30 replies to this topic

[paxmortis]

At the moment the strikes have a one minute global cooldown after the start, thats fine.

But the 4 sec. Teamcooldown is not long enough. Every 8 seconds premium module or 9 seconds an artillery or air strike could be used by the team.

In normal games this is at the moment not the big problem. Much of the players there not use it because it cost C-Bills or MC.

But in 12 men games it will massiv used especially in leagues or tournaments. Many of the players using there both of the modules.

After the first minute it is possible for a 12 men team to make a theoretical maximum of 9600 damage (without splash damage). This could be made in maximum 216 seconds / 3:36 minutes.

For this amount of damage the time is far to short. I think the cooldown need to be increase to minimum 25 seconds, better would be more.

What do you think about this?

[John MacAllister]

\sign

I would say one artillery or airstrike every minute is enough. It is a tactical module and not for 3min of constant artillery strikes. With a longer cooldown it is much more to think about when to use best.

Edited by John MacAllister, 13 November 2013 - 02:52 AM.

[Wolfhound3025]

Jep, it seems more Arti/Airstrike-Warrior and less MECH-Warrior in 12 man games at the moment. Thats not the way it should go. Increasing the cooldown maybe a way to bring back more Mech-Tactic.
But how long the cooldown? Thats a point to figure out in Action.
Maybe the number of possible Arti/Airstrikes in one battle should be limited. But how can you control this?

[Sandpit]

So again, I see another thread saying something needs to be balanced because it's "unbalanced" when it comes to 12mans. I'm all for team play, teamwork, coordination, etc. but because something gets used effectively and with precision and coordination in a 12man doesn't mean it is "broken"

[Padde]

IMHO something is broken, when you NEED it, to win games... and that definitly becomes a fact with air/arty strikes...

The modules were ment, to be an option ON TOP, something that may give you a slight advantage in the way you Play your game ie Target Decay for a LRM-boat, Info Gathering for a brawler...

But right now, it fells more like seismic sensor, a module you needed to have (right before they nerved it) to be able to compete in this game.

With a higher cooldown, your statement about precision and coordination would be much more true but right now, the spamming of air/arty strikes feels more like an instant WIN button...

[Sandpit]

That's funny, I've never needed one to win a game.....

Not being sarcastic, just stating a fact. I've never needed one to win a game.

[Wolfhound3025]

Like the Adv. Seismic Sensor was, the Arty/Airstrike are modules, you are forced to use if you don't want to have a disadvantage in battle.
At the moment a specific module becomes a "must-have" for every player i devinitively would say, that something in the system is "broken".

[Troutmonkey]

I've seen a 4 man with one of each completely wreck a PUG team by spamming these every 10 seconds. 1 minute shared cool down for both is completely reasonable

[Storyteller]

I agree to Troutmonkey, Wolfhound3025 and Padde, the artillery and air strike modules are OP at this moment. If you don't use it in 12 men premade teams, you clearly have a huge disadvantage. Even in PUG matches it's very usefull. I use it on a regular base and even with weaker/fun mech builds I m able to deal 200-300+ damage then usual.

So a one minute global cooldown would be the first and most important step for me, but I would also vote for a decrease of the damage, let's say -50%. 40 points of damage with every single bomb is too much, because it will rip your head off if it hits your cockpit section. And this is a random issue. Sometimes you hit the arms, sometimes the head. In a competitive game like MWO this is a bad call, because - lets say - if both teams set their strikes at the same time and on side it kills a mech instant because auf cockpit destruction the other one just loses an arm without weapons, its not fair.

If I loose my head because of enemy weapons fire, that's skill. But loosing my head because of random artillery hits, that's bad game balance.

[Sandpit]

Just my .002 but I think they're fine where they're at now. They're easy to see and avoid. They're only a real problem if you're standing stationary (IE camping or poptarting) and are in a slow moving mech that can't accelerate fast enough to get out of the area.

[Wolfhound3025]

It*s fine? - Lets see:

Fine means not OP
Not OP means balanced
Balanced means you can replace it without any disadvantage

Question:

Would you and your whole company fight without any Ari/Airstrike, even if you know the complete enemy team will use it agaist you?

Still fine?

I can understand, that you have no problem with those moduls. I'm playing a Hunter ingame. Fast and flexible. I also have no problem with avoiding the critical area. But to be real balanced, a system must be fair to all pilotes. - my 2 cent

Edited by Wolfhound3025, 20 November 2013 - 07:53 PM.

[Sug]

Padde, on 19 November 2013 - 12:22 PM, said:

IMHO something is broken, when you NEED it, to win games... and that definitely becomes a fact with air/arty strikes...

Something I thought I'd never hear.

[Sandpit]

Sug, on 20 November 2013 - 07:55 PM, said:

[/size]

Something I thought I'd never hear.

Surely you're not surprised sug? lol

[Sandpit]

"I got killed! Wait, what killed me....? Arty!!! I got killed by arty!!! Well, time for me to start the new OP bandwagon"

Seriously guys, big plume of red smoke, a blip on the mini-map. Do you need to be hit over the head? (No pun intended) It's very obvious when they get popped, it's also very easy to avoid if you weren't just standing there being "elite" as a stationary target that someone got LoS on and popped an arty strike on.

I pilot a slooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow stalker a lot of times and even in that tugboat I have only taken a shot from arty and air 2 maybe 3 times? Every time it was because I wasn't paying attention while standing in a stationary spot trying to be slick or crafty.

[Talrich]

Yeah, something is wrong with the current cooldown. I don't see it often, but immediately subsequent artillery strikes are really problematic. I want to fight giant robots, not off-map artillery.

[Sandpit]

Wolfhound3025, on 20 November 2013 - 07:47 PM, said:

It*s fine? - Lets see:

Fine means not OP
Not OP means balanced
Balanced means you can replace it without any disadvantage

Question:

Would you and your whole company fight without any Ari/Airstrike, even if you know the complete enemy team will use it agaist you?

Still fine?

Yes, it is. I've never needed one to win and I rarely get hit by them. But then again I rarely stand stationary, don't walk into red smoke, run into the red blips that pop up on the mini map, and don't continuously stay in the same general area when I'm peeking and pew pewing

This would be no different than claiming ECM was "op" because it was being used by all 12 mechs on the other team. Just because it's used effectively by a coordinated team doesn't make it "op"

[paxmortis]

What kind of mech you are playing? Because its much harder for an slow mech to escape.

You playing mostly PUG game or also 12 men team?

For the k.o. rounds of the 3025 Stockmech tourney we limit the strikes to 3 per team. This looks to work better for the tourney.

I not wants a limit of the strikes in MWO it self but increasing the cooldown is need i think.

Edited by paxmortis, 25 November 2013 - 09:40 AM.

[Lukoi Banacek]

The people in this thread complaining about arty are actually asking for a nerf to teamwork.

Arty is not a needed module. It is a helpful module. Properly coordinated it can be exceptionally effective. Much like poptarting, ECM or the old fashioned "rush and brawl." But the coordination is what is making it OP....teamwork.

Arty in the absence of teamwork is a nuisance and not even remotely OP.

[Crashingmail]

Then u guys should read this too -> http://www.mechspecs...hp?topic=4796.0
The cooldown need to get increased (and fixed), when a 4 Mech light team is able to get around the cooldown and simultaneously drop 4 Ary or Air strikes on a group of mechs and around 10 seconds later another load.

Edited by Crashingmail, 25 November 2013 - 11:11 PM.

[Daniel Travieso]

Disagree. There is already a cooldown, which is sufficiently irrational but acceptable.