28 replies to this topic

[Wildstreak]

Due to all the MWO Mech size comparison discussions, I decided to get out my minitures of current MWO Mechs and take photos to see how they compared to each other. This was done just out of interest.

Mechs I do not have: Commando, Raven, Cicada, Kintaro, Battlemaster, Atlas. (I think I used to have the last two but cannot find them.)

All listings are left to right.
Phoenix Mechs are from before those images were banned.

Light Mechs: Flea, Locust, Spider, UrbanMech (for fun), Jenner, Locust IIC (for fun).
Locust IIC was because I had it, shows the Locust could have been worse.


Medium Mechs: Blackjack, Centurion, Trebuchet, Hunchback, Griffin, Shadow Hawk, Wolverine.
Shadow Hawk AC5 kept falling off so I lay it best I could on the shoulder it was supposed to be on.


Heavy Mechs: Dragon, Quickdraw, Catapult, JagerMech, Thunderbolt, Cataphract, Orion.
Catapult never stands up without a base and I don't have one so there is something behind it to hold it up.
Thunderbolt arm always comes off due to weight so it is in front of the feet/legs, the black LL is pretty big.


Assault Mechs: Awesome, Victor, Stalker, Highlander.
Victor arms were never glued on so I used a twist tie to hold them, the unseen waist is about the size of the Awesome.

[RadioKies]

I think PGI has done a great job on a lot of their mechs, but I also think that PGI messed up with the Awesome design. That thing is ugly and fat, what happened to it? Did it get obesitas? The design I hoped to see was the one in your "assault mechs" picture. That one's Awesome!
I can't wait to see what they do with the Zeus.

Edited by RadioKies, 27 October 2013 - 02:13 PM.

[ssm]

RadioKies, on 27 October 2013 - 02:13 PM, said:

I think PGI has done a great job on a lot of their mechs, but I also think that PGI messed up with the Awesome design. That thing is ugly and fat, what happened to it? Did it get obesitas? The design I hoped to see was the one in your "assault mechs" picture. That one's Awesome!

Oh god, please, no.

Quote

I can't wait to see what they do with the Zeus.

Yup, me too.

Edited by ssm, 27 October 2013 - 02:38 PM.

[dal10]

RadioKies, on 27 October 2013 - 02:13 PM, said:

I think PGI has done a great job on a lot of their mechs, but I also think that PGI messed up with the Awesome design. That thing is ugly and fat, what happened to it? Did it get obesitas? The design I hoped to see was the one in your "assault mechs" picture. That one's Awesome!
I can't wait to see what they do with the Zeus.

i will never figure out what people see in that mech. it is basically an assault class dragon.

[Deathz Jester]

dal10, on 27 October 2013 - 03:41 PM, said:

i will never figure out what people see in that mech. it is basically an assault class dragon.

If you think in terms on lore related restrictions, and faction loyalty, its a nice mech to have if you're a merc with Steiner shopping options or a Steiner pilot. Another example would be why would you pick a Highlander over a Victor or vice versa. Well Davion doesn't make the Highlander, Steiner does, and Davion makes the Victor even though they fill almost the same role.


Other than that? Its a good solid design [if you aren't playing min/max warrior] and looks alright, although personally the original art makes it look like an evolution of the battlemaster.

Left Battlemaster and on the Right Zeus





http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Battlemaster

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Zeus

Edited by Iron Harlequin, 27 October 2013 - 07:59 PM.

[RadioKies]

PGI Battlemaster:


What I would like to see as Zeus, or a good PGI cosmetic variant based on:

[ssm]

RadioKies, on 28 October 2013 - 02:12 AM, said:

(...)

What I would like to see as Zeus, or a good PGI cosmetic variant based on:

Those look like David White's designs for Mechwarrior 4: Mercenaries.



They are pretty good (and would make fine minis), except so prominent, rounded "shoulders" wouldn't fit in with other MWO desings very well (they are avoiding curves wherever they can).

Maybe scaling them down a little would help?

Edited by ssm, 29 October 2013 - 06:39 AM.

[Karl Streiger]

tt miniature and scale doesn't work.
my 35t Hollander is as big as my Atlas but for the arms and legs
same atlas is only hip height for my 80t Warlord

[ssm]

Karl Streiger, on 28 October 2013 - 08:24 AM, said:

tt miniature and scale doesn't work.
my 35t Hollander is as big as my Atlas but for the arms and legs
same atlas is only hip height for my 80t Warlord

QFT

This chart shows how volume (cc/ton) of minis changed over the years:


Lines show how scale creeped over weight classes.

At this point it's just like everything associated with BT minis - a mess nobody bothers to clean up, in fear of BT diehards full of righteous anger descending upon CGL/IWM for "ruining" "their" game.

Edited by ssm, 29 October 2013 - 05:40 AM.

[Ridersofdoom]

Quote

I think PGI has done a great job on a lot of their mechs, but I also think that PGI messed up with the Awesome design. That thing is ugly and fat, what happened to it? Did it get obesitas?

Yep PGI killed a Awesome mech, the mw4 version had a beautiful stealthy look.

Edited by Ridersofdoom, 29 October 2013 - 07:46 AM.

[Adridos]

Ridersofdoom, on 29 October 2013 - 07:44 AM, said:

Yep PGI killed a Awesome mech, the mw4 version had a beautiful stealthy look.

