211 replies to this topic

[Lily from animove]

Marack Drock, on 06 October 2014 - 01:46 PM, said:

Again no. Think of this logically.

If we destroy all Super Natural stuff in the series. We are left with some the Empire as the most powerful super nation/faction. BUT
Here is again my equation based on ALL the movies. You watch them for yourself and you will see the biggest flaw in sense ever.

Ewoks>Empire<>Rebel Alliance>Jedi>Abeloth>Universe

So this means in terms of English:
Ewoks are better than Empire (Star Wars 6), Rebel are equal to or less than Empire (Star War 4 and 5), Jedi are worse than Empire (Star Wars 3, it only took 7 to kill a High Council Member... that is pitiful), Jedi defeated Abeloth (therefore they are greater), and Abeloth was able to manipulate the galaxy (therefore super being and based in the books of Star Wars and we also have Anakin defeated the Ones in the Animated Series which is Canon).

So this means that Ewoks are greater than the Galaxy because of the Math of them being better than the Empire, which is better than the Jedi, which were better than Abeloth, which was able to control Black Holes and stuff. We also have Star Wars 6, Luke Skywalker (a later Jedi Master and apprentice of Yoda) being captured by Ewoks. So.... Ewoks are the gods of Star Wars.... George Lucas's brain allowed Ewoks to be better than the universe.

Kailmaster do the math please. Just watch the Canon movies and that is all you need to see that the only threat there is to BattleTech are Ewoks.

Edit- Also Stormtroopers are so bad a shot they 30 or 40 couldn't hit Han Solo in AN OPEN ROOM! HAN KILLED 2 OF THEM AND NEVER GOT HIT! BY 30! They are the equivalent of the A-Team.

BT wins because their only threat are Ewoks.

My Arguments Are purely Star Wars vs BT right now. Star Trek wins hands down just because of the Klingons and Cardassians.

woah actually i think about ewokes rpelacign those furries



thats how it would look like xD

[Strum Wealh]

Still, I maintain Star Trek doesn't really belong in this discussion because most of Trek factions lack any significant ground forces beyond infantry.

Specifically, every other listed franchise can bring some sort of mecha to the fight:

• MWO/BT - BattleMechs, ProtoMechs, and Battle Armor (e.g. Elementals)
  
• Pacific Rim - Jaegers
  
• Halo - Covenant Scarabs (T-36 & T-47) & Locusts & Harvesters, UNSC Cyclopes & Mantises, and powered armor (e.g. the MJOLNIR armors used by the SPARTAN-IIs)
  
• Star Wars - any of a rather long list of walkers from various factions & times

By contrast, Star Trek focuses almost exclusively on aerospace assets (for which there was a longer, far more detailed thread), with the only ground combat vehicles described being a Klingon Ground Assault Vehicle, some fairly-basic tanks, a Kolaran Armored Car (which was basically a 1950s British APC), and some lightly-armed buggies (at best, the equivalent of the Warthog from Halo).

[990Dreams]

Strum Wealh, on 07 October 2014 - 03:55 PM, said:

Still, I maintain Star Trek doesn't really belong in this discussion because most of Trek factions lack any significant ground forces beyond infantry.

And I maintain my stance that they have phasers that can vaporize a small mountain. That alone can qualify their infantry (to a degree).

[Strum Wealh]

DavidHurricane, on 07 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

And I maintain my stance that they have phasers that can vaporize a small mountain. That alone can qualify their infantry (to a degree).

Not as hand-held weapons, they don't!

• "Hand-held phasers were also used by Starfleet personnel as tools and not just weapons. The phaser could be used to heat rocks and stones for warmth. While there were specialized tools like phaser bores and phaser drills, Worf once used his type-2 phaser to open a tunnel on the Cardassian planet Celtris III. A phaser, when fired together with another in tandem or set to a high setting could create an opening in a solid rock wall."
  
• "The normal maximum setting on a hand phaser would vaporize a humanoid lifeform or a Human-size android with a single hit."
  
• "The standard level 16 setting on a type 2 phaser could be used to vaporize tunnels through rock large enough to crawl through. The level 16 wide-field setting could easily destroy half of a large building with a single shot. However there were materials phasers couldn't cut through even at this maximum level, such as toranium and the unknown material used to create the Hotel Royale on Theta VIII."
  
• "There were several numbered types of phasers of increasing size and capability: types 1, 2, and 3 were personnel phasers, and types 4 and above were ship-mounted weapons."

At best, handheld phasers were only capable of "vaporizing rock to widen an opening in a lava tube partially blocked by rubble", and even specialized tools like the phaser bore could only dig through 20 meters of rock per minute (or 0.33 meters of rock per second); nothing short of a high-grade starship-mounted phaser would even come close to being able to "vaporize a small mountain" in any meaningful timeframe.

