330 replies to this topic

[NuclearPanda]

YESSSSS!!!!! My Awesomes are ready!!! Can't wait!

[Carrioncrows]

Thoummim, on 05 November 2013 - 05:07 AM, said:

Pelvis = CT never was an issue for me, since perfect torso twist doesnt exist people are usually always able to target your back or your front side which are much better target than front CT (I just love when jag torso twist, so much side torso to shoot at), but having bigger leg hitboxes will be a real problem for light and medium. The only mech that will really profit from this is the stalker while many other mech will suffer.

And if you walk perpendiculary well your pelvis will be protected.

You can turn your torso a helluva lot faster than you can turn your leg facing which makes it extremely easily to hit. Very few mechs have the arms drop down far enough to even protect that once you torso twist.

I am not talking about being swarmed by enemies i'm talking about fighting against good people who know where to shoot and good people who know how to pilot.

If you are torso twisted away from me and I come up on you and can hit you in the CT even though you are not even remotely looking my direction.

That's wrong.

That's like me punching you in the teeth while your back is turned to me. It doesn't make sense.

It is why I created a entire thread labeled "INTELLIGENT hitboxes"

But. I am willing to wait and see what they do. It's just that their solution to the problem doesn't reassure me that they understand the issue which makes me skeptical on the answer. Because if they failed to understand it, I did a poor job of trying to explain it.

We shall see.

[Thoummim]

Carrioncrows, on 05 November 2013 - 05:46 AM, said:

It is why I created a entire thread labeled "INTELLIGENT hitboxes"

I read your topic didnt really liked it, making every mech a stalker in term of hitboxe is in my honest opinion an horrible thing.

Speaking of stalker it is the only mech (with centurion) I shoot at the pelvis, in every other mech you can usually have a better area to shoot at.

So I just feel only the stalker will benefit your suggested pelvis change, centurion on the other way will be nerf.

Well everyone has its own opinion, lets just hope pgi make the best decision maybe a comprise is the best thing

Edited by Thoummim, 05 November 2013 - 06:07 AM.

[Carrioncrows]

Thoummim, on 05 November 2013 - 06:04 AM, said:

I read your topic didnt really liked it, making every mech a stalker in term of hitboxe is in my honest opinion an horrible thing.

Speaking of stalker it is the only mech (with centurion) I shoot at the pelvis, in every other mech you can usually have a better area to shoot at.

So I just feel only the stalker will benefit your suggested pelvis change, centurion on the other way will be nerf.

Well everyone has its own opinion, lets just hope pgi make the best decision maybe a comprise is the best thing

If you looked at the pictures I created for the proposed mech changes you would realize it is far from making every mech like the stalker.

This is roughly how the dragon looks now:



See the big nose?

This is the proposed change



Straight on not a lot has changed. There is no crotch CT and the arm hitboxes are bigger.

What it does allow is the dragon pilot to torso twist and intercept that damage on their left and right torso?

Good marksman are rewarded for still being able to hit that exposed CT (None of this janky - shoot him in the gouche nonsense) and good pilots are rewarded for torso twisting.

I get that everyone has a different opinion, but how could anyone see the above as anything other than a positive change? A XL engine in a dragon might suddenly become a bit more of a risk? (GASP!) you'll mean they'll be like risk / reward option like every other mech out there?

XL shouldn't be the norm and should be a risk.

A mech die'n to 70 points of damage because his CT is way too big shouldn't be the norm.

Going for Balance here.

Every proposed change I've suggest is built towards making mechs "Tougher" and lasting "Longer." As i've mentioned countless times, it's not about giving them more armor to make them tougher, but making them tougher because you have to peel it like a onion.

Edited by Carrioncrows, 05 November 2013 - 06:34 AM.

[Haakon Magnusson]

Good news all around, thongs for mechs approved
Appreciate the increase in communication.

Cimarb, on 30 October 2013 - 06:27 PM, said:

Then, having crits to actuators actually cause loss of arm/leg movement, slowed movement, etc and gyro hits cause falling and/or aiming issues, targeting certain body parts would be more worthwhile, instead of the current CT tunnel vision.

Quick and dirty first step, critted arm actuator hits arm lock on.

[Steadfast]

Commence Operation Spider Swating

[Macbrea]

Ridersofdoom, on 31 October 2013 - 05:08 AM, said:

make the game from the beginning and call Fasa.

You really want a game that randomizes hits on a mech if you manage to hit anywhere on the mech and only allows you to fire the weapons once every 10 seconds? This doesn't seem like a very fun game, you want. And has been stated, FASA went bankrupt and closed.

[Rushin Roulette]

Regarding this part;

Quote

Imagine that we've given these Mechs thongs to wear.

Could you please extend it up to the back and shoulders as well? For more detail Ive linked to a theoretical Thong setup for a Centurion or Spider below (including front and rear armour takes).

Spoiler

EDIT: As for not being able to get this picture out of your minds? It isnt really much worse than imagining all your opponents wearing Thongs for the next few matches is it?

Edited by Rushin Roulette, 05 November 2013 - 07:19 AM.

[MischiefSC]

Absolutely awesome. Thank you. A tiny update but it keeps us on track and involved with what to expect - keeps us engaged and excited.

I like the 'thong' idea - this means that a lower torso/groin shot isn't a split between the legs but has the potential to spread damage across legs and torso, which isn't a bad thing. We're all going to have to start investing in more leg armor I suspect, another good thing.

