597 replies to this topic

[Alois Hammer]

Cybermech, on 05 September 2013 - 03:06 AM, said:

again you can't pick out anything and repeat the same thing.

...you mean like you're doing?

Jestun, on 05 September 2013 - 03:45 AM, said:

Some people seem confused on where the burden of proof falls.

when you come into a thread and claim it's all full of lies with nothing to back up your accusation it is not the rest of the world's responsibility to prove you wrong.

You're going to end up banned if you keep arguing with PGI's intended target market.

Edited by Alois Hammer, 05 September 2013 - 05:44 AM.

[Cybermech]

Alois Hammer, on 05 September 2013 - 05:39 AM, said:

...you mean like you're doing?



You're going to end up banned if you keep arguing with PGI's intended target market.

ye cause that has happened so many times, you guys will try anything at all.
and I was requesting him to do it not the other way around

[Alois Hammer]

Cybermech, on 05 September 2013 - 05:56 AM, said:

ye cause that has happened so many times, you guys will try anything at all.
and I was requesting him to do it not the other way around

Until you stop parroting "LALALALALALALACan'tHearYou, Article is full of lies, LALALALALALALACan'tHearYou," and offer the first shred of proof of your assertions, you're nothing but Ignore List fodder.

[Cybermech]

dear god man, lolz.
thank you so much for proofing my other points.
please continue.
as for ignored list... do you even know what your saying?

still Points have been made, why don't you give it a try?
I presume your saying that the articles are very valid with no lies or manipulation through them?

edit: yes crying and running away from something You say is facts when its not even close and I have pointed them out with ease.
Now not one of you guys could even pick anything apart.
Not even one.

Edited by Cybermech, 05 September 2013 - 06:19 AM.

[Jestun]

Cybermech, on 04 September 2013 - 03:00 AM, said:

To those reading the Mechwarrior Online forums now, as opposed to six months ago, the change is marked.

first lie, not even gone down any further but I'l collect a few.
people have been raging on these forums for a long time.
the biggest one is modules.
six months is a lie.

Proof? Evidence? Source?

Her's the general discussion forum 6 months ago: http://mwomercs.com/..._all__st__16110

If you still feel this is the same atmosphere as we currently have then perhaps you can actually provide something to back that claim up? Because I see nowhere near the volume of dissatisfaction, nor the same amount of hostility. That's not to say everyone was a white knight who agreed with everything PGI did, but it was completely different to the current atmosphere.

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Gone are the days of typical forum behavior: quiet threads toiling in the background with the occasional drive-by trolling or derailment

those days are long gone because back in the day the amount of crying on the forums forced nearly EVERYONE to look else where.

Look through a month worth of posts in the link I provided. Then look through a month's worth of recent posts.

If you can't see the difference between then and now then I'm honestly not sure what to tell you...

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slandering the developers in announcement threads and creating signatures insulting Piranha Games’s competence


that is also back in closed beta, when this presumed writer claims 6 months ago everything was fine.

Examples? I have given you a link to the main (at the time) forum, perhaps you can furnish me with some examples of significant portions of the forum community "slandering" developers in the link I provided? I can certainly do the same on recent posts.

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The phrase “PGI Lied, MWO Died” has taken on a weird sort of life amidst the disgruntled players

this is also a closed beta statement too.

"Taken on a weird sort of life" does not mean "was invented because of". The article in no way claims it was never said before.

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The road that led to MWO’s fanbase banging on PGI’s gates with pitchforks and torches was a long one, and the situation acts as an interesting case study in how to gradually alienate your players. Or, at least, the players on your forums

this happened a long time ago when nearly everyone was sick of the crying, PGI - community.. EVERYONE.

Again, I have provided the link for 6 months ago... where is this happening back there?

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It all began with the inclusion of a consumable in MWO known as “Cool Shot.”

it all began with Lrm's not worth it even though they would still hit the target over every building and also continue to hit 8 seconds after.

It depends what you mean by "it". Cool shots were obviously not the first thing that wasn't supported by 100% of the community but it was the start of them breaking the design pillars of the game.

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the whole comparison about coolshot, it was consumables being better with MC purchase.