Also, it should be noted that most of Trek - particularly & most prominently, Starfleet - seems to have zero concept of combat-capable body armor; even their space marine analogues don't wear significant (or, really, any) armor. And when is the last time that the security officers - in any Trek series - wore even so much as a basic flak jacket (much less one made out of one of the several phaser-resistant materials)?

Trek infantry may have the capacity for substantial firepower (dual-wielding high-setting phasers), but said capacity is nowhere near as great as previously believed, and their squishiness (because they generally don't use any body armor) means that powered-armor-equipped ground forces of BT & Halo would mow them down before they got the chance to actually employ said firepower - to say nothing of mecha-equipped forces.

Each of the other listed franchises is designed to be stronger in pure ground combat and weaker in aerospace combat, while Star Trek (both in terms of individual major factions, and as a whole) is very much the opposite (that is, Trek is very strong in aerospace combat and very weak in pure ground combat).

Edited by Strum Wealh, 08 October 2014 - 08:19 AM.

[Nightmare1]

The answer is obviously Chuck Norris, duh!

[Hex Pallett]

Is this still going on...?

Edited by Helmstif, 08 October 2014 - 08:22 PM.

[Infiltrationist]

(Before you read this know its a joke)

Tribbles win. They'll kill everyone with cuteness. MUHAHAHA!

[Sizzles]

As much as I hate to admit it, Star Trek would hands down destroy everything.

There is an explanation somewhere that goes into great detail why ST would be untouchable to SW ships, something about the shields and lasers. -I'll see if i can find it- MWO/BattleTech would get wasted in space, and orbital bombardment would clean up ground forces.

As for dealing with the halo and pacific rim crap, Kirk could go and find Flynn Taggart -cookies if you know who that is- who would then emasculate and eviscerate Master Chief, destroy all the halos, then slaughter the Kaiju with his bare hands. (think of all the guts!)

Now, the only hope that MWO/BT has in this, is to get Sun Tzu Liao, Katherine Steiner-Davion, Vladimir Ward, and maybe Thomas Halas to BURY Kirk and his people in red tape. So much so that they wouldn't be able to do anything. Then have them then get stabbed in the back by their own government, and then sent a bomb as an apology.

Edited by Sizzles, 11 October 2014 - 08:51 PM.

[Rogue Jedi]

Sizzles, on 11 October 2014 - 08:50 PM, said:

As much as I hate to admit it, Star Trek would hands down destroy everything.

There is an explanation somewhere that goes into great detail why ST would be untouchable to SW ships, something about the shields and lasers

unfortunately there are also explanations as to why the Enterprise would not stand a chance against a single TIE Fighter, there are unreasoning fanatics on both sides of that debate,

my personal belief is that the vastly superior sub-light speed of Trek ships (Trek all ships can achieve 25% speed of light or mach 220435 vs Wars no ship can reach mach 4) a Wars ship would not even be able to hit a Trek ship (because you can clearly see in the Wars films "Laser" and "Blaster" fire traveling across the screen, meaning they move at way less than 25% speed of light). so regardless of firepower and hull strength of the Wars Ships the huge speed disadvantage and lack of particle shields for Wars means the Trek ships should win.

however I still believe this would result in cross universe alliances so no single universe would win (e.g. the Federation allying with the Rebel Alliance, Federated Commonwealth and the Pacific Rim alliance)

[Infiltrationist]

Marack Drock, on 11 October 2014 - 02:05 PM, said:

They aren't cute.

Well aren't you a killjoy.

When I was walking through Barnes and noble I saw Battletech. A complete remastered version of it too. I thought it was interesting cuz I haven't seen it on shelves in years.

[990Dreams]

Mr Psycho, on 12 October 2014 - 11:57 AM, said:

When I was walking through Barnes and noble I saw Battletech. A complete remastered version of it too. I thought it was interesting cuz I haven't seen it on shelves in years.

Like. Much Want. Wow.

[Infiltrationist]

Marack Drock, on 12 October 2014 - 12:58 PM, said:

WHEN WAS THAT! MUST GO GET! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE

Who's gonna play a board game with anyone anymore though? *sudden revelation* Oh you could keep it as a collectible and keep it on a shelf somewhere as it becomes more valuable. Imma go back and get it. Hope it's still there!

[Infiltrationist]

Ah that's cool.

[Nebfer]

Halo Spartans in any form of their powered armor are boned when they face any form of B-tech battle armor, even though they are better in some aspects.

Suits as the Gray Death scout, Night Hawk 21, or even the Tornado are the closest to what the Spartans powered armor is capable of in terms of armor and fire power.

