85 replies to this topic

[MeiSooHaityu]

I was called a noob the other night because I accidentally cored a teammate by shooting him in the back... Funny thing is, he was the noob

If I am firing at a target about 500m out, and you run into my field of view, directly from the side where I can't see you, RIGHT IN FRONT OF ME (easily less than 50m from me, took up almost my entire screen), and I kill you...don't blame me. Your battle field awareness is TERRIBLE. I am firing at a mech lobbing shots at me, I can't turn to see if a light MIGHT run DIRECTLY IN FRONT OF MY FIRE LINE! .

Point is, people are always going to throw noob and learn to play (even when you did nothing wrong). Hell, I should have been angry because he cost me points and C-Bills.

It's the internet, people will throw insults and say dumb stuff because they are annonymous. It has always been, always will be.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

"Noobs" are simply players without access alcohol. Alcohol is the reason we are bad, the reason we rage, and the reason we forgive.

[James The Fox Dixon]

lockwoodx, on 19 August 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

"Noobs" are simply players without access alcohol. Alcohol is the reason we are bad, the reason we rage, and the reason we forgive.

Except in the case of Wulffemein... he gets better the more he drinks....

[A banana in the tailpipe]

James The Fox Dixon, on 19 August 2013 - 08:12 AM, said:

Except in the case of Wulffemein... he gets better the more he drinks....

Since he has access to alcohol, he's not a noob!

[James The Fox Dixon]

lockwoodx, on 19 August 2013 - 08:13 AM, said:

Since he has access to alcohol, he's not a noob!

True, but for most people drinking makes them get worse. With him, the drunker he gets the better he gets. I recall one time, back in closed beta, he had drank pretty much a case of beer and was slurring his words on TS. We dropped into a match and he got a total of 6 kills that match in a Commando... This was after he kept running in the center of the enemy team and other idiotic stuff.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

James The Fox Dixon, on 19 August 2013 - 08:16 AM, said:

True, but for most people drinking makes them get worse. With him, the drunker he gets the better he gets. I recall one time, back in closed beta, he had drank pretty much a case of beer and was slurring his words on TS. We dropped into a match and he got a total of 6 kills that match in a Commando... This was after he kept running in the center of the enemy team and other idiotic stuff.

Friendly Fire, the patron god of drunks.

[Datenight]

Disastisfaction with the ELO system aside, I think the call for civility ought to stand. Also, I think it's worth remembering that none of us know our ELO scores, so it's hard to say whether we're getting paired inappropriately or not. I think the decision to assign an average ELO score to new players is reasonable. Otherwise some experienced players may roll a new account and use the early matches to unfairly dominate.

Livewyr, on 19 August 2013 - 04:07 AM, said:

1: OP: your intent is correct. (however, I would appreciate it if you didn't use a lost mechwarrior pilot as a guilt chip. It doesn't add anything and frankly it is insulting on multiple levels.)

Opinion respected, and for the record I made two edits to my OP, one where I took it out, and another where I put it back. Ultimately, I thought it was worth remembering that there may be people we would deeply regret verbally abusing if we knew who they were.

[Damon Howe]

Datenight, on 18 August 2013 - 05:00 PM, said:

Community -
Twice this weekend I introduced new players to MWO. Both of them spent a goodly portion of their matches noobtarding it up, in spite of my gentle instructions and suggestions. Both players were then subjected to berating, whining, and otherwise off-putting commentary from their teammates.

It's bad enough I have to apologize for a UI (come on UI 2.0!) that's full of quirks and personality that we veterans know how to navigate without knowing we know how to navigate, but now I have to apologize for those guys too.

Stop this now before we turn this into League of Legends. That guy you're about to call a noob might just be, in fact, a new player, struggling to learn the interface and digest what's going on. It might've been Sarah.

You do realize that is far too late for that, and we've been worse than LoL for...hmmm...when did open Beta start again?

Noobs will be noobs; there's nothing we can do t help them until they decide to get on TS and actually get walked through and properly taught many things ( you really can't explain a whole lot in chat in game) there's no hope for them, and endless frustration for us. No that it's their fault, mind you.

At the end of the day, there's this: If you're a vet, chill out (which you won't, but every now and then I feel the need to say it once). If you're a noob, honestly the best policy is to friend a couple people, start dropping with them, ask who they drop with and start learning. You have more fun with more people....unless its 12 mans...

[K Storm]

If you're one of those players that gets frustrated about newbies to such a level that the game is "ruined" for you, then I have news for you... it's a 1st world problem. You're playing a game that's in beta (note I said "GAME" and "BETA"). So this goes out to everyone with anger management and spoiled brat issues (yes, I mean everyone who complains openly to or about new players) - [Redacted] - you might want to see a therapist about your REAL problems, too.

