2555 replies to this topic

[Frenchtoastman]

If the company can get away with doubling back on promises the way they have, at least twice, I don't know why anyone defending them would have a problem with a no-longer-targeted-demographic founder getting their money back. Afterall, that cash given, it was simply their position at the time.

BTW, I'm not meaning to call you out as a defender G. Owen, I understand you're likely just giving a point of warning.

Edited by Frenchtoastman, 28 September 2013 - 07:41 AM.

[Kread]

Watch out French toast they are gagging accountsand deleting posts they don't like.. Just a heads up

[Jorin Blutfang]

Never bought a pair of shoes and afterwards thought of it as a wrong decision?
After wearing them for about a year you still are complaining about the producers promisses and al the advertisments you fell for.
And still you claim your right to charge back your money...
[Sarcasm off]

Please realize that in every other case you just throw away the product and get over with it.

Sorry 4 getting off topic again.
I didn't post before 'cause I didn't want to add to that CW, but enough is enough!

I waited several long years for another game of MW.
MW:O is not perfect and probably never will. I still use Windows OS though it has the same issues for decades!!!!!!!
It's fun to play and atm it plays well.
Instead of not playing a Mechwarrior Game for another 2-15 years I for my part am happy to have this.
Instead of complaining about the catering and bad organisation at the Opening I am surprized they even tried to have one while some forum member are still giving their best to turn down every move they try.
Sure there were another announcements. And history showed they had their problems with their timeline.
But hey! If you all take every announcement for granted, how do you find time to live for every politician or friend or salesmen who break promisses every once in a while.

Enjoy it or leave it!
Stop wasting you lives.

[Gregory Owen]

Jorin Blutfang, on 28 September 2013 - 07:59 AM, said:

Never bought a pair of shoes and afterwards thought of it as a wrong decision?
After wearing them for about a year you still are complaining about the producers promisses and al the advertisments you fell for.
And still you claim your right to charge back your money...
[Sarcasm off]

Please realize that in every other case you just throw away the product and get over with it.

Sorry 4 getting off topic again.
I didn't post before 'cause I didn't want to add to that CW, but enough is enough!

I waited several long years for another game of MW.
MW:O is not perfect and probably never will. I still use Windows OS though it has the same issues for decades!!!!!!!
It's fun to play and atm it plays well.
Instead of not playing a Mechwarrior Game for another 2-15 years I for my part am happy to have this.
Instead of complaining about the catering and bad organisation at the Opening I am surprized they even tried to have one while some forum member are still giving their best to turn down every move they try.
Sure there were another announcements. And history showed they had their problems with their timeline.
But hey! If you all take every announcement for granted, how do you find time to live for every politician or friend or salesmen who break promisses every once in a while.

Enjoy it or leave it!
Stop wasting you lives.

your post is incoherent, it's just a bunch of rambling sentences.

[Myssi]

Nekki Basara, on 28 September 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

Are you aware of any way to get a founder's refund beyond a chargeback and the associated ban?

Beyond chargebacks one could contact Better Business Bureau or Consumer Protection British Columbia and start a complaint process if they feel that the initial response they got for their refund request wasn't satisfactory.

E; hypothetically of course, if there were a company in Vancouver, for example, that the customer wasn't satisfied with.

Edited by Myssi, 28 September 2013 - 08:11 AM.

[Gregory Owen]

Myssi, on 28 September 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

Beyond chargebacks one could contact Better Business Bureau or Consumer Protection British Columbia and start a complaint process if they feel that the initial response they got for their refund request wasn't satisfactory.

E; hypothetically of course, if there were a company in Vancouver for example that the customer wasn't satisfied with.

BBB has no actual power and is no more than a place to file a complaint with.


I don't think you guys understand, that money was spent a year ago and is gone. anyone who attempts to get a refund now is just an *******.


call your bank and ask for a charge back on something you bought last year, they are literally going to laugh at you.

