40 replies to this topic

[blood4blood]

Only one rule matters for PUG's - stick together/don't run off alone, unless you're scouting in a scout mech. Remember, teamwork is OP - stay close and focus fire, and you'll be a lot closer to winning, regardless of what map you're on or which route you take.

As for capping, well, as long as it's in the game, it's a legit (but boring) way to win. I've done it, I'm sure I'll do it again, mostly as a consequence of just pushing toward the enemy and finding no one home, as they tried to pull some clever flanking maneuver that just left them far afield and out of position to fight.

[Throe]

Just want to add one:

#?: Never follow your scouts. It's fine if you have your own plan, which just happens to take you in the same direction, but for your team's sake, don't assume your scouts are "leading the charge" just because they happen to be faster than everyone else. They can, and will, go places you can't, because 1) they're faster, and 2) many of them also have jump jets. Following them is a good way to end up both separated from your team and on the wrong side of the map. By the time you're able to rejoin the battle, the fighting will be over, and your scouts(and everyone else on your team) will be wondering why you were off chasing spiders...

[Viral Matrix]

LoL at this thread and its replies. Almost every response starts with, "i disagree".

The whole forums are like this really, as soon as someone puts up a thread, its like ppl cant wait to pick it apart. Ignoring totally the 99% positive and correct in the post to find some obscure view or rare circumstance when something doesnt follow the OPs statement.

Look at how lengthy the OP's post is, how often he hedges or tries to cover all circumstances, but it doesnt matter. Just making any statement, ever, in this 'community' will invite this kind of response.

[Throe]

Viral Matrix, on 01 October 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

LoL at this thread and its replies. Almost every response starts with, "i disagree".

The whole forums are like this really, as soon as someone puts up a thread, its like ppl cant wait to pick it apart. Ignoring totally the 99% positive and correct in the post to find some obscure view or rare circumstance when something doesnt follow the OPs statement.

Look at how lengthy the OP's post is, how often he hedges or tries to cover all circumstances, but it doesnt matter. Just making any statement, ever, in this 'community' will invite this kind of response.

I disagree...

[Puschk1n]

Haha, Throet, nice one ...

Pugs are pugs, it's hard to coordinate, I find it equally frustration to watch them each taking turns to peek over that damn ridge and losing armour. There are way more situations where each of your rules don't apply. When I read the thread title I thought of somethinge else:

Actually I think most players are well skilled by now and the effects on Assault are correlating with the effect that playing 12 vs 12 now has on gameplay on assault: Players learned to stick together by now and there seems to be a preferred route to go for each map and starting postion. If you try to cap, you get yelled at, if try to flank, you get yelled at. Unless you are a scout you are expected to join a mindless head-on melee or mexican standoff in the middle of the map where usually the more patient team wins because if one player of your team loses patience and charges, your only choice is to aid him or lose that mech. That's why I don't play Assault anymore, the matches are boring.

[William Radick]

Capping on assault and feeding off of the rage fills me with joy- Learn to scout/ defend and this kind of thing won't happen.

A win is a win.

I am really tired of people thinking that each team meeting in the same exact spot each time to face pummel each other is the only way to play this game (While I'm not suggesting the OP is advocating this )

Yes me and my 3 atlas buddies walked in a straight path, not slowing down to cap your base- how your entire team not noticing this or ignoring it when you scouts cry for help makes ME a bad player is beyond me.

[IllCaesar]

So I just got out of a match where in about two minutes the score went from 2 - 2 to 2 - 9. Yeah, I don't know how it happened exactly, because against my better judgment, I was flanking the enemy team in my Cicada instead of capping their base to draw attention away. Guess who ended up being the last alive capping their base while all hell is coming down around me? Yeah, me. Why did I not cap against my apparently better judgment? This thread's OP.

You may not like when the match ends like that, but its a W. Its what prevents the mode from being team deathmatch, so I'm not going to play the game like team deathmatch.

Don't get me wrong, point 1, 2, and 3 are actually pretty useful, I didn't realize how terrible of a decision those were until I saw this thread. Point 5 is common sense. Point 4, hell no.

[Ingvay]

Never go water in a PUG... on any map. Unless you're in a 4 or 8 man group with comms dropping into a PUG. Going water in a PUG is almost always a death sentence.

As for the capping issue...it's a component of the game and the OP has no right either way to tell people they shouldn't cap. One other factor is that capping now takes A LOT longer than before it was nerfed and you need to decide decisively whether the cap is necessary to win, because unlike before the nerf to capping.... they enemy has a better chance of getting back to stop the cap now. As long as it's in the game....a win is a win.

[TheSteelRhino]

Is this for real?

So what i read this as is that everyone should walk their mechs to a waypoi t in the middle of the map.
Present weapons!
Aim
Fire!

