251 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

KharnZor, on 11 February 2014 - 01:46 PM, said:

Better to necro than make another thread

I wasn't exactly complaining, just shocked to see it revived.

[OneEyed Jack]

Sean Crees, on 11 February 2014 - 11:53 AM, said:

I think what you are see'ing is the bug where people hit your front armor, and for some reason the game applies said damage to your rear armor of the same location.

I have seen this before where i'll get shot in the front and it'll apply the damage to the rear where i either have very little, or depending on the game, no armor left on the back and it goes straight to structure.

Also some of the hit boxes for rear locations are able to be hit from the front of the mech.

So its really a combination problem of rear hitboxes being able to be hit from the front, and a bug that sometimes applies front damage to the rear.

No. I'm well aware of that issue, and it does not apply here. He shot from the front and the damage was applied to the front. I'm not an idiot... most of the time, and can tell the difference between my front and rear armor on the paper doll. But thanks for your theory telling me the damage was really applied somewhere other than where I already stated the armor was stripped from.

[SirLANsalot]

My RIFLEMAN build on the Firebrand is far more deadly then the AC 40 nooblets. It just takes more piloting and gunnery skill to use then a 40 system. Also is a ton more fun.

[FactorlanP]

While I don't claim to be an high Elo God, like many who post on these forums, I really don't think AC40 mechs are a problem.

Sure it sucks if one gets close and pounds you, but they seem awfully easy to kill to me.

Edited by FactorlanP, 13 February 2014 - 08:32 PM.

[xMEPHISTOx]

FactorlanP, on 13 February 2014 - 08:32 PM, said:

While I don't claim to be an high Elo God, like many who post on these forums, I really don't think AC40 mechs are a problem.

Sure it sucks if one gets close and pounds you, but they seem awfully easy to kill to me.

With the xl engine and high heat they are evened out, and no where near being OP as some may claim. As with most things it is a matter of perspective, those who think that they are OP are possibly just bad and are not doing it right when it comes to fighting this very fragile mecha.

[MERC Mournblade]

AC40 mechs can do poorly if forced to be frontline (if assaults are at the back not doing their job). They're targeted by enemies with religious zealousness, but if piloted right can be the perfect bait and slam mechs if in a coordinated premade. I've piloted AC40 jagers since jagers first came out. The constant nerfs have done little to slow me down... but then again I'm not endlessly shooting like a madman like I used to.

I understand that 40 pinpoint damage is a bit much, but Jagers do have distinct weaknesses that can be exploited.

[Rushin Roulette]

40 pin point damage is OP?

Damn... why isnt anyone complaining about this mech then?


Its faster, better armoured and has an even higher pinpoint alpha than the AC40 Jäger and it isnt dependant on ammunition. The high mounted weapons also mean that the Hunchie can shoot with exposing just as little as the Jägermech, the Standard Engine also allows for better survivability and the backup lasers (the ones in the arm) can aim horizontally instead of only limited to the torso crosshairs.

the best thing is it is just about completely stock (only thing changed is the Engine, ES, DHS and one laser upgraded).

Edited by Rushin Roulette, 14 February 2014 - 02:55 AM.

[Nryrony]

Lubalin, on 20 October 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

2 shots from an AC40 Jagermech at like 500m and my atlas has lost 2/3 of its weapons.

And a light is usually dead after this...

the problem is not the dps its, the instant dmg. If it would keep the dps but instead be a salvo - and there fore work a bit more like a laser, we wouldn't have this problem.

Example, instead of 1 shot with a 4 sec cool-down, it should do 3 shots per trigger pull, one every second and then a cool down of 1 addition second. This would keep the dps but make it more skill base to actually deliver the ACs payload. 6 shots every 0.5 second with 1 sec cool-down would also do the trick.... what ever is more balanced.

[Joseph Mallan]

Nryrony, on 14 February 2014 - 03:56 AM, said:

And a light is usually dead after this...

the problem is not the dps its, the instant dmg. If it would keep the dps but instead be a salvo - and there fore work a bit more like a laser, we wouldn't have this problem.

Example, instead of 1 shot with a 4 sec cool-down, it should do 3 shots per trigger pull, one every second and then a cool down of 1 addition second. This would keep the dps but make it more skill base to actually deliver the ACs payload. 6 shots every 0.5 second with 1 sec cool-down would also do the trick.... what ever is more balanced.

Sorry but one AC20 used to do that to lights in this universe. 20 damage was less armor AND structure than any 35 ton Mech's leg could absorb... and arms disolved just as easily.Our dual AC20 should not put 40 damage in one location without a advanced targeting computer, But light mechs are not meant to me standing toe to toe with something packing the BFGs in the universe.

[Nryrony]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 February 2014 - 07:40 AM, said:

Sorry but one AC20 used to do that to lights in this universe. 20 damage was less armor AND structure than any 35 ton Mech's leg could absorb... and arms disolved just as easily.Our dual AC20 should not put 40 damage in one location without a advanced targeting computer, But light mechs are not meant to me standing toe to toe with something packing the BFGs in the universe.

True from a TT viewpoint, how does it fit into a 12 vs 12 pvp game, especially into something like skirmish mode?

BTW lasers too function differently in TT, if an AC20 does instant full dmg my lasers should to the same...

