90 replies to this topic

[WolvesX]

"After designing, developing, and testing the MWO’s 3PV, we quickly realised that 3PV offered no significant advantage over 1PV. In fact we found each mode had pros and cons that played well with each other. This revelation changed our initial 3PV plans and we postponed Hardcore mode (separate queues for 1PV and 3PV), in favor of rethinking the idea and offering up a different solution that also addressed a few more community wish list items."

bryan eckman

---

ok.

[Alistair Winter]

I'm experiencing a lot of emotions right now.

[Kitane]

The more interesting thing is why they didn't notice that their restricted 3PV view completely missed its point - making the game easier for newbies.

Because the game is unplayable in 3rd view, it's only useful for peeking.

[Appogee]

So now we are requested to just deal with lack of follow through on the commitment that we would be able to choose not to play with 3PVers, as we wait for a mystery solution which we're assured ''addresses a few more community wish list items''.

I want to believe PGI. They do some good things... Sarah's Jenner, the detailed tech notes from time to time, the recent take-it-on-the-chin apology from the map maker who said he'd made a mistake, etc.

But frankly, after yesterday's blatant decommitment - revealed in such an offhand way in the patch notes - on a subject they knew was an important concern of their customers, any new commitments hold very little credibility.

This customer's trust has been badly shaken.

Edited by Appogee, 21 August 2013 - 03:11 AM.

[-Natural Selection-]

Basicly means, if there was a dedicated mode it wouldnt be a training aid. Then it would have to function 100% compared to 1pv.

Working out minimap display, arm movement, reticle jump and whatever else pops up.

Meh, If someone can actually use it and perform better more power to them. No minimap means no seizmic, Ill just be 100m behind um pounding them lol.

[MustrumRidcully]

Kitane, on 21 August 2013 - 03:03 AM, said:

The more interesting thing is why they didn't notice that their restricted 3PV view completely missed its point - making the game easier for newbies.

Because the game is unplayable in 3rd view, it's only useful for peeking.

That is an interesting point. Basically, if you really have a problem with steering your mech, taking away your map will create another obstacle with you. If you turn the game into one where you regularly have to switch between 1PV or 3PV to get the best results, you made the game more complicated and not more user friendly at all.

[MrZakalwe]

Dozier, on 21 August 2013 - 03:09 AM, said:

Basicly means, if there was a dedicated mode it wouldnt be a training aid. Then it would have to function 100% compared to 1pv.

Working out minimap display, arm movement, reticle jump and whatever else pops up.

Meh, If someone can actually use it and perform better more power to them. No minimap means no seizmic, Ill just be 100m behind um pounding them lol.

That's fine for the occasional ***** who stays in 3PV but what about those like me that just use it to peek over stuff to make sure I'm not getting rushed or flanked and to decide if ridging against whats on the other side would be a good idea.

[Sephlock]

Kitane, on 21 August 2013 - 03:03 AM, said:

The more interesting thing is why they didn't notice that their restricted 3PV view completely missed its point - making the game easier for newbies.

Because the game is unplayable in 3rd view, it's only useful for peeking.

IIRC the point was supposed to be to help newbies who are confused by the whole "torso twist" thing.

I honestly don't get it because it really isn't that hard a concept- even if you are unfamiliar with the idea of mechs... you know, tank's have turrets... and like... people have torsos and necks...

[Strayed]

Nah nobody really gives a care about 3PV being in game or not. What they were interested in was why they got lied to about there being separate queues and being forced to play against those who had it enabled. Until PGI acknowledge this simple truth nobody is going to drop the pitchforks.

Edited by Strayed, 21 August 2013 - 08:06 AM.

[MrZakalwe]

Strayed, on 21 August 2013 - 03:30 AM, said:

Nah nobody really gives a care about 3PV being in game or not. What they were interested in was why they got lied to about there being separate queues and being not being forced to play against those who had it enabled. Until PGI acknowledge this simple truth nobody is going to drop the pitchforks.

No I'm pretty annoyed about being forced to drop in games with 3pv.

The best thing about this game was the lack of a magic radar, the fact that visual confirmation was required- it made flanking, ambushes and a great many other things work that now dont.

Being lied to is normal from game developers but I'd rather they made the game better rather than removing the one thing that sets it above similar games.

[Kitane]

I've tried to control the mech in 3rd person view, but I chickened out and switched back to cockpit view before real combat began.

1) Impossibility to override armlock has obvious implications. "Oi newbie, press F4 to get back to cockpit, then hold LSHIFT to unlock your arms and....oh you are dead...nvm"

2) The raytraced aiming reticle is unnatural, jumps like hell and the person playing it for the first time must be wondering WTF is this supposed to be?

3) The main reason I didn't dare to fight in 3rd person view yet was the fact that the the point I was aiming at was covered by the top of my Cataphract. I did not see what I was aiming at.