Now... let's see how many so-called self-proclaimed "veterans" who think they deserve better are offended by my reply. I'm sure we'll be seeing their posts soon, lol!

Edited by Niko Snow, 19 August 2013 - 10:46 AM.

[Ensaine]

Try being a GM of an MMO guild for 9+ years across two different MMO's..... you DO learn patience........but.......

I do occasionally get irritated at n00bish play. I also have, in the past, offered to help anyone out, anytime, just by PM'ing me, and getting Teamspeak. I do NOT do typing chat.

The really big issue, is the pre-game new player experience. There is none. It's absurd to not have a training level. Like CoD.

"There is the pistol. Pick up the pistol (Use Space to pick up items). Shoot the pistol (Use Mouse 1 to shoot). Reload the pistol. Shoot the DO with the pistol. Run to next room. Pick up grenade. Throw grenade at DO in case you missed with the pistol. Run to next room. Climb the rope ......."

The game is more about proper mech navigation than it is fighting. In said training level, there can be some navigation basics, the importance of hitting R drilled home, etc, and Bitching Betty can do the voices, so no NPC's are needed.

Fixes a lot of problems. I'd sit through it just to see how thorough it is.

But....

To anyone 'training n00bs', if you're not drilling home the importance of hitting R, you're not really helping. Too often I spectate ( I never leave matches until done) people not hitting R. They're at the fringe of any action, no one is coming to help, and no LRM's can be fired because this person isn't hitting a damned key. Not to mention the fact that that fat red box helps newer players target better. But this guy misses more than hits, because he doesn't hit R.

Lastly, and here's the rub, this IS based on FPS play. Most FPS communities I've ever been a part of, from original Quakeworld, through CounterStrike to Unreal++ and on, well, those communities are rough places to put it mildly. If a new p0layer gets into a good clan, well, there's hope, but, by and large, in an FPS playstyle game, they can be brutal. It's like decades of tradition.

So though it's not the new players fault that they don't know 1/10th of they really need to know, I paid my dues long ago with the n00b thing. I don't know how to fix it and keep it fixed. I expect it to get even more terse once real competitive play comes out, not get better.

Also gotta remember, there are quite a few younger, quick to jump types playing. Me, I'm an old guy, the one telling new players to TURN OFF ZOOM WHEN UP CLOSE in chat once I'm dead

[mack sabbath]

Now with the currency issues and having to be stingier with earnings, it's WAAAY easier to get frustrated at a team that blatantly refuses to do what a couple experienced players ask them to do to win.

If I've died, I even explain the reason I'm asking you to, for example, "touch" the enemy base to pull squirrel chasers to our hounds.

Long losing streaks + losing wages on wins = rage at times, and I am the Prince of Ashtray Spilling Outbursts!

[Egomane]

Niko Snow, on 19 August 2013 - 10:44 AM, said:

As this thread is discussing Player behaviour, moving to the Barracks.
Please remember to avoid Name & Shame

Niko... if you say you move it, you should actually move it...

*push* come on thread ... move! *pull*

there... done!

[Sir Wulfrick]

Perhaps we should all remember that new players (I hate the negative connotation attached to the word n00b - we've all damned well been there, every one of us) are the life blood of MWO. Without them the game will wither and die. Frankly some of the verbal treatment I've seen directed towards new players by individuals who ought to know better has been disgusting. Insults, threats, racism even. I though the MWO community of all places would be better than that, but apparently not. I'd like to think that MWO isn't 4chan, however closely it resembles it some times.

[Kunae]

Sir Wulfrick, on 19 August 2013 - 11:12 AM, said:

Perhaps we should all remember that new players (I hate the negative connotation attached to the word n00b - we've all damned well been there, every one of us) are the life blood of MWO. Without them the game will wither and die. Frankly some of the verbal treatment I've seen directed towards new players by individuals who ought to know better has been disgusting. Insults, threats, racism even. I though the MWO community of all places would be better than that, but apparently not. I'd like to think that MWO isn't 4chan, however closely it resembles it some times.

Firstly, from earlier in this thread:

Kunae, on 19 August 2013 - 05:31 AM, said:

Always please remember that there is a difference between "newbie"/"newb" and "noob".

Newb/Newbie is someone new to the game. Then there are Noobs, who aren't new to the game but act like they are.

Newbies can be forgiven, we were all newbs at some point. Noobs should be derided and laughed at, and deserve nothing but scorn.

Second, people need to grow a thicker skin. I am not condoning the more over the top levels of stupid, that you might see once in every 1000 games, but just being called an id=10T, is not cause to come whining to the forums.

