164 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Shadey99, on 11 October 2013 - 05:44 AM, said:

Except BT was never about 'traditional fighting forces'... Even with infantry and vehicles besides mechs. If you wanted to 'scout' aerospace units were quicker (and had several airborne recon models) or if you needed to get up close hover scouts or other aerodynes were the best choice. Light mechs were a step up from those and had a higher combat ability, much like 20 ton 'light tanks' did. It took the clans before a true 'I'm not for combat' light mech with truly lightning fast speed would exist.

you do understand that nearly every battle in the novels was based on military engagements from History right? So most every Mech was designed to have a specific role including Mechs like the Ostscout... which included versions with no weapons at all. I think you are wrong about what qualifies as a traditional fighting force.

[Karl Streiger]

3rdworld, on 11 October 2013 - 05:48 AM, said:

The cool thing about mechwarrior, we don't have to use mechs how the TRO's say they were used....in a make believe universe....based on a table top game.

And the really cool thing - 50% of all light Mechs will have the chances of a snowflake in hell in MWO (Battle Hawk, Hammer, Thorn, Hornet...- Valkyrie, UrbanMech .even lower as the Commando with hardly any armor)....
the only chance for there survival is that they got this HSR feature - that is the only reason for this discussion.

[3rdworld]

Karl Streiger, on 11 October 2013 - 05:54 AM, said:

And the really cool thing - 50% of all light Mechs will have the chances of a snowflake in hell in MWO (Battle Hawk, Hammer, Thorn, Hornet...- Valkyrie, UrbanMech .even lower as the Commando with hardly any armor)....
the only chance for there survival is that they got this HSR feature - that is the only reason for this discussion.

Jenner hit reg isn't worse than any other mech, and they are easily the most powerful light in the game. So I do not agree with you.

Better mech models & hitboxes can make them all useful (except ballistic based lights). PGI seems to be getting better on this front, but many (all lights not the jenner) of the lights are already screwed and need complete model/hitbox overhauls.

[Saiyajin12]

This just in: a light with long ranged weapon(s) can kill a brawler chassis of anything slower without it ever being able to attack back! Oh and LRM boats with no backup do nothing to you if you get within 180m! Dat dying breed of splatcat (six SRM6s) cannot hit you if you stay out of 270m!

Doesn't make anything really op though, just learn to deal with it or play a build that can do everything but nothing well. Having heavy, slow firing weapons will make killing lights more difficult unless your aim is really good or the lights are piloting poorly, because if it does hit, they're really feeling the hurt (can be one shotted). The game has plenty of anti fast moving mech weapons, like streaks and pulse lasers (even normal lasers work ok).

TL:DR Lights are not OP. Rubber banding with lag shield might be, but having felt that too much in a long while now.

Edited by Saiyajin12, 11 October 2013 - 06:03 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

3rdworld, on 11 October 2013 - 06:00 AM, said:

Jenner hit reg isn't worse than any other mech, and they are easily the most powerful light in the game. So I do not agree with you.

The Jenner is fast and mobile... i don't think that a Hammer with 110kph will have any chances

[Mackman]

kongman, on 10 October 2013 - 05:26 PM, said:

as I said , after doing some more reading , its clear , its not the lights , but game mechanics , it also does help im in Australia , with a ping of 250 ms all the time another problem is , most mechs cant track lights fast enough , the lights will circle jerk you to death and theres not a dam thing you can do about it , and most of the time they will sit in your blind spot so they wont show up of friendly radar

Ooooh, so you're one of those people who will endlessly just circle in the same direction for 60 seconds while a light pecks you to death! Let me guess... after you die to a light without managing to hit him once, do you then go to all-chat and say something like "THANKS TEAM FOR LEAVING ME TO DIE" and then ragequit before anyone can say anything?

[Shadey99]

Joseph Mallan, on 11 October 2013 - 05:52 AM, said:

you do understand that nearly every battle in the novels was based on military engagements from History right? So most every Mech was designed to have a specific role including Mechs like the Ostscout... which included versions with no weapons at all. I think you are wrong about what qualifies as a traditional fighting force.

