191 replies to this topic

[NuclearPanda]

Jakob Knight, on 08 November 2013 - 03:11 AM, said:

And so we hear from another Counterstrike infantryman who can't understand piloting an advanced armored vehicle. I guess my point was totally lost even after being quoted.

The issue is though the fact the module still works.

It can still be used effectively. It still provides tactical information as far as EW capabilities are concerned.

Seismic was too strong to begin with. What I absolutely will advocate for though is a large increase in the effective radius detect enemies/etc. I do not wish to see it returned to its previous "easy mode" function.

[ShinVector]

Jakob Knight, on 08 November 2013 - 03:11 AM, said:

And so we hear from another Counterstrike infantryman who can't understand piloting an advanced armored vehicle. I guess my point was totally lost even after being quoted.

And you failing to understand my point that this non-cannon PGI module had not place being in the game !

Advance what ??? There is a better term for it.. It's called a MECH !...

Edited by ShinVector, 08 November 2013 - 05:57 AM.

[Jakob Knight]

NuclearPanda, on 08 November 2013 - 05:29 AM, said:

The issue is though the fact the module still works.

It can still be used effectively. It still provides tactical information as far as EW capabilities are concerned.

Seismic was too strong to begin with. What I absolutely will advocate for though is a large increase in the effective radius detect enemies/etc. I do not wish to see it returned to its previous "easy mode" function.

It can, but the usefulness isn't equal to the price/investment needed to enable its purchase/use. While I agree making it require the battlemech to stop moving itself is prefectly logical, the restriction of range -and- the additional need for the mech to come to a standstill close enough to an enemy to detect them makes the price in gxp and cbills unrealistic (1/3rd the cost of a dropship in cbills alone?). Most cases where this will be used involve static defense or knowledge that the enemy is there in the first place, making it rather pointless to use this module unless as an afterthought (if capping was a real danger, static defense might be a valid play option, though).

ShinVector, on 08 November 2013 - 05:53 AM, said:

And you failing to understand my point that this non-cannon PGI module had not place being in the game !

Advance what ??? There is a better term for it.. It's called a MECH !...

Non-canon such as super-ECM, zero-weight/crit one-shot artillery and aircraft strapped to the back of the mech, and light mechs that can sustain multiple AC/20 hits without trouble (oh, and heat that only impacts you when you go over the absolute limit)?

I seem to recall that BAP would allow you to spot hidden units, and the Seismic sensor in the original (canon source) game would allow detection of an enemy unit at a fair distance from the unit (200m+) regardless of terrain. This is, of course, assuming there were very special conditions in play that didn't allow you to see every unit on the battlefield at all times -as was the normal condition on the battlefield-.

So, I would be careful about assuming Seismic is non-canon. If anything, not being able to detect units anywhere on the map that are not specifically hidden and immobilized would be considered 'non-canon'.

Edited by Jakob Knight, 08 November 2013 - 06:42 AM.

[NuclearPanda]

Jakob Knight, on 08 November 2013 - 06:41 AM, said:

It can, but the usefulness isn't equal to the price/investment needed to enable its purchase/use. While I agree making it require the battlemech to stop moving itself is prefectly logical, the restriction of range -and- the additional need for the mech to come to a standstill close enough to an enemy to detect them makes the price in gxp and cbills unrealistic (1/3rd the cost of a dropship in cbills alone?). Most cases where this will be used involve static defense or knowledge that the enemy is there in the first place, making it rather pointless to use this module unless as an afterthought (if capping was a real danger, static defense might be a valid play option, though).

Usefulness/value is subjective. Your opinion right now is that it is overpriced. Yes, it's expensive (I never bothered to buy one myself). I think the price should stay the same and the range should be doubled. Then we'd both be happy.

[Geek Verve]

Ensaine, on 07 November 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:

Reading comprehension fail, is all I can say. Nothing more be said (to you anyways).

Bards will be singing of the tears I'm shedding over your dismissal for generations to come.