[Myssi]

Gregory Owen, on 28 September 2013 - 08:13 AM, said:

I don't think you guys understand, that money was spent a year ago and is gone. anyone who attempts to get a refund now is just an *******.

Maybe, but thankfully we still live in a society where that decision is up to each individual themselves. If they want to pursue their refund they can.
And if the places where someone files their complaints agree with that, there will be no refunds and end of process. Simple as that.

[Mystere]

I don't understand why people find it necessary to announce to the whole wide world what they intend to do or not do with something they have purchased over a year ago. MANY OF US JUST DON'T CARE. DO WHAT YOU THINK YOU MUST DO.

But, please do everyone else a favor. Just leave quietly.

[Heffay]

Well, less than 300 people have asked for refunds on their Project Phoenix purchases. It's not like people are lined up banging on their doors demanding refunds with pitchforks and torches in their hands.

[Myssi]

Mystere, on 28 September 2013 - 08:34 AM, said:

I don't understand why people find it necessary to announce to the whole wide world what they intend to do or not do with something they have purchased over a year ago. MANY OF US JUST DON'T CARE. DO WHAT YOU THINK YOU MUST DO.

But, please do everyone else a favor. Just leave quietly.

Why are you announcing to the "whole wide world" that you just don't care?

And for future reference, I didn't announce anything. Just pointed out one possible way to pursue it for someone else.

[Mystere]

Myssi, on 28 September 2013 - 08:42 AM, said:

Why are you announcing to the "whole wide world" that you just don't care?

Well, I thought it was pretty obvious. But, I guess I was wrong. So here goes ...

How can you stop someone from doing something if no one tells them to?

Quote

And for future reference, I didn't announce anything. Just pointed out one possible way to pursue it for someone else.

What makes you think I was referring to you? There was a reason why I specifically did not quote you.

Edited by Mystere, 28 September 2013 - 08:52 AM.

[Myssi]

Mystere, on 28 September 2013 - 08:50 AM, said:

Well, I thought it was pretty obvious. But, I guess I was wrong. So here goes ...

How can you stop someone from doing something if no one tells them to?




What makes you think I was referring to you? There was a reason why I specifically did not quote you.

As much as I wish it would work, but random person telling other people on the internet to stop doing something just doesn't work.
And no, you weren't quoting me and I admit that I could have chosen my words \ quotes better. But it's the internet people, if you didn't refer to me I'm sure someone would eventually.
And like magic, I would have become one of those who keep screaming in every possible media how I want a refund from this and that.

[Heffay]

Myssi, on 28 September 2013 - 09:00 AM, said:

As much as I wish it would work, but random person telling other people on the internet to stop doing something just doesn't work.

So...why are you here then?

[Myssi]

Heffay, on 28 September 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

[/size]

So...why are you here then?

If you'd pay any attention you might have noticed that I came here, this time, to give information to someone else how they can pursue their refund.

But since you now noticed me after all, might you now take the time to explain to me how 1.3 million registered accounts are relevant to the game even if you can't remove your account and that number also includes all alt accounts, or how the users of /r/mwo and their increase relates to the games player base? Yes? No?

Edit; I don't see what you are even referring to with that quote. I haven't at any point told anyone to stop doing or do something. You could also explain this to me a bit more.

Edited by Myssi, 28 September 2013 - 09:15 AM.

[Lysander Voidrunner]

So you have an alarm rigged to topics where someone is in need of refund advice or do you trawl the forums looking for these poor souls by yourself? Thankless job for sure, but we're blessed to have such good samaritans around.

But since I got you here, I might as well use your help since you seem to have experience in doing exactly what I need. You see, I got this old worn pair of jeans, they're quite done I assure you but, they advertized that these were super comfortable, yet, when I wore them, I gained a few pounds and they were no longer comfortable so they obviously lied to me. I did, however, wear them but I would still like a full refund now.