And the Ostscout was basically super rare in 3050, most existing models being from Star League Caches. Hence it was almost never used...


As for the books... I was never heavily involved in the books, the early ones (like the Wolfs Dragoon civil war, Grey Death trilogy, and a handful of others) certainly had little to do with any 'real world' battles I've ever heard of.

[Joseph Mallan]

Karl Streiger, on 11 October 2013 - 06:03 AM, said:

The Jenner is fast and mobile... i don't think that a Hammer with 110kph will have any chances

Um...

Quote

HMR-3C - Called the Claw-Hammer, the 3C is built to make the Hammer capable of better defending itself when an enemy closes on the battlefield. This is done by removing one of the LRM launchers and replacing it with four additional Medium Lasers, which gives the Hammer the ability to attack the enemy with an overwhelming laser barrage at close ranges. This variant also works well as a bodyguard 'Mech in a lance of Hammer 'Mechs.

Just sayin'.


@Shadey:
Hence the inclusion of the words Nearly an Most.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 11 October 2013 - 06:08 AM.

[CooloutAC]

DocBach, on 10 October 2013 - 05:55 PM, said:

Beagle Active Probe, it cancels out an ECM in its bubble, which can let you use Streak missiles against a target protected by ECM.

tks Doc.

[Mehlan]

Ok barrio ping test for those that think 'ping' might be affecting their combat.... alt-tab out of game if you can. Click start-run type in 'cmd' and hit enter. In the window that pops up type 'ping [color="#b27204"]www.google.com[/color] -n 250' and hit enter. Then if you could, don't mind.... post the packets sent/received & and the minimum, maximum and avg ping times (There will be a summary at the bottom once it completes the ping... it'll take a few seconds-minute or so to run through) example: sent =4, rcvd 4 lost = 0. min = 56, max 59, avg 57 (Note: In your case sent should = 250)

[Clit Beastwood]

I'm at work so I can't get them myself - does anyone have the IP subnet for the MWO servers? I know that I can ping other servers in canada (I'm in So. Cal) and get 40-60ms pings, but my ping to the MWO servers is always 90-130. Except when my wife starts a netlix movie, that bumped me to 3500 (yeesh!).

[PEEFsmash]

"Lights Need To Be Nerfed" (not a single bit of content in OP) unmoderated for 2 straight days.

"Heavies Need To Be Nerfed" Jettisoned in 30 minutes: http://mwomercs.com/...d-to-be-nerfed/
"Assaults Need To Be Nerfed" Jettisoned in 30 minutes: http://mwomercs.com/...d-to-be-nerfed/

Edited by PEEFsmash, 11 October 2013 - 10:33 AM.

[Clit Beastwood]

PEEFsmash, on 11 October 2013 - 10:32 AM, said:

"Lights Need To Be Nerfed" (not a single bit of content in OP) unmoderated for 2 straight days.

"Heavies Need To Be Nerfed" Jettisoned in 30 minutes: http://mwomercs.com/...d-to-be-nerfed/
"Assaults Need To Be Nerfed" Jettisoned in 30 minutes: http://mwomercs.com/...d-to-be-nerfed/

Well I don't know about you, PEEF - but I use lights to distract the bigs in-game... seems to be working IRL as well

[Nryrony]

Joseph Mallan, on 11 October 2013 - 05:47 AM, said:

However those units are not in MWO... Yet. The designs we do have were designed for scouting & raiding.

Mine was advertised as an "aggressor",and I can't find anything in here about that scouting part...

Edited by Nryrony, 11 October 2013 - 10:45 AM.

[Nik Van Rhijn]

I'm so sad that we never get "Mediums should be nerfed" threads - shows just how bad a place most people think they are.
Having fun in my Founders;
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...fad4c68ead2d191
Use it to trail the blob and help the fatties against lights or base defend against lights.
Yes I know, you shouldn't put an XL in an HBK, but I get bored and its fun.