The only real significant advantage they have over B-techs armor is shields (later models, though their over all effectiveness is debatable), better lifting capacity, support for an AI, better ground speeds, and long term operations due to the use of a fusion reactor (even so B-tech can easily swap out batterys in a few min with a fresh one and recharge used ones in under 2 hours.

Even the suits which just use armored gloves (can only use infantry weapons, and the ones I mentioned), have equal to better armor, and even B-tech infantry weapons out class halos (out side of bog standard auto rifles, even then thats arguable), at the lest they can be equipped with near identical weapons... Even So a Gray Death Scout suit armed with a Semi or full auto pulse laser rifle with a built in grenade launcher, has a lot more firepower than a Spartan with their standard issue Assault rifle. Heh Spartans would probably be crying foul when facing a squad armed with heavy auto grenade launchers.

Never mind the heavier suits with their built in weapons, battle armor armed with MGs would be roughly equivalent to a spartan running around with the Warthogs rotary 50 cal MG. Small lasers would be spartan lasers on crack with far more ammo...

Then theirs the fact that battletech has legions of them, a single B-tech post 3080 era Fed Suns LCT could bring more BA to the front than the UNSC has Spartans.


Scenario
32 B-tech troopers in Gray Death Scout suits have occupied a Forerunner facility (similar to the ones in the Halo 4 level shutdown), UNSC forces have to route them out, They have 100 spartan IVs equipped with their typical gear, can they route them out?

The B-tech troopers are armed with
16x laser pistols
16x pulse laser pistols
32x Combat knifes
6x M42B Combat systems
6x M61 Laser Combat System
6x Pulse laser rifles with grenade launchers
6x Auto Shotguns
4x two shot SRM launchers
-4x Gyrojet rifles, with Guidance modules
4x Heavy Auto Grenade launchers
Hand grenades
Rocket Assisted Grenades

If they can not do it how many Spartan IVs, would it take? They fly in on their transports, and land at the entrance, then storm the facility.

Bonus, how many UNSC Marines?

Edited by Nebfer, 18 October 2014 - 09:20 PM.

[Yilang Chen]

The might of the God Emperor perish them all. End of story.

[KHAN ATTAKHAN]

mechs definately on the ground, in space have we forgotten hrothgar ships, and Clans and IS did have massive space platforms/ battlestations to fight and launch from so they'd probably go toe to toe withth SW, ST will probably win out due to transporting tech though, hand to hand, no contest, clan warriors were genetically altered for mental and physical superiority, also we'd cheat using battle suits.

P.S. how do you add pics to posts. thanks in advance

Edited by ATTAKHAN666, 18 October 2014 - 10:45 PM.

[990Dreams]

ATTAKHAN666, on 18 October 2014 - 10:36 PM, said:

mechs definately on the ground, in space have we forgotten hrothgar ships, and Clans and IS did have massive space platforms/ battlestations to fight and launch from so they'd probably go toe to toe withth SW, ST will probably win out due to transporting tech though, hand to hand, no contest, clan warriors were genetically altered for mental and physical superiority, also we'd cheat using battle suits.

P.S. how do you add pics to posts. thanks in advance

Insert pics:

[img]Paste picture URL here[/img]

Yes, BT has space combat platforms, but Star Trek and/or Star Wars has more and vastly better space combat platforms.

[Infiltrationist]

DavidHurricane, on 19 October 2014 - 04:34 AM, said:

Insert pics:

[img]Paste picture URL here[/img]

Yes, BT has space combat platforms, but Star Trek and/or Star Wars has more and vastly better space combat platforms.

True that!

[Infiltrationist]

Nebfer, on 18 October 2014 - 09:18 PM, said:

Scenario
32 B-tech troopers in Gray Death Scout suits have occupied a Forerunner facility (similar to the ones in the Halo 4 level shutdown), UNSC forces have to route them out, They have 100 spartan IVs equipped with their typical gear, can they route them out?

The B-tech troopers are armed with
16x laser pistols
16x pulse laser pistols
32x Combat knifes
6x M42B Combat systems
6x M61 Laser Combat System
6x Pulse laser rifles with grenade launchers
6x Auto Shotguns
4x two shot SRM launchers
-4x Gyrojet rifles, with Guidance modules
4x Heavy Auto Grenade launchers
Hand grenades
Rocket Assisted Grenades

If they can not do it how many Spartan IVs, would it take? They fly in on their transports, and land at the entrance, then storm the facility.

Bonus, how many UNSC Marines?

It's kind of funny how it's only the UNSC you talk about. UNSC would just throw in a couple of havok tac nukes.

[Infiltrationist]

At what a bunch of nuked mechs? Unless the unsc decided to stay behind after nuking it. In which that case they would have a bunch of forerunner weapon systems to defend themselves.