You've got a pretty good sense of humor. Stealthy Awesome... you realise we're talking about a mech that is designed around the rule of enemy ******* their pants when they see it level of awesome? 3025 + 3xPPCs + enough HS to actually fire the thing with average fire-rate of a mech in that ti = The ultimate killing machine.

[ssm]

Adridos, on 29 October 2013 - 08:02 AM, said:

You've got a pretty good sense of humor. Stealthy Awesome... you realise we're talking about a mech that is designed around the rule of enemy ******* their pants when they see it level of awesome? 3025 + 3xPPCs + enough HS to actually fire the thing with average fire-rate of a mech in that ti = The ultimate killing machine.

I agree. While I truly like David White's designs for MW4, they sometimes were too conservative - not to mention MW4 designers decided to omit hands/fists etc., which made some of them rather uncanonical (and I like designs that can be translated to TT)

MWO design actually better captures the feel of Awesome - it looks bulkier, strudier and more "assaulty", like giant battering ram ready to swipe away everything in it's way.

(Of course, silhuette like this don't always translate well to FPS enviroment, as we all are aware of)

[Ridersofdoom]

Quote

MWO design actually better captures the feel of Awesome - it looks bulkier, strudier and more "assaulty", like giant battering ram ready to swipe away everything in it's way.

if that was the goal the current version is a complete failure, at this time if you see a AWS in the battlefield you because it's the easiest target to kill = The first machine killed (not the Ultimate killing machine).

[Adridos]

Ridersofdoom, on 29 October 2013 - 11:42 AM, said:

if that was the goal the current version is a complete failure, at this time if you see a AWS in the battlefield you because it's the easiest target to kill = The first machine killed (not the Ultimate killing machine).

That's because of broken game design.

Awesome dies to instant, pinpoint, high damage alphas... but it is The mech doing that. If mechlab didn't give us omnimechs in all but name, the Awesome would be the only mech capable of pulling off the stuff that is lethal to any daring Awesome pilot today.

[Skye Storm]

True right there, The Awesome should be the only battlemech capable of carrying three ppc's in my book followed by a K2 with two.

[Steinar Bergstol]

As always, the problem isn't the mech design. It's the mechlab. Honestly, in my ideal MWO the ability to customize your mech apart from paintjobs and the like would be tossed right out on its arse or at least _severely_ limited. You want a light mech with a big gun? Well, guess you better get a Panther then, shouldn't you? That Raven or Spider ain't gonna do what ya want. Three PPCs you say? Awesome is the name of the game.More armor than you know what to do with? Meet Mr. Atlas. More guns than a barrel full of armed monkeys? Cousin Stalker has a huge collection and loves using 'em.

Instead of mechs having distinct "personalities" customization has always led to the "interchangable gunbags" problem.

And dammit, someone do something about pinpoint accuracy before the annoyance it causes leads to my last few strands of hair getting torn off my scalp.

[CyclonerM]

Steinar Bergstol, on 01 November 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

As always, the problem isn't the mech design. It's the mechlab. Honestly, in my ideal MWO the ability to customize your mech apart from paintjobs and the like would be tossed right out on its arse or at least _severely_ limited. You want a light mech with a big gun? Well, guess you better get a Panther then, shouldn't you? That Raven or Spider ain't gonna do what ya want. Three PPCs you say? Awesome is the name of the game.More armor than you know what to do with? Meet Mr. Atlas. More guns than a barrel full of armed monkeys? Cousin Stalker has a huge collection and loves using 'em.

Instead of mechs having distinct "personalities" customization has always led to the "interchangable gunbags" problem.

1 "like" is not enough.

[ssm]

Steinar Bergstol, on 01 November 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

(...)
Instead of mechs having distinct "personalities" customization has always led to the "interchangable gunbags" problem.
(...)

Yup, you're 100% right. Problem is, customisation is one of the main selling points of MWO (as it was before with other MW games). If we get rid of it (and pinpoint accuracy) the game will not be playable outside of old school BT fanbase, an thus - dead in months.

[Durant Carlyle]

Customization should be based on how experienced you are with the 'Mech.

An example:

You buy a new Awesome, and have never piloted this variant before.
1. You cannot customize it at all until you get all the Basics purchased.
2. Once all Basics are purchased, you can customize the weaponry and equipment only.
3. Once all Elites are purchased, you can add Upgrades (ES, FF, DHS, Artemis).
4. Once you purchase Master, you can change the engine.

That would reflect a more realistic unit view like in the lore, since the vast majority of BattleMechs are stock and only the most experienced MechWarriors are allowed to invest the time and money necessary to really customize stuff.

Edited by Durant Carlyle, 01 November 2013 - 10:23 AM.

[Blood Rose]

Durant Carlyle, on 01 November 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

Customization should be based on how experienced you are with the 'Mech.

An example:

You buy a new Awesome, and have never piloted this variant before.
1. You cannot customize it at all until you get all the Basics purchased.
2. Once all Basics are purchased, you can customize the weaponry and equipment only.
3. Once all Elites are purchased, you can add Upgrades (ES, FF, DHS, Artemis).
4. Once you purchase Master, you can change the engine.

That would reflect a more realistic unit view like in the lore, since the vast majority of BattleMechs are stock and only the most experienced MechWarriors are allowed to invest the time and money necessary to really customize stuff.

A great idea, until you meet the BT noobs. They will see this and think "All that effort for what?" Screw this im of to World Of Tanks.....