[NuclearPanda]

Geek Verve, on 08 November 2013 - 08:01 AM, said:

Bards will be singing of the tears I'm shedding over your dismissal for generations to come.

Let's not get too personal with the comments and try to keep the thread about discussion of the "nerf/correction".

[aniviron]

I don't mind the whole "have to be stationary for it to work" bit. That's a pretty reasonable expectation, and a good nerf to a very powerful module to bring it back in line. Weapons fire triggering the module makes it less than useless, however. I'd rather have no module than have one that sometimes lies to me about whether or not there are enemies around the corner. Imagine if capture accelerator sped up your capping 75% of the time, but stopped it entirely the other 25%. Nobody would ever use that. At this point, I'm guessing the only people still using seismic will be the ones who just don't have enough modules to fill up their mechs and keep going through inertia.

[Black Templar]

Thipequz, on 05 November 2013 - 12:31 PM, said:

Realistic? Yes. Waste of 48,000,000 of my c-bills? Also yes. I use these on my light mechs to circumvent mechs and avoid running into 6 heavy mechs which will ultimately destroy me in one shot, if that is an abusive misuse of a good module then light mechs need 30% more armour, having to stand still to check around every corner is just going to make this an impossibility, if realism was the key, then why not have a nuke module that just blows up half a mile radius, as considering the time this game is set, that's pretty realistic too!

Thipequz, on 05 November 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

I am not actually that pissed about the nerf per say, what I am annoyed with is the fact that I could have bought 8 or more other modules that will now prove more useful. PGI give me my c-bills back for the modules and I have no issue

hate to say it, but i always thought it would get nerfed sooner or later. never bought it and i was doing just fine without it. seismic was overpowered in every regard and it deserverd the nerf. demanding a refund for your cbills on spent modules is just plain ridiculous. you should request the same for all the cbills you spent on gauss rifles and ppcs because they got nerfed too. gameplay balance is a process friend and I totally understand that you are annoyed by the recent changes to seismic sensors.

[Troa Barton]

NuclearPanda, on 08 November 2013 - 08:07 AM, said:

Let's not get too personal with the comments and try to keep the thread about discussion of the "nerf/correction".

i agree but that was pretty good lol

[C E Dwyer]

NuclearPanda, on 05 November 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

Dear Pgi,

On behalf of myself and many others I would like to post the following.





This is definitely a welcome change and completely understandable as to why it was done. If a mech was equipped with Seismic, and walking at the same time, their whole sensor screen should be blowing up with detection every, step, they, took.

This is certainly more realistic.

QuackAttack, on 05 November 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

More Applause.

I'll add my own support of the nerf in a far less visual maner

Edited by Cathy, 10 November 2013 - 10:00 AM.

[Mild Monkey]

Nerf or not, this module is still very useful. I mean, seriously, Mr White, yo! Like, totally.

As a light, you can afford to stop for half a sec, in cover, check your readings and then proceed accordingly. Takes some patience? Yeppers, sure does. So? Be patient, always pays off. Nerf was good, still have the module on most of my mechs and using it to my advantage.

Edited by Mild Monkey, 10 November 2013 - 05:14 PM.

[ShinVector]

Jakob Knight, on 08 November 2013 - 06:41 AM, said:

Non-canon such as super-ECM, zero-weight/crit one-shot artillery and aircraft strapped to the back of the mech, and light mechs that can sustain multiple AC/20 hits without trouble (oh, and heat that only impacts you when you go over the absolute limit)?

I seem to recall that BAP would allow you to spot hidden units, and the Seismic sensor in the original (canon source) game would allow detection of an enemy unit at a fair distance from the unit (200m+) regardless of terrain. This is, of course, assuming there were very special conditions in play that didn't allow you to see every unit on the battlefield at all times -as was the normal condition on the battlefield-.

So, I would be careful about assuming Seismic is non-canon. If anything, not being able to detect units anywhere on the map that are not specifically hidden and immobilized would be considered 'non-canon'.