Cool Shot is a variant of a feature known as “Coolant Flush” from previous Mechwarrior games. That feature allowed players to “flush” their built-up heat from their fighting ‘Mech tanks. Heat is a resource that rises every time the player fires a weapon, and its levels must be lowered in order for a player to continue firing their weapons — too much heat, and the ‘Mech is forced to shut down. By drastically reducing ‘Mech heat almost instantly with Coolant Flush, players could continue to fire their weapons without risk of overheating and shutting down, which normally would expose them to enemy fire.
The ability to flush heat essentially allowed for continuous, heavily-damaging fire in multiplayer, and drastically changed the way players fight and strategize in-game; essentially, instead of managing heat by carefully deciding which shots to take and when, Coolant Flush removed that skill component. Dedicated Mechwarrior fans point to the inclusion of the feature — along with the addition of a third-person camera perspective — as one of the reasons previous Mechwarrior titles have had mostly dead multiplayer components.

coolshot sucked, I'm not defending it however there is massive amounts of lying here.
why has he not mentioned its 1 shot?

The pay 2 win aspect was certainly an issue, but it was far from the only one.

For example, take this thread: http://mwomercs.com/...nofficial-poll/

It is quite clearly about cool shot as a whole and not specifically P2W versions.

Or you could browse tyhrough the official thread and see how many posters were against it regardless of P2W aspects: http://mwomercs.com/...items-feedback/ Although that's not easy becase:

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A number of posts from this thread have been removed for lacking a constructive purpose. "Do not want" is not a useful point.

Not wanting cool shot was "unconstructive" so the posts were deleted.

Edited by Jestun, 05 September 2013 - 06:32 AM.

[Cybermech]

Jestun, on 05 September 2013 - 06:30 AM, said:

Proof? Evidence? Source?

Her's the general discussion forum 6 months ago: http://mwomercs.com/..._all__st__16110

If you still feel this is the same atmosphere as we currently have then perhaps you can actually provide something to back that claim up? Because I see nowhere near the volume of dissatisfaction, nor the same amount of hostility. That's not to say everyone was a white knight who agreed with everything PGI did, but it was completely different to the current atmosphere.

Your telling me people haven't been complaining about things for a long time, repair and re'arm?, ecm...

Look through a month worth of posts in the link I provided. Then look through a month's worth of recent posts.

If you can't see the difference between then and now then I'm honestly not sure what to tell you...

I never said people were complaining less, I said people were crying before and they were.

Examples? I have given you a link to the main (at the time) forum, perhaps you can furnish me with some examples of significant portions of the forum community "slandering" developers in the link I provided? I can certainly do the same on recent posts.

I can't believe your going with that angle, people have been doing it since the start. Not even up for discussion.

"Taken on a weird sort of life" does not mean "was invented because of". The article in no way claims it was never said before.

The article is trying to manipulate the time line to make other points more valid, you should try and read it again.

Again, I have provided the link for 6 months ago... where is this happening back there?

I can't still believe your taking this same direction, one thing is for sure, people have been crying for a long time.
One example which is quite famous is the NERF LRMS, BUFF LRMS, screenshot right beside each other in general discussion.

It depends what you mean by "it". Cool shots were obviously not the first thing that wasn't supported by 100% of the community but it was the start of them breaking the design pillars of the game.

Yes which is what your missing, the fact that you could use MC version on one module and needed 2 modules for Cbills was the whole point.
After that it just became about coolshot in general.
[size=4]

The pay 2 win aspect was certainly an issue, but it was far from the only one.

For example, take this thread: http://mwomercs.com/...nofficial-poll/

It is quite clearly about cool shot as a whole and not specifically P2W versions.

Your wrong again, the "push" that is mentioned is about the P2W aspect that was mainly charged by the introduction of hero mechs.
Once it was announced that changes were incoming it was just left for the no coolshot and consumables people to keep it going.

Or you could browse tyhrough the official thread and see how many posters were against it regardless of P2W aspects: http://mwomercs.com/...items-feedback/ Although that's not easy becase:

I suppose excluding the first few comments you might be right, once again the P2W aspect dominated every conversation.
I've had plenty of them with people defending it, the insanity of it is just the same.

Not wanting cool shot was "unconstructive" so the posts were deleted.

Just saying no was deleted and I would agree with that, if you put "no because it would ruing my gameplay" it was fine.

You first link has some nice timing to it, no idea how you manage to get one with out all the complaining about ecm, narc being useless, assault warrior online and along with others must have been hard to come by.
Raven-3l?
[i][i]The list goes on and one, with one thing still stands as fact.
[i][i]Even 6 months ago the saying "you still look at the forums?" was some that was said all the time.

Edited by Cybermech, 05 September 2013 - 07:33 AM.

[PauperAllianceRepresentative]

Greetings from the far reaches of the galaxy. I agree with Mr Murff and hope that someday soon someone else will do the mechwarrior IP justice rather than treat it as a purely profit making exercise. Just watch as community warfare becomes a 'paid for' service; the real battles for the galaxy will be behind a pay wall.