This is exactly what you're doing. You're just arrogant enough to think that society has degenerated enough to cater to your every whim. Your knowledge of legal procedures in Canada (and by extention, British Columbia's legislation) is bordering on cartoonish and using offical sounding words won't mask that your motivation is that of an abusive consumer trying to sneak his way out of a purchase that used to it's full extent and now is looking for a loophole to weasle his way out of. No interpretation of Canadian law, anywhere, permits a refund after a year of use while accepting perceived and previously hithero hidden defects. That much is clear.

Secondly, the contents of the founders package were delivered as promissed within a timely manner, therefore, your whole argument is childish to the extreme. The "founders package" promissed items that were in fact delivered to you, of which you made use and. In essence, for being an early backer for the game, your got certain in-game items. Nowhere does it state, in concrete legally-binding EULA that the game would be as you perceived it at that time to be within a timeframe. The EULA is there for several reasons, one of them, being this particular scenario.

In the real world, that is a world gouverned by legislature and the application of the law, your case doesn't fly, it is, in effect, a lame duck. So either you are ignorant of the law to the point of comedic intrest or you are an agent provocateur for some reasons only known to you. Either way, doesn't look good fot you.

As for that signature banner you sport there, I weap for humanity when people are willing to take such a righteous moral stance when it comes to a game yet unable to do so when their freedoms and liberties are trampled upon by gouvernments. Where's your banner denouncing Guantanamo? Where's the banner denouncing the G20's treatment of the 3rd world? Where's the Banner for anything else than a free-to-play video game? Shame on you for usurping the moral high ground for such trivial matters but also to do so with such hilariously bad comprehension of consumer law.

[FlipOver]

Myssi, on 28 September 2013 - 09:13 AM, said:

If you'd pay any attention you might have noticed that I came here, this time, to give information to someone else how they can pursue their refund.

But since you now noticed me after all, might you now take the time to explain to me how 1.3 million registered accounts are relevant to the game even if you can't remove your account and that number also includes all alt accounts, or how the users of /r/mwo and their increase relates to the games player base? Yes? No?

Edit; I don't see what you are even referring to with that quote. I haven't at any point told anyone to stop doing or do something. You could also explain this to me a bit more.

I appreciate your attempt but, like the last 2 times, he will just ignore that post. I believe it's your fault, you use too many words.

[Myssi]

Lysander Voidrunner, on 28 September 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

So you have an alarm rigged to topics where someone is in need of refund advice or do you trawl the forums looking for these poor souls by yourself? Thankless job for sure, but we're blessed to have such good samaritans around.

Nope, but I do follow this particular topic so I tend to see what's written here.

Quote

But since I got you here, I might as well use your help since you seem to have experience in doing exactly what I need. You see, I got this old worn pair of jeans, they're quite done I assure you but, they advertized that these were super comfortable, yet, when I wore them, I gained a few pounds and they were no longer comfortable so they obviously lied to me. I did, however, wear them but I would still like a full refund now.

Well, I would suggest the same I do here, if you don't see any difference between your analogy about the jeans and the situation in this game. Contact Consumer Protection. It's not my decision to decide the refunding of anything related to this game or your jeans.

Quote

This is exactly what you're doing. You're just arrogant enough to think that society has degenerated enough to cater to your every whim. Your knowledge of legal procedures in Canada (and by extention, British Columbia's legislation) is bordering on cartoonish and using offical sounding words won't mask that your motivation is that of an abusive consumer trying to sneak his way out of a purchase that used to it's full extent and now is looking for a loophole to weasle his way out of. No interpretation of Canadian law, anywhere, permits a refund after a year of use while accepting perceived and previously hithero hidden defects. That much is clear.

No, I don't have any knowledge about legal procedures in Canada, or in BC and I don't think I ever claimed to have any. I pointed out a way where to pursue these issues. That's why they are there, for people who don't know about legal procedures but feel that something has been done wrong. You can call me whatever you wish, arrogant or so. Doesn't have any impact on me.

