187 replies to this topic

[990Dreams]

Maggiman, on 01 September 2014 - 07:07 AM, said:

2 Questions appear:
If the reactor can supply enough energy to push the mech up, why can't it stay afloat?
If the reactor can't, how is that energy stored for release? Surely not chemical(No fuel).

The reactor doesn't.

Compressed air is plasmafied and ejected out of the back. Like a fusion reactor, except used for propulsion rather than energy (and, since it isn't hydrogen, it may not fuse at all. It may simply be non-fusing plasma).

Also, for those interested in advanced physics but don't want to/can't take a college course, World Science U is a good place to look.

Edited by DavidHurricane, 01 September 2014 - 07:13 AM.

[Maggiman]

True enough, but said plasmafication (Yes that is a word now) and acceleration need energy. Which means either the reactor supplys the energy(Leading back to my questions) or something else.
Fusing air(Or its elements, to be precise) cannot be the answer however. That is a lot more inefficient than hydrogen fusion and would be incredibly radioactive. ..

[990Dreams]

Maggiman, on 01 September 2014 - 07:18 AM, said:

True enough, but said plasmafication (Yes that is a word now) and acceleration need energy. Which means either the reactor supplys the energy(Leading back to my questions) or something else.
Fusing air(Or its elements, to be precise) cannot be the answer however. That is a lot more inefficient than hydrogen fusion and would be incredibly radioactive. ..

I don't think it actually fuses the air. And I guess the reactor supplies energy to a coil, which magnetically ejects the plasma.

[redacted]

Edited by Egomane, 02 September 2014 - 06:17 AM.
post cleaned up

[Maggiman]

A coil storing the energy...huh more jumpjets- >more coils->more energy- > greater jumps... I like it.
But I would mean a catastrophic failure (Like, say, a gauss round)
might release the stored magnetic energy instantly. Similar to a gauss rifle exploding. Probably more powerfull. I like that too =D

[990Dreams]

Update: If you want philosophy debates, go here: Philosophy thread.

[Reported for Inappropriate Name]

stompy robots designed in the 70's when windows were advanced technology

[990Dreams]

Battlecruiser, on 01 September 2014 - 08:13 AM, said:

stompy robots designed in the 70's when windows were advanced technology

I'm not sure I even know how to respond to this one.

[9erRed]

Greetings all,

About Jump Jets.

One of the suggested ideas of how and why jump jets work:
~ This is taken from the essay on BattleTech Mech's and how/why they work.
Ref: http://www.sarna.net...Mech_Technology

Jump jets work by ingesting atmosphere via a system of turbo compressors to be used as reaction mass in reaction chambers.
- The system hits the compressed reaction mass with electron beams powered by the magnetohydrodynamic tap from the fusion engine, which converts the compressed reaction mass into an explosion of plasma.
- This superheated plasma is than channeled through a magnetically sealed venturi baffle, resulting in a controlled and concentrated flow out of the jump jet exhaust port.
- BattleMech jump jets don't add plasma vented from the fusion engine - only aerofighters do this. Because jump jets work with plasma, their reaction chambers closely resemble fusion reactors; down to the magnetic containment fields.
- Jump jets can only be run for so long due to a couple of reasons; the first being that they can not survive their operating temperatures for an extended amount of time, and the second is that they normally ingest oxygen rich atmosphere for reaction mass - the super heated oxygen would destroy the assembly if it were continuously used.
- BattleMechs normally carry a small supply of reaction mass - usually hydrogen, water, or mercury - in order to operate where there is no atmosphere.
( The reference to the use of Mercury, probably because the propellant molecule or atom is easy to ionize, has a high mass/ionization energy ratio. But this is still toxic and expensive, tended to contaminate the vehicle with the metal and was difficult to feed accurately. )
- Why underwater jump jets will not work. Firing a jump jet filled with incompressible water generates enough pressure to rupture even the toughened jump jet casings. Jump jets can not use stored reaction mass under water either - the jets will not work with water plugging their nozzles.

One of the 'backstories' as how this process is listed as working.

9erRed

Edited by 9erRed, 02 September 2014 - 05:16 PM.

[Maggiman]

I dislike this solution to the limit because it can be solved through tighter compression through the magnetic field which is something you can do if you have small scale fusion reactors =(

[990Dreams]

Marack Drock, on 01 September 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

Dude, just tell Niko. If it helps I am deleting my posts on this thread right now.

Also I would like some explanation of why Magnetic Fields seem to be used in EVERYTHING in BT.

Actually yours were mostly fine. I said it was the three posts by E N E R G Y and Loganauer.

[990Dreams]

Loganauer, on 02 September 2014 - 04:04 AM, said:

Lol, disagreeing with you warrants deleting the thread. Nice.

Not listening to a rule I put in place warrants me deleting the thread to prevent it from becoming "Is God real?"

I am mature enough to understand that is a minefield and shouldn't be brought up on a video game forum.

I am going to give this thread one final chance. If I didn't make myself clear, any discussion about evolution, religion, deities, or origins of the universe that doesn't pertain directly to the discussion is not allowed.

Example of permissible things that normally aren't: Where the Tae Tae Tae came from involves Darwinian theory to accurately judge how they came to be what they were.