Edited by PauperAllianceRepresentative, 05 September 2013 - 07:30 AM.

[Cybermech]

wait you don't want a mechwarrior title?
or you want one that is made of magic and snowflakes?

also for you point to be valid then it would be no longer called a f2p game.

[Alois Hammer]

Jestun, on 05 September 2013 - 06:30 AM, said:

Proof? Evidence? Source?

>snip<

Not wanting cool shot was "unconstructive" so the posts were deleted.

All irrelevant, as The Tool™ rejects our reality and substitutes his own.

-ba-dum-tssh!-

Edited by Alois Hammer, 05 September 2013 - 07:41 AM.

[RG Notch]

Alois Hammer, on 05 September 2013 - 07:40 AM, said:

[/i]

All irrelevant, as The Tool™ rejects our reality and substitutes his own.

-ba-dum-tssh!-

Actually he's substituting IGP/PGI's reality.....

[Alois Hammer]

RG Notch, on 05 September 2013 - 07:42 AM, said:

Actually he's substituting IGP/PGI's reality.....

Rocky Horror Picture Show moment: Same thing!!

Drinking IGP/PGI's Kool-Aid is drinking IGP/PGI's Kool-Aid.

[Cybermech]

lolz, wait what?
you guys seriously complaining that IGP/PGI requested actual feedback instead of yes or no answers.
do you not understand that it benefits YOU more then them.

and your responses keep pushing out the fact that your just too small minded.
you can't even see how your continuing the problems on which you would liked fixed.
I want this post at the top, I want players (mainly older ones) to see the crazy out of you guys.
Not even hard, now your trying the "white knight" approach which is just pure fail.

[Jestun]

Cybermech, on 05 September 2013 - 07:17 AM, said:

You first link has some nice timing to it, no idea how you manage to get one with out all the complaining about ecm, narc being useless, assault warrior online and along with others must have been hard to come by.
Raven-3l?
The list goes on and one, with one thing still stands as fact.
Even 6 months ago the saying "you still look at the forums?" was some that was said all the time.

As far as I can see your entire argument is based on the myth that the article says that before this (or before cool shot) there was 0% disagreement and that everyone blindly supported PGI.

At no point does the article say that, making your entire post meaningless.


You are proving yourself wrong, which saves everyone else the hassle I suppose.


:edit:

At no point did I say that either, and I've not noticed anyone else make that claim.

So you are "proving" (without any actual proof, again just telling everyone that you disagree and believeing that is "proof") something that no one has said.


:edit 2:

Your post actually claims that the fact that there were threads focused on balance topics the article is a lie:

Quote

Again, I have provided the link for 6 months ago... where is this happening back there?

I can't still believe your taking this same direction, one thing is for sure, people have been crying for a long time.
One example which is quite famous is the NERF LRMS, BUFF LRMS, screenshot right beside each other in general discussion.

This is the best thread ever...

Edited by Jestun, 05 September 2013 - 08:05 AM.

[Cybermech]

so your claiming that repair and rearm didn't happen.
if this because there is a lot of people wanting it back in?

your trying to make the article fact, I'm pointing out what isn't.
You have been saying that there has been nothing worth discussing up untill 3pv.
where 6 months ago it was peace and quite.
which was during the consumable time line.
I pointed out many things within the conversation that were false.

All you have done is proven how much you guys ("saveMWO") will lie to prove other points.
which is funny cause there is a lot of things without the need to lie about them.
I'm taking you guys as a whole and what you done here was so pointless and so limited you can't even see it.

[Jestun]

Cybermech, on 05 September 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

so your claiming that repair and rearm didn't happen.

Who claimed this? Quote please.

Quote

You have been saying that there has been nothing worth discussing up untill 3pv.

I'll have a quote for this too please, as that is another myth. It never happened and I never said that.


It's becoming clear why you think it's a lie, you seem to have issues with the English language. Either that or you are purposefully ignoring reality.


:Edit:

I also have no link to saveMWO. I'm not a part of it, I've not even been to a meeting as a spectator to hear what they have to say.


It seems you make up the situation to suit you and then call everyone who doesn't live in your dreamworld a liar.

Edited by Jestun, 05 September 2013 - 08:17 AM.

[Vila deVere]

Protection, on 30 August 2013 - 02:45 PM, said:

Wonder how long the "In the news" subforum will last once the 5.5/10 reviews start pouring in.

Once the game launches, the bad reviews will be justified. And PGI has no one to blame but themselves. Virtually all of there problems can be attributed to EXTREMLY poor community relations.