I realise in-order this try to win this debate you have have started to throw out illogical statements.
PGI has already stated that modules (in a way the skill tree) will be their way of adding their touch into the game without following BT TT rules.

I have absolutely no idea what the term 'non canon' means to you.
Why not mention the incredible Speed Tweak and other efficiencies ?

'Canon' source Seismic Sensor.
http://www.sarna.net...=Seismic+Sensor
Tried to find this 'canon source' mech equipped Zero weight/critical Seismic Sensors that you speak off... Wow I can't find any mention of it ??

Guardian ECM
http://www.sarna.net...rdian_ECM_Suite
Hmmmm... Sooo... What do you find about PGI interpretation of ECM that is non canon ?

What I can gather from this.. Is that you are an ECM hater and you do not like people sneaking up on you. Assault mech pilot ?

[NuclearPanda]

Cathy, on 10 November 2013 - 10:00 AM, said:

I'll add my own support of the nerf in a far less visual maner

Thanks Cathy lol.

[Thipequz]

Levon K, on 07 November 2013 - 10:36 PM, said:

Everyone complaining about seismic seems so selfish. You do realize that nobody will be able to use seismic against you, right? I see it as a welcome balance change.

Also, asking for a refund for seismic module? Hehe, did you get a refund on all your gauss rifle purchases as well?

I believe the difference being that a gauss rifle is 1 tenth the value of the module, and doesnt require a cent of gxp to unlock. Plus, I still love the gauss rifle, I really dont understand why they changed it though, its not as powerful as an ac20, and was extremely fragile, so its other benifits were already balanced, but I still enjoy using it, and I can still hit people. Something that should have recieved this nerf was the ac20, as it is significantly more destructive, but thats a whole other thread

The change to the seismic was monstrous, and made something that was fairly valued at 6mil and 17500 gxp (although admittedly OP) worth significantly less, I believe that that is the real issue.

Expecting a refund for this is unrealistic, I agree, but it would provide people some confidence when buying modules and other "end game" stuff, that their money will be well spent, and in certain cases where it is nerfed, then they will still have the confidence that although they spent a lot of c-bills/gxp on the initial purchase, the time they spent earning it will not go to waste, as PGI will recognise their mistake in releasing it in the first place. I think PGI could do a lot for their own credibility (especially amongst the regular forum goers) if they did this in the future, as people would understand that an expensive purchase will be value for money, regardless of how it is changed in the future. Only problem with this is that buffing equipment should therefore work in the oposite way, which would annoy just as many people tis a conundrum

Edited by Thipequz, 12 November 2013 - 07:41 AM.

[Modo44]

There is no "cannon" or "realism" in this discussion. The changes PGI makes after introducing any system are about game balance. Seismic was the one module you wanted first on pretty much anything. It is not anymore. Job done.

[Ratpoison]

It's still the best module in the game and I always use it. How bad are you that you can't tap X and glance at your minimap before continuing? If you get shot while stopping you messed up anyways and deserve it. And crying for refunds? Really? Get over yourselves and stop being entitled brats. Old seismic was horribly overpowered whether you admit it or not.

[Thipequz]

tortuousGoddess, on 12 November 2013 - 10:15 AM, said:

It's still the best module in the game and I always use it. How bad are you that you can't tap X and glance at your minimap before continuing? If you get shot while stopping you messed up anyways and deserve it. And crying for refunds? Really? Get over yourselves and stop being entitled brats. Old seismic was horribly overpowered whether you admit it or not.

I assume everything you say is always right No need to preach to people about their opinions, or insult them for having them in the first place.

[AztecD]

2 ECM mechs will cover an entire team, seismic was the only real counter to ECM

[hoverstorm]

CW coming when?

How long has it been delayed?

How many times has PGI promised us the delivery of CW and failed to do so?

And when the hell is phase I of CW supposed to be delivered?

[Werewolf486 ScorpS]

Never should have been in the game in the first place, another dumb PGI idea.