95 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Or decrease the range of AC5s!

[Thorqemada]

Soften the Range Limits - same min and max range rules as for any other weapon.
If used on Targets to Close splash damage on own Mech.
After burntime of the Missile Engine ballistic flight and detonation at impact.
Of xourse the speed needs to be upped to 200 or 250 - less maneuverability.

[MasterErrant]

Otto Cannon, on 22 October 2013 - 12:16 AM, said:

They wouldn't be too bad as a suppression tool if it weren't for the fact that any ECM on the enemy team turns them into a waste of tonnage. TAG isn't the answer because if you can paint your target with a laser you could have shot it with a PPC instead for vastly better effect. I think if direct fired LRMs were much faster it could make them less of a comedy weapon in direct firefights.

sorry this is fallacious...with beagle and advanced sensors ECM only slows locks it doesn't stop them artemis and tag make it faster in los.

LRMs are badly though out. but the devs obviously favour ACs from the ludicours ROF to the eye watering splash/shake effects as well as the extreme version of "Extreme range". and so the ACs 2,5 and UAC5 dominate the game rather than the 10s and 20s and even the AC20 has almost the range of the LRM. iut's not going to be fixed because the devs are biased want the AC to dominate rather than just being another weapon...

[Joseph Mallan]

Thorqemada, on 22 October 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

Soften the Range Limits - same min and max range rules as for any other weapon.
If used on Targets to Close splash damage on own Mech.
After burntime of the Missile Engine ballistic flight and detonation at impact.
Of xourse the speed needs to be upped to 200 or 250 - less maneuverability.

LRMs 21 Hexes or 630M TT
LRMs already have a huge Buff on range.

[MasterErrant]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 October 2013 - 09:14 AM, said:

LRMs 21 Hexes or 630M TT
LRMs already have a huge Buff on range.

so has everything else. including the staggering misues of the extreme range rules...the range limits in BT aren't limits on the actual ramge the weapons can shoot at but the limits of the system to target effectively.

[Ngamok]

LRMs in PUGs with no spotter are bad. LRMs in a PUG with a spotter is good. LRMs with a bunch of friends coordinating is great.

[Khobai]

Quote

LRMs 21 Hexes or 630M TT
LRMs already have a huge Buff on range.

Not really. Energy and Ballistic weapons got x2 or x3 range buffs respectively. LRMs got x1.6.

Weapon ranges are pretty out of whack compared to tabletop for that reason.

[Imperius]

Remove ECM... fixed

[Ngamok]

Khobai, on 22 October 2013 - 09:22 AM, said:

Not really. Energy and Ballistic weapons got x2 or x3 range buffs respectively. LRMs got x1.6.

Weapon ranges are pretty out of whack compared to tabletop for that reason.

Still, no one will fire them at x2 anyways. I rarely fire at anything over 800m if they have any cover near by.

[Joseph Mallan]

Khobai, on 22 October 2013 - 09:22 AM, said:

Not really. Energy and Ballistic weapons got x2 or x3 range buffs respectively. LRMs got x1.6.

Weapon ranges are pretty out of whack compared to tabletop for that reason.

Wasn't LRM Extreme range in the vicinity of 1000M? I never used that range bracket so my memory is...hazy.

[Mr 144]

Reptilizer, on 22 October 2013 - 04:01 AM, said:

Yes, i can lay some supressive barrage and yes, i can force some enemy mechs to take cover. This is of course beneficial for my team. But is this benefit greater than putting two PPC rounds into the face of an enemy mech peeking over the ridge?
This is of course highly personal, but laying a missile barrage just does not cut it when comparing it to some solid slugs to the face.

Why not do Both?

[Ngamok]

Mr 144, on 22 October 2013 - 09:27 AM, said:

Why not do Both?

Had a match yesterday where a buddy of mime put a few PPC shots into a Commando and then fired off his LRMs as the Commando ran over a hill. Killed the Commando since it's LT was red.

[Voivode]

I think you're failing to make a distinction between mechs running LRMs and mechs that are ONLY running LRMS. People are comparing LRMs to PPCs without asking the question: Why choose when you don't have to?

LRMs do best when paired with other long range weapons. If you pack four LRM15s into a stalker you *might* do a ton of damage, but mostly you'll become an inviting target for lights and mediums. Drop those 15s to 10s and dump a ton of ammo or two and you've freed up enough tonnage for a couple LL or ERLL.

LRMs aren't fantastic weapons in and of themselves, but as part of a more balanced long range build they can be quite effective. If they're you're only option you will get frustrated. As an option among several, they are an enhancement.

[CravenMadness]

And that would be all well and good, if there were a restricted hardpoint system, instead what we have is that extra space not being used for lrms, you just cram in more direct fire weaponry that is guaranteed to hit and has no hard counter...