Edited by Nryrony, 14 February 2014 - 08:34 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Nryrony, on 14 February 2014 - 08:32 AM, said:

True from a TT viewpoint, how does it fit into a 12 vs 12 pvp game, especially into something like skirmish mode?

it feels like a good old fashion AC20.

Being honest I haven't used my Jager 40 in a while but the AC20 on my (F)Atlas feels pretty powerful still and I would like for it to remain that way please.

[Nryrony]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 February 2014 - 08:35 AM, said:

it feels like a good old fashion AC20.

Being honest I haven't used my Jager 40 in a while but the AC20 on my (F)Atlas feels pretty powerful still and I would like for it to remain that way please.

And I would like not to be a one shot from an AC40 Jager doing a reflex shot.

I don't want to rob you of your dps just the instant death part... btw I too play dual gauss / AC20 and Quad AC5.. and like all of them.

Edited by Nryrony, 14 February 2014 - 08:40 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Nryrony, on 14 February 2014 - 08:39 AM, said:

And I would like not to be a one shot from an AC40 Jager doing a reflex shot.

I don't want to rob you of your dps just the instant death part... btw I too play dual gauss / AC20 and Quad AC5.. and like all of them.

I don't want the 40 point convergence myself, at least not every time. Sometimes it should be possible, And causing an Instant death... Well it should be possible even probable. It is ok that we disagree, Shows there is more than one way to see an issue.

Also, I have good reflex shooting skills in real life, I see no reason to dumb that down either.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 14 February 2014 - 08:44 AM.

[KAT Ayanami]

Lubalin, on 20 October 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

2 shots from an AC40 Jagermech at like 500m and my atlas has lost 2/3 of its weapons.

This is way imbalanced.

When I bring 1 ac20 on a mech, getting kills is insanely easy due to such accurate damage. Anything comparable has serious downsides. 2 ppcs generate a ton of heat. 2 LL are tough to get pinpoint accuracy. And that's just comparable to a single ac20.

2x ac20 is out of control. 40 damage, pinpoint accuracy, that works at such a long range is way too much. A mech shouldn't be able to fire 2 at once so often without overheating.

Ac20 needs a more drastic range limitation and a huge heat penalty when firing more than 1.

Oh, and L2P, kill at range, don't get close, etc. is true, but tactics don't fix poor balance. Cheers.

Please avoid EXAGERATIONS when trying to make your point.

It kills your post because people will start talking about "what a lie it is", or "how is that possible" instead of listening to your crying.

AC20s cannot be dropped any lower that what they are now... seriously.

[DONTOR]

You sir may need to invest in more armor.

[PhoenixFire55]

Oni Ralas, on 20 October 2013 - 01:43 PM, said:

@ that range, it would have done 20dmg pinpoint. How in the hell did that crit out an atlas?

2 armor rear? ...

[Nryrony]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 February 2014 - 08:43 AM, said:

I don't want the 40 point convergence myself, at least not every time. Sometimes it should be possible, And causing an Instant death... Well it should be possible even probable. It is ok that we disagree, Shows there is more than one way to see an issue.

Also, I have good reflex shooting skills in real life, I see no reason to dumb that down either.

I don't mind good reflexes, but I think it should take a little more skill to deliver the full payload on the spot, or at least give your enemy a split second time to spread the dmg and make the AC 20 and especially the AC40 less pop style.

If you have to stay on target like a laser, I would take more skill to do an instant kill vs a light and make it a bit more fair.

[Joseph Mallan]

Nryrony, on 14 February 2014 - 10:32 AM, said:

I don't mind good reflexes, but I think it should take a little more skill to deliver the full payload on the spot, or at least give your enemy a split second time to spread the dmg and make the AC 20 and especially the AC40 less pop style.

If you have to stay on target like a laser, I would take more skill to do an instant kill vs a light and make it a bit more fair.

Sorry man, Light mech, Light Armor v Heavy Weapon. Light mechs fold quickly under heavy weapon fire it is just a fact. One that needs to stand the test of a new generation I think. AC20 and gauss have been punishing light Mechs with lucky shots for going on 30 years.We doubled armore to limit it, and we have exactly 1 3/4 Builds that can successfully instagib Lights. I think that is saying alot, considering I had something like 20 builds on TT that could do it... Heck the Thunder Hawk & Devastator could do it. A Hunchback, Marauder & Caesar all could wreck a Light in a single turn. And thats just off the top my head.

[Rebas Kradd]

MERC Mournblade, on 14 February 2014 - 02:38 AM, said:

I understand that 40 pinpoint damage is a bit much, but Jagers do have distinct weaknesses that can be exploited.

Yes and no. I would like to see more flanks, pincers, and lance warfare than we have now, and if we did, I think most meta mechs would be less popular than they are. But right now, this is a blob warfare game with no communication. There are 12 enemy mechs on the field with very high damage output. You just die too quickly. There is very little in the game right now to either enable or encourage maneuvering and tactics, and while this makes it easy for the AC40s, it's also partially BECAUSE of the AC40s. It's a vicious cycle.

[Joseph Mallan]

Rebas I have my best games when able to manuver specially with a Jager40. weaving between buildings to put the hurt on an enemy Mech... Good times.