While standing in the open

This is a game that requires teamwork and at least a thought at strategy.
Yes I hate capping to , but if your force didnt bring any lights or fast meds/heavies then you probably deserved it

If your lights/meds dont respond to cap then they are not team players.

I feel your pain on some of this but there is no such thing as a perfect game. I aleeady can tell your idea of perfect doesnt match mine

[Darth Futuza]

Quote

4) IF YOU WANT TO CAP, PLAY CONQUEST.
there are exactly two situations in which capping is good manners. the first is an act of desperation. you're a lone mech who is able to outrun the remaining heavy mechs on the enemy team but not kill them, so cap as a LAST RESORT. the second is if you're the several heavies left vs 1 light mech who evades and shuts down so you cannot find him. in this situation everyone just wants the game to end, it has already been won. these two situations mirror each other but can work out perfect for either side depending on who decides what.

capping in any other situation is only polite as a distraction, used to split the enemy team before a push. if you out flank an enemy team DONT CAP. use the flank to kill them, as you'll earn more Cbills. ending the game early with a cap wastes everyone's time and doesnt reward you at all. it's about as dishonourable as you can get before you turn into a teamkiller.

I dunno...sure everyone gets less c-bills, but that's more of Piranha's fault aint it? They ought to reward a legitimate win more. Also I can figure like William Radick, a win is a win, and the team that doesn't take defense of their base into consideration is a failure of a team.

[Xmasterspy]

mikromancer, on 23 September 2013 - 08:24 PM, said:

4) IF YOU WANT TO CAP, PLAY CONQUEST.
Please just use some intelligence out there and I promise you that you'll earn a ton more Cbills.

I disagree with 4 as well.

The first screen when launching a match for Assault state: Win Conditions: First is "Capture enemy base", The second is "Destroy all enemy Mechs".

The next screen shows the rules for the match. Rules: First listed is "Capture the enemy base", second is "Destroy all enemy Mechs"

It does not say... everyone run to the middle and duke it out till no one is left alive.

I am sorry if you think that if people are not playing the way you want them to play is somehow "dishonorable".

Some people don't care about cbills. Some people only care about winning the match at all cost.

How about this.. Instead of complaining in the forum that people are not playing the way you want them to play, you actually stay back and guard your base so no lights can cap?

I do hope they add a game mode that is fight to the death. No caps, No timeout!

[Father Tork]

Rhinehardt Ritter, on 02 October 2013 - 09:23 AM, said:

Is this for real?

So what i read this as is that everyone should walk their mechs to a waypoi t in the middle of the map.
Present weapons!
Aim
Fire!

While standing in the open

This is exactly how I read the OP as well. And I find it just as inane...

[Bront]

Yeah, #4 is not very good advice.

Sure, folks complain about being capped, but the idea is that you, as a team, should try to play some base defense as well as offense. Assault is NOT deathmatch, and pretending it is and calling folks who cap names doesn't create a particularly good community.

That said, I personally rarely plan to do a cap race, but I know some folks do. I usually prefer to step on for a few moments to draw back the other team. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, and sometimes the extra cap time I had helped contribute to an eventual cap win.

[Zanathan]

While I don't personally like capping in assault to win as I prefer to shoot at the enemy with the upcoming CW, a win is a win. So getting your base captured is going to be a loss either way and players need to start learning how to co-ordinate and have defense strategies in place.

I can see PUGs getting owned pretty hard though given the trend for PUGs is to do their own thing.

[Geek Verve]

Bront, on 27 October 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

Yeah, #4 is not very good advice.

Sure, folks complain about being capped, but the idea is that you, as a team, should try to play some base defense as well as offense. Assault is NOT deathmatch, and pretending it is and calling folks who cap names doesn't create a particularly good community.

That logic just doesn't hold up. The trouble is, you're asking some players to stay behind and not participate in the fight *just in case* someone goes for an early, unnecessary cap. Then you consider that half the 0-0 cap games are the result of both teams traveling opposite directions at the start of the match, not encountering each other before they reach the enemy's base. What good will that 2-3 player or even full lance be against 10-12? It just doesn't work the way the maps are designed.

I played sporadically all day yesterday, and apparently no one told me it was Cap Fest Sunday. It sucked. BIG time.

Everyone knows what the OP is talking about with point #4 (though it was phrased in a manner to best open itself up to nit-pickers), and the point is valid. Sure, you get xp for capping, but in this game CBills are king, and you get squat in both regards for a cap. All you're doing with an early game cap is wasting everyone's time. The only people that should value such a win if they have any sense at all are the cappers, and I honestly can't fathom why. I've followed the herd to a 0-0 cap (kicking and screaming all the way), and got 25k+ CBills and < 200xp. An average win (considering all skill levels) on mech destruction yields around 100k CBills and at least 500xp. Component destruction, savior kills, salvage bonus, kills, kill assists, spotting bonuses, etc. *easily* add up to so much more than a cap bonus, I don't even know how it's open to debate. This is grade school math, here.