"Oh boo-hoo, someone called me a bad name, someone must punish them because it hewt my widdle feewings.". Seriously? There are other threads, here in the Barracks, where people are doing just that. Crying because someone said they were a bad player... Really? Grow up already.

[Garth Erlam]

Profiteer, on 18 August 2013 - 08:10 PM, said:

As long as PGI insist on lumping newbs with vets via the ELO system, frustrations will lead to QQ on both sides of the fence. Imagine if sports did this - putting professional stars with weekend club players to "make up" a balanced team. There would be very little sports, and a whole lot of fighting... actually that could be quite fun to watch

[color=cyan]I hear there's this 12v12 thing where 'professional stars' can go play other professional stars

I would like to echo the first post though, and just ask people to, regardless of what their team/enemies are made up of, use common decency. You will never, ever, in a million years, get what you want by screaming like a toddler having a tantrum at adults, while an adult. They will immediately and with the utmost urgency do whatever the opposite is of what they were told.

If you ask something and people respond with swearing and cursing - report them. There's no reason at all to get bent out of shape when playing a video game, and while we all lose our cool, it isn't 'someone elses fault.' There's 12 people on a team, the chance of you somehow being an amazing top-of-the-Elo star on a team of 11 new players is astronomically low.

also, losing will not, as you may have been informed, physically harm you, kill you, or otherwise end your days.

So be a good person, chill out, have fun, and roll with the losses. If I couldn't do those things after a loss I would have quit in my first week

Stay classy, guys.[/color]

[Kunae]

Garth Erlam, on 19 August 2013 - 11:42 AM, said:

I hear there's this 12v12 thing where 'professional stars' can go play other professional stars

Give us the ability to drop into that queue with 1-12 player groups, and that'll be a valid criticism. Until then, it's just a cop-out.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you guys are working on that functionality, and should have it in with UI 2.0? A great deal of this angst should hopefully go away, then.

Edited by Kunae, 19 August 2013 - 11:49 AM.

[Duncan Longwood]

Personally, the most frustrating part of ELO dropping new players in with veterans is when I can tell in the first two minutes that my team has already gotten themselves check-mated. It's not like I'm the Garry Kasparov of MWO, but I have enough experience to read my teams opening moves and the other teams defenses to know when I should *resign. Instead, I am stuck watching it unfold in slow-motion like being in a car-crash; I know I'm screwed and my butt is puckered, but there isn't much else I can do but helplessly watch it play out while I scream at my (mechs) windshield.


*From Wikipedia: In master and serious amateur play, it is much more common for a game to be resigned than for it to end with checkmate, because players can foresee checkmate well in advance.

Sorry about the extended chess metaphor, I couldn't resist since we are stuck with ELO.

[Crixus316]

Yesterday, was the worst I've ever seen. A veteran pilot leads the team into a chokepoint on Terra. The team gets pinned and flanked, and he is on of the first to die. Then he goes off, telling the few pilots alive how bad they are. He continues about how good he is, how much damage he has done, and if he had a decent team we would have won. If your a veteran pilot and are one of the first to die, stop blaming everyone else for your failure.

[Kunae]

Mr Bigglesworth, on 19 August 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

Yesterday, was the worst I've ever seen. A veteran pilot leads the team into a chokepoint on Terra. The team gets pinned and flanked, and he is on of the first to die. Then he goes off, telling the few pilots alive how bad they are. He continues about how good he is, how much damage he has done, and if he had a decent team we would have won. If your a veteran pilot and are one of the first to die, stop blaming everyone else for your failure.

It's rarely as simple as that.

Sounds like that guy just needed to take a step back, and realize that there's only so much you can do, with random pugs. Venting on them is not the correct solution... that's what your friends are for.

[CrashieJ]

Garth Erlam, on 19 August 2013 - 11:42 AM, said:

[color=cyan]I hear there's this 12v12 thing where 'professional stars' can go play other professional stars [/color]

What game can I find it in? Because here I just see 23 other mechs with no sense of direction full up chest-bump-face-grind

Garth Erlam, on 19 August 2013 - 11:42 AM, said:

You will never, ever, in a million years, get what you want by screaming like a toddler having a tantrum at adults, while an adult. They will immediately and with the utmost urgency do whatever the opposite is of what they were told.

You've never served in the actual military have you? Because that's the overall structure, "Shout for Success"

Garth Erlam, on 19 August 2013 - 11:42 AM, said:

also, losing will not, as you may have been informed, physically harm you, kill you, or otherwise end your days.

but repeated losses due to a lack of level players will limit them regarding this game.