the most impatient from the playerbase, which I only see as a good thing.

[Druidika]

Rasc4l, on 11 August 2013 - 07:45 AM, said:

I like the reduction. They should do the same for XP. People get new mechs too easily and master them too fast. I know I'm quite alone with this opinion but I just think these things should take longer. That would also filter the most impatient from the playerbase, which I only see as a good thing.

Yeah, reduce the size of the player base, that's exactly what's needed in a niche game.

[KingKalvin]

Paul needs you to buy credits to use premium time thats why

[Sarsaparilla Kid]

Danny Crane, on 10 August 2013 - 09:44 PM, said:

With Premium, Founder mechs and Hero mechs, it was taking me a somewhat long time to have enough money to buy a mech and equip it. Right now there are several mechs in my bays that are sharing engines because I don't have the cBills. With the patch it is even harder.

Something no one has mentioned is MC use for things other than Premium time and Hero mechs, as if thoes purchases are the only things that make PGI money. What about all the other things?

I don't sell mechs, I buy a new slot. Now along with that new mech in my staple, there is a chance I might buy some paint or camo for that new mech. More money for PGI. Now, with this patch, it feel like it will take me a lot more days between having enough money to buy a new mech. Even if I were to break down and buy stock mechs with MC (which is something I will NEVER do), It will still take me forever to outfit it the way I would want.

For me, the longer it takes me to get a new toy in a game to play with, the less I feel like playing the game.

There are some good points here...if PGI was really interested in making more money themselves, why do they not have modules and upgrades with a MC purchase option? Because the C-bill cost of those items remains high, players are going to take longer to focus on the mechs they already have and not buy new ones, which means they don't need to spend MC on mechbays or new colors. The only reason I can see they went in this direction, then, is to have more players buy Premium Time to earn C-bills faster, or to use MC to buy new mechs and save their C-bills for upgrades. Because I'm a casual player and have frequent connection issues, Premium Time is not economical for me, so I've gone the second route since I started playing a few months ago.

[CarnifexMaximus]

Its funny, just before they went to 12v12 I was thinking that if they go to a 2 mech a month release schedule my cbill earnings would not be sustainable to be buying 6 mechs a month.

For the most part, I have had some premium time on my account. Now that I make less I will never purchase it again. Theres no point, it's now a massive grind no matter what.

Even with a hero mech and premium I still can't touch pre 12v12 numbers (with one random exception: I had a 329,xxx cbill match in a muromets Wednesday).

I don't like having to run heroes to make cbills. The game starts to feel like a grind because I feel obligated to pilot a certain mech regardless if I enjoy playing it or not. I dont enjoy myself as much. I can't even guarantee old level earnings with a hero and premium time so it's pointless.

And what's up with salvage bonuses? Is there an actual explanation as to why it went down from anywhere from 20,000 - 60,000/ match to (for me) 9,000 - 10,000?

I really hope this is all a big misunderstanding and not intentional. Furthermore, I take it PGI has not communicated anything on this topic?

[Leafia Barrett]

KuruptU4Fun, on 10 August 2013 - 12:33 PM, said:

Then that by all means is your opinion, and you are entitled to it. Thereby giving you every right to not spend money on this game to promote it's continued existence. So expect that your opinion is going to be put on a back burner because you are among the hundreds of thousands of F2P gamers, and not consumers. Which do you think ANY F2P dev is going to work with when it comes to making a game better? I (and in the past you) were interested in the future of this game. As such PGI paid some attention. Now that both of us are apprehensive in doing so, we are no longer investing in their future, just benefiting from the current state of it.

So tell me, with how slow it is to get anywhere in the game, what incentive do new players have to stick around at all, let alone spend money on the game?

[Mark Brandhauber]

I agree this nerf doesn't largely affect closed beta players used to winning alot (apart from Salvage bonus which has dropped more than 60%). I do feel it will ultimately turn off new players, who are no sure whether they want to spend any of their RL money in game after realising the huge earning drop after the cadet bonus.

However I do feel we are not in full possession of the Facts, The C-bills we are earning now are in the limited form of the game we currently have i.e. a beta; with many modes missing and no community warfare to speak of. How loyalty points will benefit us has not been made clear, what other bonus'es we get from community warfare (reduced mechs/weapon/engine cost) has also not been made clear.
An official response from PGI would be nice something to make this pill a little easier to swallow.
Once again PGI I want you too succeed
Please respond

[KuruptU4Fun]

Leafia Barrett, on 11 August 2013 - 08:49 AM, said:

So tell me, with how slow it is to get anywhere in the game, what incentive do new players have to stick around at all, let alone spend money on the game?

Top I can only tell you how games like this and others make money. Not speculate as to what new players see in the way of incentive to invest in this game. Do I want new players to see a value? Yes I do, I'd like to see this game continue on.

[Purlana]

PGI doesn't understand your forum posts. Speak with your wallet, not with your keyboard.

[MonkeyDCecil]

Sir Wulfrick, on 09 August 2013 - 04:52 PM, said:

Is there a point to this argument? If we still had re-arm & repair costs I could see the point, but even a loss gains money for a player. It seems that the argument is build on the premis that any given match must provide a certain minimum amount of CB. Why is that the case? So now we have 12 v 12 it takes longer to earn enough CB to purchase item X. So what?

So what! Are you kidding me. So now it take twice as much time for me to get X item. That is a big difference to me. I do not have a lot of time just to play a game. That is the reason I use premium time and hero mechs. Now I just don't know. I enjoy the game, but part of the fun is buying new mechs and gutting them and rebuilding them. Now it will take me twice as much time to do so. And that sucks, it is like a punch in the gut. I also think that every match should give a minimum of CBs. I would say a 100,000 CB minimum for a match, even if you lose. If a game is not worth my time then I don't play. Not sure how long this game will be worth my time. Double to get what i used to. BS

[Angel of Annihilation]

Another thing I don't understand. I realize that some people have 200 million banked but there are now at least 113 variants we know are in the game or will be in the game when we take into account Project Phoenix and what has already been announced. Now I know those guys with 200 million don't have 80+ mechs in their stable so even they weren't earning enough C-bills to keep up with all the mechs available.

That being the case, why do we need a reduction in C-bills. It is not like we have a real economy where people are trading C-bills for items so rampant inflation is not an issue. Also we definately have more mechs available to us than the C-bills we can earn and more comming out so it isn't like we don't have anything we can spend C-bills on.

Also there a ton of potential for more C-bill sinks in the future. How about C-bills for a Merc Company Drop Ship or expanding the colors you can buy with C-bills.

The point is, we already have a upside down economy where there is alot more you can buy than you can earn so all a reduction does it make the game more painful and less fun. Having to play a week each time I want to buy a new variant is going to get old really fast.

Lastly, someone brought up the wanting the Phoenix Package now and I wanted to say...I am 100% with you. I am slightly bored and want some new mechs but now can't afford them. It would be really nice to get my Overlord pack so I would have 12 shiny new mechs to play WHILE I saved up enough C-bills to start progressing again.