Marack Drock, on 01 September 2014 - 05:53 PM, said:

Also I would like some explanation of why Magnetic Fields seem to be used in EVERYTHING in BT.

Magnetic fields are so very useful. They can manipulate most objects.

If ECM emits a huge radio field to block transmissions, wouldn't that make you way too obvious on a radio wave map?

Edited by DavidHurricane, 02 September 2014 - 04:13 AM.

[Pht]

DavidHurricane, on 01 September 2014 - 06:24 AM, said:

... With that, there will be no more talk about evolution or creation in this thread.

I'm tempted to start a thread about science in general in Off-Topic.

That would be an interesting discussion. Of course, with the forum rules being hardcore postmodernistic-jellyfishism around here those sorts of topics probably won't be long for this world even in k-town.

Any discussion of those sorts of topics seems to scare people. Serious discussion about those topics ...

Edited by Pht, 02 September 2014 - 04:59 AM.

[Pht]

9erRed, on 01 September 2014 - 09:38 AM, said:

One of the suggested ideas of how and why jump jets work:

It's not a suggestion.

That's how they work in the lore. The TM article those were drawn from are the current authoritative source - I confirmed that with the writer of said TM article. I also wrote the article you're quoting from on sarna (the one in the off topics forum here is a bit cleaner, btw).

[990Dreams]

Pht, on 02 September 2014 - 04:53 AM, said:

That would be an interesting discussion. Of course, with the forum rules being hardcore postmodernistic-jellyfishism around here those sorts of topics probably won't be long for this world even in k-town.

Any discussion of those sorts of topics seems to scare people. Serious discussion about those topics ...

And you already started talking about this again. What part of the word "stop" don't people on the forums understand?

[Egomane]

So... I removed some parts of this thread, that were trespassing on forbidden topics as well as an attempt to derail and troll it.

Please keep all talk about religion and religous theories out of the MWO forums. Just like with politics, there is no right or wrong on those and therfore disagreement almost always becomes anger and by that more work for the moderating team, as soon as believers and non-believers start to argue..

[990Dreams]

So, Jump Jets.

We agree that it is plasma ejected by a magnetic coil?

[Maggiman]

I do. Wether it's canon or not.
As for the importance of magnetics: There is a real limit at how much energy density you get with chemical reactions. And that doesn't apply for magnetic or electric fields and effects.
Moving mechanical parts don't help either, so the move to LazorS and magnetic/ electric weaponry seems reasonable to me.

Boy do I love Battletech for that. There is a lot wrong with it, but for the most part they didn't treat science like magic

[990Dreams]

Maggiman, on 02 September 2014 - 08:24 AM, said:

I do. Wether it's canon or not.
As for the importance of magnetics: There is a real limit at how much energy density you get with chemical reactions. And that doesn't apply for magnetic or electric fields and effects.
Moving mechanical parts don't help either, so the move to LazorS and magnetic/ electric weaponry seems reasonable to me.

Boy do I love Battletech for that. There is a lot wrong with it, but for the most part they didn't treat science like magic

Yep. It is within the realm of possibility.

But there is a limit to how much power you can pump into a coil to make a magnetic field. Let's look into that.

Edited by DavidHurricane, 02 September 2014 - 08:50 AM.

[Maggiman]

Even today that limit is quite high and more limited by the fact, that the property used for it (superconduction) is not fully understood. However superconducting coils- are- used for grid energy stabilisation and railguns are limited mainly by power and maintainance problems and not the principal superconductor limits.

As a qualitative statement: I think it's feasible to put that much energy in a compact coil, though it will need a tad more advancement =)

Edit: Of couse it's not superconductivity that is the property being exploited to generate magnetic fields. Its the property that allows the necessary current flow, which generates the field. Sry for ******* up

Edited by Maggiman, 02 September 2014 - 12:36 PM.

[9erRed]

Greetings all,

On ECM:

It is not restricted to only the radio frequency, most of it's use is in hiding the Mech's electrical, thermal and other sources of output signature.
- If the targeting device can't get a source to lock onto or is saturated with signal impute, it's working for you.

- Guardian ECM:
Designed to interfere with guided weaponry, targeting computers, and communication systems, the Guardian is typically used to shield allied units from such equipment by emitting a broad-band signal meant to confuse radar, infrared, ultraviolet, magscan and sonar sensors.
One major change that MWO introduced was the loss of missile lock on, as the Lore lists:
~ Contemporary guided missiles such as standard LRM or Streak SRMs are not affected by the Guardian suite and will be able to achieve hard lock as normal.
Additionally, it lists that 'infrared', and 'sonar' is ineffective. (not what we are seeing as 'infrared/thermal' and 'seismic' appear to work just fine.)

- Angle ECM Suite:
Experimental version of the Guardian ECM Suite operating on a broader spectrum and greatly advances ECM technology. The Angle system does block Streak SRMs and NARC as well as nearly everything else on the battlefield.

So it appears that MWO is taking items for multiple systems of ECM as well as the Beagle active probe to build a live game driven system. And rewriting Lore tech listings and spec's of these systems.


9erRed

Edited by 9erRed, 02 September 2014 - 05:59 PM.