Tactical partial capping? Absolutely there is a place for that at any point in the match. However, when the "partial capper" remains on the base for a full cap just because no enemies can make it back to them in time, it's no longer a tactical maneuver. It's just an early-game cap, which merely aggravates people on both sides. Yeah, newsflash: as a rule, people on your own team don't like it, either.

Early game caps are like signing up for a prize fight and then avoiding your opponent the entire match by running circles around the ring, making him chase you. While I suppose it would be technically accurate to call it a tactic, that's not what 99% of the people involved in putting the match together would say.

When (if) PGI ever implements team deathmatch, I'll never play an assault mode match again.

Edited by Geek Verve, 28 October 2013 - 04:58 AM.

[Macbrea]

This will be fixed when Community warfare comes in and planets are can be captured for resources. At that point, players will see the value of defending their base. Assault will make more sense, if you lose the match you lose a percentage of the planet. Until eventually you lose the planet and any resource it might provide.

As it stands right now, players are just playing death matches with some annoying background tasks to grind c-bills for better mechs to grind c-bills with. There needs to be a purpose to that.

[Xmasterspy]

Geek Verve, on 28 October 2013 - 04:50 AM, said:

When (if) PGI ever implements team deathmatch, I'll never play an assault mode match again.

What "logic" are you talking about? It's like you think you're on a US soccer team, went to a soccer match, 10 seconds into the game you realize that everyone is playing US football, including your whole team. Then you are sitting back and complaining (or as you said "kicking and screaming") that no one else is playing soccer.

Under your own admittance you will "never play an assault mode match again" We get it, you don't like to play assault, but don't pretend that because you don't like it, that your way of playing is correct. Assault and Death Match are not the same game!!! Quit trying to make them that way.

I don't like to play assaults because people like you just want to go stand in the center and shoot until everyone is dead. That is boring as all hell to me and IMO wasting my time. Please see the first listed RULE and WIN condition for assault games. "Capture enemy base".

Where your logic is flawed, is that you believe everyone is thinking like you and just wants to run in the middle and shoot out! This is why you can't comprehend people defending a base or using some strategy to defend and hold your base.

Think about this... What if you got your whole entire team (even the lights) to just sit and guard your base.. What do you think would happen? My guess is, you will pick off the lights, then the mediums, and then the heavys as they file in one by one to get your base. You stopped them from accomplishing the first rule of assault and you get all your kills. win win win!

I am not saying that the above is the only way to play it, just one strategy you could use.

I don't always play assaults, but when I do, I play lights and only capture the open base.

[Darth Futuza]

Quote

Everyone knows what the OP is talking about with point #4 (though it was phrased in a manner to best open itself up to nit-pickers)

We're not nit-picking, we legitimately consider capping during assault a valid strategy. His suggestion was fundamentally flawed, not phrased oddly.

All the other points were great though!

Edited by Darth Futuza, 28 October 2013 - 01:58 PM.

[Geek Verve]

Xmasterspy, on 28 October 2013 - 08:35 AM, said:

What "logic" are you talking about? It's like you think you're on a US soccer team, went to a soccer match, 10 seconds into the game you realize that everyone is playing US football, including your whole team. Then you are sitting back and complaining (or as you said "kicking and screaming") that no one else is playing soccer.

I stopped reading there, because it's clear you refuse to accept the fact that the vast majority of the assault match player base has nothing but contempt for early capping. My opinion doesn't matter. All you have to do is pay attention in game chat when it happens. Your analogy is way off. It's more like everyone but a player or two on both teams wants a different game.

The rewards for capping are miniscule compared to what one receives for actually participating in combat. I can go 0-kills, 0-assists and 0-damage and earn nearly as much reward as the player who capped for the win. The end result is a huge waste of time - the win isn't even relevant at that point.

No one likes spending half or more of a match traipsing back and forth across a map without seeing any action.

You can repeat the fact that it is part of the game mode design all you want, and you're absolutely correct on that point. The fact remains that the rest of the player base (which, again, is the vast majority) wishes early cappers would just go away. It just wastes everyone's time and robs them of the game's lifeblood - C-Bills.

Edited by Geek Verve, 30 October 2013 - 09:52 AM.

[Zerberus]

I read the OP, and one thing was instantly clear.

There is a comment about being "shunted into ELO hell for some ungodly reason", and what appears to be a lack of understanding of how the OP`s own playstyle directly influences this.

To put it bluntly, you (and many others) are not playing to WIN, you are playing to farm c-bills / shoot stompy robots, while many others on the other hand are playing specifically to WIN (= raise their Elo)

And that is the entire reason why you lose, and why you and others are in what you refer to as "Elo Hell".

Edited by Zerberus, 30 October 2013 - 09:57 AM.