Also terribly pleased at the mechs chosen in the first pass, though... some Battlemaster love would be nice. I want to love her, I do. She just needs a little torso twist so she can turn sideways enough to protect her CT. I'm okay with her being a hefty girl I just need her to be a little more.... flexible. She's a much broader target than a Highlander or Victor and is less maneuverable. Makes her hard to fit in with the other girls on the dance floor. She's so pretty on the inside, what's wrong with helping her learn to shake her junk a little better?

[Butane9000]

Atlas - Meh, probably could have been done later. Dragon would have been a better choice.

Awesome - This has needed one for ages. It's good that it's in the first batch.

Orion - A fresher mech. However it launched with problems similar to the Awesome. Maybe with this we'll see more on the field.

Spider - Can't help but feel this is due to forum backlash over the Spider. I've never really had issues killing them. But meh, each light needs a pass since the Raven got one.

I'd also suggest doing them in sets of weight classes. So a set would consist of one Assault, Heavy, Medium and Light. Since we have so many mediums you could double up on them for a few sets. Ideally the sets would be (first to be fixed on the left):

Assaults - Awesome, Stalker, Highlander, Atlas, Victor

Heavies - Dragon, Orion, Cataphract, Jagermech, Catapult, Quickdraw, Thunderbolt

Mediums - Hunchback, Cicada, Blackjack, Trebuchet, Kintaro, Shadowhawk, Centurion

Lights - Commando, Jenner, Spider, Raven, Locust

Edited by Butane9000, 05 November 2013 - 08:01 AM.

[Karl Marlow]

So we are giving the Atlas a Banana Hammock? Can we customize the color and pattern?

[John MatriX82]

Carrioncrows, on 05 November 2013 - 05:46 AM, said:

You can turn your torso a helluva lot faster than you can turn your leg facing which makes it extremely easily to hit. Very few mechs have the arms drop down far enough to even protect that once you torso twist.

I am not talking about being swarmed by enemies i'm talking about fighting against good people who know where to shoot and good people who know how to pilot.

If you are torso twisted away from me and I come up on you and can hit you in the CT even though you are not even remotely looking my direction.

That's wrong.

Man, I liked your thread a lot, but completely removing CT from the pelvis is going only to increase legging moaning. If they do something like

________pelvis__________
left leg | tiny ct strip | right leg

It will still make it harder to go for the CT in the pelvis, because some damage could end up either on the left or in the right leg, and you should worry about that little ct strip only when you're really up close brawling and you forget to turn those legs away.

I mean, if they do it right (IF they do it right, I expect them to do something wonky nevertheless), the mixed pelvis hitbox doesn't sound that bad imho.

[EoRaptor]

I'm glad that this is being looked at, and hope for good things in the way of survivability improvements for mechs.

I'm going to toss an idea around this I had that may or may not be worth considering: Change how the ferro-fibrous upgrade impact mechs by having it adjust how hitboxes fit together. This would make ferro-fibrous a more viable option (vs endo-steel) and useful outside of the lightest mechs.

This would be implemented by blurring the demarcation between two adjacent hitboxes when ferro-fibrous is applied, providing a minor improvement to survivability but NO extra armour. Instead of adjacent hitboxes meeting in a straight, unbroken line, they would meet in non-contiguous way. I'm imaging a sawtooth, puzzle or dithered seam, where the two hitboxes overlap. No hitbox gets more or less total area than with standard armour, only how the hitboxes meet is changed.

The downside is each mech would need two sets of hitboxes, which increases the workload on the technical artists, and need to be maintained through any model changes or customization. Additional Q/A is also needed for each new model coming down the pipe.

The gameplay goal is to make fer-fibrous more viable across all mechs, and roll in another cbill sink as people switch between upgrades (end steel and fero-fibrous) to tune their mech.

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Oh man cant wait for this fix on the Orion. I have the Protector and 2 other variants that I want to be competitive with so bad.

It is true the Orion is relatively new, but I think they included it first because alot of us have buyers remorse with the Protector and the community waited a long time for the Orion to come out.

Good news!

[Sir T]

Please to give us Raven pilots some leg love?

[SgtMagor]

the Atlas and Big O gets some help. yup yup some good news.

[Darkblood]

Paul Inouye, on 30 October 2013 - 01:38 PM, said:

Clarification:
Remember.. this is hit box tuning. As in when a Mech registers damage, it goes to the appropriate component on the Mech. This has nothing to do with hit detection which is part of HSR and is being investigated on a different development train.

So... will it do anything at all with the spider? It seems to me that shots on that damn thing fail to register as opposed to going top the wrong places.

[The Boz]

Most humanoid hitbox longevity problems would be fixed by unlinking side torsos from arms, so that losing one doesn't destroy the other.

Signed, an Atlas pilot.

[Voivode]

The Boz, on 05 November 2013 - 09:14 AM, said:

Most humanoid hitbox longevity problems would be fixed by unlinking side torsos from arms, so that losing one doesn't destroy the other.

Signed, an Atlas pilot.

No.

The only thing that gives balance to other mechs against assaults is that with enough well aimed fire you can disarm an assault. This game is already full of enough fat teams. This clearly would benefit assaults more than any other class. Just...no.

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Dear PGI,

You seem to have forgotten about the Dragon. You know... that mech with 2 Hero mechs you could sell if it wasn't so easy to core? Of course it may just be that you've decided that the Dragon's model is so far gone that it needs a complete redesign in which case please get it to us soon because the Dragon is cool mech and I want to play it more.

Thank you,

Narcissistic Martyr