4) And no minimap means I have no clue where are my friends and enemies. Am I too far forward? Am I alone? Is someone flanking me? Where is everyone? It pretty much guarantees that the newbie will be completely and totally lost with no way to get his bearings.

Is this supposed to ease the learning curve? Really?

[Nulnoil]

[MrZakalwe]

Kitane, on 21 August 2013 - 03:42 AM, said:

I've tried to control the mech in 3rd person view, but I chickened out and switched back to cockpit view before real combat began.

1) Impossibility to override armlock has obvious implications. "Oi newbie, press F4 to get back to cockpit, then hold LSHIFT to unlock your arms and....oh you are dead...nvm"

2) The raytraced aiming reticle is unnatural, jumps like hell and the person playing it for the first time must be wondering WTF is this supposed to be?

3) The main reason I didn't dare to fight in 3rd person view yet was the fact that the the point I was aiming at was covered by the top of my Cataphract. I did not see what I was aiming at.

4) And no minimap means I have no clue where are my friends and enemies. Am I too far forward? Am I alone? Is someone flanking me? Where is everyone? It pretty much guarantees that the newbie will be completely and totally lost with no way to get his bearings.

Is this supposed to ease the learning curve? Really?

This has been covered- 3PV doesn't help new players, it helps mid rankers like me and people better than me who know the value of being able to peak over and around stuff.

You don't use it to fight in (that would be silly) you just click into it for 2 seconds and out again.

[Nulnoil]

[MustrumRidcully]

Kitane, on 21 August 2013 - 03:42 AM, said:

I've tried to control the mech in 3rd person view, but I chickened out and switched back to cockpit view before real combat began.

1) Impossibility to override armlock has obvious implications. "Oi newbie, press F4 to get back to cockpit, then hold LSHIFT to unlock your arms and....oh you are dead...nvm"

2) The raytraced aiming reticle is unnatural, jumps like hell and the person playing it for the first time must be wondering WTF is this supposed to be?

3) The main reason I didn't dare to fight in 3rd person view yet was the fact that the the point I was aiming at was covered by the top of my Cataphract. I did not see what I was aiming at.

4) And no minimap means I have no clue where are my friends and enemies. Am I too far forward? Am I alone? Is someone flanking me? Where is everyone? It pretty much guarantees that the newbie will be completely and totally lost with no way to get his bearings.

Is this supposed to ease the learning curve? Really?

So basically, if you're a new player and use 3PV, you're hosed, because you lack several important features.
That goes against the initial goal of 3PV, being a tool that made the game easier on new players.

But if you're not a new player, you use 3PV whenever you want to look around a corner instead of walking around it and risk being shot in the face.

[Kitane]

MrZakalwe, on 21 August 2013 - 03:54 AM, said:

This has been covered- 3PV doesn't help new players, it helps mid rankers like me and people better than me who know the value of being able to peak over and around stuff.

You don't use it to fight in (that would be silly) you just click into it for 2 seconds and out again.

I know that. And it's pretty sad that we all have to go through this e-drama when this feature doesn't even help people it was designed for.

[SixstringSamurai]

I asked for, no demanded a refund. This is not the first point PGI/IGP has back pedaled on and this makes me think it is not the last. It wasn't what they were saying when I was giving them money and it's not the game I wanted to play.

[MustrumRidcully]

Kitane, on 21 August 2013 - 04:03 AM, said:

I know that. And it's pretty sad that we all have to go through this e-drama when this feature doesn't even help people it was designed for.

Reminds me a bit of the heat scale penalty system, where it still allows pinponit alpha, which was what people were complaining about, and nerfs a lot of builds no one worried about.

I don't know why they make decisions like this. There must be some higher purpose I can't see. #faithInPGI

[MrZakalwe]

Kitane, on 21 August 2013 - 04:03 AM, said:

I know that. And it's pretty sad that we all have to go through this e-drama when this feature doesn't even help people it was designed for.

Agreed.

PGI make a science of ignoring its target markets wishes.

Goodbye information warfare.

[Darwins Dog]

Daumantas Galland, on 21 August 2013 - 03:57 AM, said:

Quote from the command chair post:

Quote

Addendum to Bryan's Post:

I've seen the screencap of the spider at the top of River City. I want to say thanks for finding a bug. If you go up there, you can tell it's a bug. If you look up slightly, or to the left or right slightly, the camera crashes back in and you can't see much at all.

To recreate, take a Spider in River City - Training Grounds. Get to that spot and jam your face directly into that corner (still doesn't happen yet). Now look down as far as the Spider can look. Bam! It happens. The raytrace for the camera is breaking through that particular spot in geometry. We are having an engineer look into why this is happening. Again. While there, look away in any direction just SLIGHTLY and the camera returns to the position it's supposed to be in. Very nice bug find and as mentioned, we will look into what's causing this.

If you want a refund, then I'm sorry for you. You paid for an unfinished product that you were told was subject to change at any time. You were also told that all developer statements were subject to change, so you got exactly what you paid for.