[Ngamok]

FupDup, on 10 October 2013 - 06:24 PM, said:

Every time somebody asks for nerfs to lights, Kerensky kills an Urbanmech.

Now I know why they aren't in the game yet.

[MischiefSC]

Since the two posts Peef made got junked while this one remained, Imma copy-pasta my response in one of those to here.

All the above was sarcasm btw.

Lights don't need 'nerfed'. Lights are *hard* to do WELL in. They require a lot of focus and energy and attention and one KTO-18 with BAP and 5 Streaks will wreck them in piles. They are dangerous in wolfpacks - so are atlases. Just that 1 or 2 atlases can normally wreck face together all day long where as it takes 4 or 5 spiders/Jenners to do the same. It's the tendency of lights to travel in tight-knit and mutually-supportive packs that makes them dangerous. It's the pilots not being foolish, not the mechs themselves. Yes, it's hard to hit a spider traveling at 151kph. It has less torso armor than your heavy has on its arm. If it wasn't hard to hit it'd just be a free kill.

The problem isn't the mechs, the problem is the pilots. When in a light you're painfully aware of how vulnerable you are and so you have to play more intelligently and you're keenly aware of the help your fellow pilots provide. Hell yes my 5D spider uses his ECM bubble to scoot back and protect allies when the LRMs start to fall and when my team is moving in on the enemy I scamper around the back to throw that disruptive ECM field over the enemy LRM boats to give my guys time to advance. Doing so will create that big, disorganized brawl I can exploit to do real damage. I see someone chasing a fellow light I take the opportunity to light his back up because I know that other light pilot will probably do the same for me.

Bluntly people tend to pilot better in a light. They have to, they're playing in Hardcore mode where one hit kills them. It's not the mechs though, it's the pilots. When Heavy/Assault pilots play with the same focus as Light pilots they get called syncdropping tryhards. I dropped with 3 friends in 4 Atlases, all on our A-game and we rolled 23 games of straight victory. I'm not that great a pilot but being focused and working tight with a team trumps every single other factor in the game.

Lights just have to do that all the time to break even.

[Mack1]

kongman, on 10 October 2013 - 04:34 PM, said:

just as the title says , lights need to be nerfed in a huge way .nothing more to add really .

Let me educate you on the history of this game and then you will fully understand why it's currently in this mess.

Infact I CBA so here is the short version:

Devs run mainly lights, we used to have a chance against them with knock downs and LRM's and boating lasers but they took all that out the game ages ago.

Lights will always be easymode with this set of devs in charge.

[ObsidianSpectre]

Threads like these make me very tempted to create a new alt account and run around in a Jenner for a while in the low ELOs. What must the environment be like in the games that these people play that they think lights are OP?

[stjobe]

Joseph Mallan, on 11 October 2013 - 04:42 AM, said:

Quote

the COM-1A Commando its second own developed BattleMech for the LCAF and one of the first ever, that was suited for reconnaissance.

Just wanted to point out that the COM-1A is an obsolete variant (that incidentally also isn't in MWO). Even so, they did manage to take out 55-tonners, according to the fluff. The part you quoted continues:

Quote

Much lighter and faster than their precursors, though they still used primitive BattleMech technology, Commandos were able to destroy much heavier Kuritan Gladiators during the first large-scale battle between BattleMechs in 2475 on Nox.

As someone else pointed out, the "standard" Commando is the 2D, and it's a Striker:

Quote

the Commando's profile was radically changed with the introduction of the sophisticated COM-2D variant in 2486, that exchanged the laser weaponry with short range missiles and turned the machine into a striker. With four tons the armor is too light to allow a stand-up fight with heavier enemies, but it excels at hit-and-run tactics and as a scout hunter.

And before anyone jumps on that line about four tons of armour - nobody is asking for lights to stand face to face with heavier enemies and win; what people want is for them to (continue to) be able to win a mobile fight where they can use their speed and mobility advantage.

Edited by stjobe, 11 October 2013 - 02:40 PM.