Quote

Secondly, the contents of the founders package were delivered as promissed within a timely manner, therefore, your whole argument is childish to the extreme. The "founders package" promissed items that were in fact delivered to you, of which you made use and. In essence, for being an early backer for the game, your got certain in-game items. Nowhere does it state, in concrete legally-binding EULA that the game would be as you perceived it at that time to be within a timeframe. The EULA is there for several reasons, one of them, being this particular scenario.

In the real world, that is a world gouverned by legislature and the application of the law, your case doesn't fly, it is, in effect, a lame duck. So either you are ignorant of the law to the point of comedic intrest or you are an agent provocateur for some reasons only known to you. Either way, doesn't look good fot you.

My argument about what exactly? I don't think I've even mentioned the Founders pack here or that I am pursuing a refund. It's between me, PGI and the BBB and \ or CPBC or other places where I might possibly have contacted about matters regarding this game.

Quote

As for that signature banner you sport there, I weap for humanity when people are willing to take such a righteous moral stance when it comes to a game yet unable to do so when their freedoms and liberties are trampled upon by gouvernments. Where's your banner denouncing Guantanamo? Where's the banner denouncing the G20's treatment of the 3rd world? Where's the Banner for anything else than a free-to-play video game? Shame on you for usurping the moral high ground for such trivial matters but also to do so with such hilariously bad comprehension of consumer law.

If I were to sport a banner related to Guantanamo, G20 or 3rd world I would probably do it in some other forum than one about a computer game.
But no, I do not. Are you trying to influence me with your own morals here suggesting that I should? Surely you wouldn't do that, now would you.
And since the 3rd world and Guantanamo are what they are, are you sure that the world hasn't degraded?

If you take a banner in a signature as usurping a moral high ground then you do and there's nothing I can or will say to that. I'm sure it wouldn't matter to you though if I had a banner saying 'MWO is best game ever' with Atlas with fluffy bunny ears.
Are you trying to get me provoked by implying that I have made any remarks about consumer law? It isn't going to work.
Again, I pointed out for someone else what they might want to contact, if they feel like they want to pursue the issue further. Anything more than that is not true.

[Gregory Owen]

LOL Missy, I don't think you understand you are advocating fraud by suggesting that it is ok to do a chargeback.

they could ban you just for that.

[Myssi]

Gregory Owen, on 28 September 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

LOL Missy, I don't think you understand you are advocating fraud by suggesting that it is ok to do a chargeback.

they could ban you just for that.

Gergory Oewn, where have I talked about chargebacks?
I answered to a message that was specifically looking for a different way to pursue possible refunds other than chargebacks

[DeaconW]

Gregory Owen, on 28 September 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

LOL Missy, I don't think you understand you are advocating fraud by suggesting that it is ok to do a chargeback.

they could ban you just for that.

You keep sounding that "fraud" word as a taunt...but you are simply wrong. There is no fraud in disputing a charge for goods or services the purchaser legitimately believes he or she did not receive. It is a dispute. There are dispute resolution methods. Your bank has a vested interest to go to bat for you, not the seller. If the seller wants to invest time and effort in challenging the dispute, they may, but most (and apparently PGI fits this model) simply allow the chargeback and either demand the product back or cease the service.

It is clear to me that you are simply trying to be intimidating in order to w h i t e k n i g h t for PGI. If I had purchased *at lauch*, I might be inclined to agree with you...but all my money was paid in *beta*, which is clearly a "pre-final product" charge where I was *testing for PGI*. People have provided various examples to illustrate this transaction...I'll provide my own.

I hire a contractor to remodel my kitchen. He describes, in detail, what he intends to do. I pay him an initial payment, and several other payments along the way, just so the work keeps going, all the while becoming more and more concerned with the lack of progress. Finally he says he is "done" and it is horribly done. I then demand my money back for the entire job because it was improperly done. He declines, so I reverse the charges on the credit card I used for payment. Are you going to really say that would be "fraud" as well? To which I would respond, "I agree, the *contractor* committed fraud."

Edited by DeaconW, 28 September 2013 - 10:45 AM.