I enjoy how people say 'Bap and advanced sensor range beats ecm' ... .. Um.. no? It may beat a single ecm out to what.. 250 meters if you have dumped the cbills and gxp into the sensor module ... But how often do -you- run into a single ecm light pack or any team that doesn't have a ddc atlas that, if you get within 250 meters of as a missile boat, you're already dead and it's walking over your carcass.

If they made beagle active probe the hard counter to -all- ecm no matter how stacked within the 150 - 250 meter range, I honestly would have no issues with ecm hard-countering at a distance, and that may also make beagle a tool that troops like mediums would use to scramble ecm and call in fire support during the brawl. As it is, the only people who ever -run- beagle are the lrm boats who shouldn't be anywhere near the enemies at a range required to counter a single ecm.

In my perfect world as an lrm pilot, I would force all my team-mates to cram a beagle in their machine and sacrifice a medium laser and a little armor to do it. Could you imagine? A single ecm mech in a death ball -not- making lrm support completely useless against the 6-12 mechs killing my team before they deign hunt me down since I'm no threat.

Edited by CravenMadness, 22 October 2013 - 10:25 AM.

[Wolfways]

Reptilizer, on 22 October 2013 - 08:12 AM, said:

Nope, LRM60 cat would be a boat for me.
I mean stuff like this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...cf8d9f2c64eee3e

Edit: smurfylink

That's pretty much the same as my Catapult, which i rarely use anymore because LRM's are terrible for direct fire and i hate relying on PUGs for indirect fire

[Wolfways]

Joseph Mallan, on 22 October 2013 - 09:14 AM, said:

LRMs 21 Hexes or 630M TT
LRMs already have a huge Buff on range.

According to Sarna LRM's have an extreme range of 28, the same as the ERPPC: http://www.sarna.net...Equipment_Lists

MasterErrant, on 22 October 2013 - 09:14 AM, said:

sorry this is fallacious...with beagle and advanced sensors ECM only slows locks it doesn't stop them artemis and tag make it faster in los.

Maybe i'm wrong but doesn't BAP only affect ECM within 150m? So it would only help if you had it on a spotter.

[Joseph Mallan]

Thanks Wolf. Shoulda looked there myself. So We have 160 more meters than TT Extreme range. Interesting!

[Otto Cannon]

MasterErrant, on 22 October 2013 - 09:14 AM, said:

sorry this is fallacious...with beagle and advanced sensors ECM only slows locks it doesn't stop them artemis and tag make it faster in los.

Where did I say that though? I just stated that the effects of ECM make LRMs a waste of tonnage. Besides which, even with BAP at longer ranges it does stop you locking because you can't target them at all without TAG, which only works out to 750m. If you're fighting under 750m by holding a TAG laser on someone you would always be better off using other weapons, like a PPC in that TAG hardpoint instead of TAG, LRM launcher, Artemis, BAP....

You waste tonnage on trying to use LRMs when other weapons are vastly better at killing ECM mechs and the team that their bubble protects. LRMs aren't that powerful anyway, and ECM on top of the slow flight means that they don't get used at any high Elo level except as a novelty.

[Navy Sixes]

Reptilizer, on 22 October 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

Cats die from center torso coring. Like, always.

The side torsos are small and the arm boxes are big, so usually they die from CT hits, but I've seen some duel-Gauss ace-snipers that can get at those sides. So I wouldn't say always, and I wouldn't cram an ST full of ammo if I were running an XL.

Reptilizer, on 22 October 2013 - 08:51 AM, said:

But else: Me is a paranoid one. Neither ammo- nor armordistribution is as in "my build" and i also got a different engine size. Take it as a sample for possible weapons loadout, not more

I kind of figured, which is why I asked. I totally understand; I myself never post smurfy links to my builds or share them in the forums. Not that anyone can't find out with a lock on the field, so it's no big mystery. For me it's not so much paranoia as superstition. Just offering advise based on the posted link.

[FerrolupisXIII]

Reptilizer, on 22 October 2013 - 08:12 AM, said:

Nope, LRM60 cat would be a boat for me.
I mean stuff like this:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...cf8d9f2c64eee3e

Edit: smurfylink

not nearly enough ammo. thats almost half what i carry on my LRM C1.

that asside, my teammates are almost always greatful to have an LRM mech covering them. it takes a lot of practice to actually be good at it. as stated previously, that pair of assault mechs doing the circle dance is a great place to have LRM support. bomb the guy and your assault will almost always come out on top, allowing him to move to another target. rinse, repeat. even if your friendly assault goes down you are likely to take a clean-up kill, or the someone else nearby will.