[Cybermech]

"If you still feel this is the same atmosphere as we currently have then perhaps you can actually provide something to back that claim up"

raven3l, ecm, ddc, lack of cw... list goes on and on.

"As far as I can see your entire argument is based on the myth that the article says that before this (or before cool shot) there was 0% disagreement and that everyone blindly supported PGI."

thank you so much, there has been nobody saying that, its just a direction you brought it to.
you might want to think about how you make your points.

the article tries to make out that a massive uprising has been happening around consumables and not much else before it.
its why I keep mentioning repair and rearm.
your claims and others are this article is fact. which it ain't.
its motivations, timeline and others are a few things I pointed out.

I'm still lost on what I made up, still seems I proven that people have been crying for a long time about many things.
And that this moment has been led up by MANY things.
Which you clearly are avoiding, you have stated that 6 months ago its there was no crying, you linked it as proof.
Of course to make that right you would have to ignore a lot of things.
But one of the points you seem to be missing is that your listening to lies, you just keep editing my points with others.
Have tried to make it out like lots of things have not happened cause if they didn't happen then the article would be right.

Its simple, the article is lying about a lot of things or its not.
and your proof you used just goes to show how far you will continue to lie.

[Vila deVere]

Alois Hammer, on 30 August 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

You reap what you sow. Enjoy your harvest, PGI.

It's not like TONS of us haven't been warning them.

Who knows.... maybe they'll make something worthwhile in the end.

[Cybermech]

you reap what others sow would be more accurate.

that if were talking about the article.
slow progress and fear is been the main fuel, too many people are taking it as facts.

[Jestun]

Cybermech, on 05 September 2013 - 08:42 AM, said:

"If you still feel this is the same atmosphere as we currently have then perhaps you can actually provide something to back that claim up"

raven3l, ecm, ddc, lack of cw... list goes on and on.

This makes no attempt to discuss the atmosphere in any way.

Are you trying to tell me that you think that because 6 months ago there was not 100% support for the game it's exactly the same now as it was then?

Does your world just have 2 settings, "everyone happy" and "at least one person unhappy"?

Quote

"As far as I can see your entire argument is based on the myth that the article says that before this (or before cool shot) there was 0% disagreement and that everyone blindly supported PGI."

thank you so much, there has been nobody saying that, its just a direction you brought it to.
you might want to think about how you make your points.

Then what is the basis for your argument? Is there one?

Quote

the article tries to make out that a massive uprising has been happening around consumables and not much else before it.

At no point did it say that there were no uprisings before it. At no point did it say everyone was supporting PGI on every decision before consumables. But that was the first core design pillar that was broken. It was the first major U-turn in offering a product they specifically stated they would not make.

Quote

its why I keep mentioning repair and rearm.

Do you at least realise now that I at no point claimed that R&R didn;t happen? Your lack of a quote showing that I did say it seems to imply this.

Quote

your claims and others are this article is fact. which it ain't.

False. They are fact. You don't seem to know what the word fact means. You have also been entirely unable to provide a shred of evidence.

Quote

its motivations, timeline and others are a few things I pointed out.

This only seems to be half of a sentance. I'm not sure how to respond.

Quote

I'm still lost on what I made up, still seems I proven that people have been crying for a long time about many things.
And that this moment has been led up by MANY things.

You have proven nothing of the sort. Seriously, look up "proof", "prove" or "proven" in a dictionary. You have repeatedly said that you disagree. That is not proof unless the article is about your opinion.



There seems to be a limited number of quotes per post, this this will be a 2 parter!

Quote

Which you clearly are avoiding, you have stated that 6 months ago its there was no crying, you linked it as proof.
Of course to make that right you would have to ignore a lot of things.

Once again, provide me with a quote of where I said that. At no point did I say that.

You claim the article is a lie, the article does not claim that no one cried more than 6 months ago so why would I care how much crying you think people did? It's entirely irrelevant and has nothing to do with the article.

Quote

But one of the points you seem to be missing is that your listening to lies, you just keep editing my points with others.

False. I read facts. Facts with opinions included (both the author's and some of the community's), but no lies.

Quote

Have tried to make it out like lots of things have not happened cause if they didn't happen then the article would be right.

I'm getting bored of asking this, because I know you will not provide anything, but what has someone (the article or the thread) claimed hasn't happened that actually did happen?

Quote

Its simple, the article is lying about a lot of things or its not.

It's not.

Quote

and your proof you used just goes to show how far you will continue to lie.

No, it proves your inability to understand either the article or people's posts. That or you intentionally put words into people's mouths.

Ignorance or malice. Not sure which would be the better outcome.

Great, it merged the posts and broke the quotes...